[iFi audio]

Looks like a real contender for the sub $2500 range.

Does the ifi-audio-pro-idsd DAC use off the shelf DAC chips, or do you use the one in delta-sigma D/As?

Thanks,

Reggy.

Please see here:

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/ifi-audio-pro-idsd-the-official-thread.869144/page-15#post-14313133

 

[flyte3333]

After reading some of the discussion you referenced above i wonder if the issue that i have reported in the below could be associated with the XMOS bug. It appears the symptoms are the same ("Every indication here is that the bug is on the DAC side–that is fairly easy to see from the failure mode. The DAC plays invalid sounds, ends up hung, and the entire relationship between the DAC and OS is broken from that point until the DAC is power cycled."
I do experience this behavior when playing via network to the Pro iDSD. However, the issue only occurs with 192/24 files (sometimes but less frequently with 96/24). I have not yet encountered an issue with 44/16 files (my ripped CD's, also no issue when playing from Tidal).
I mostly play via network but have used the USB port with Audirvana playing all sorts of material and have not seen any issue. It is not clear to me if the XMOS issue affects only network play or also play via USB.

Hi Peter, this bug is Linux source related.

Not related to a Mac or Windows source.

And as Kii Audio (who found the XMOS bug and the fix) said:

“If your vendor states its device is not supporting Linux, they are hiding and hoping for the storm to pass. Good riddance to manufacturers who do not stand behind their product, especially when the (not so easy to find) solution is spoon fed to them. In case one of these vendors is willing but incapable of implementing this fix, they can contact me to see If I can help them out."

 

[peterjgross]

Hi Peter, this bug is Linux source related.

Not related to a Mac or Windows source.

And as Kii Audio (who found the XMOS bug and the fix) said:

“If your vendor states its device is not supporting Linux, they are hiding and hoping for the storm to pass. Good riddance to manufacturers who do not stand behind their product, especially when the (not so easy to find) solution is spoon fed to them. In case one of these vendors is willing but incapable of implementing this fix, they can contact me to see If I can help them out."

Understood. I use UPnP but until yesterday my UPnP server was running on Windows. I now use a UPnP server on QNAP which actually is Linux. I see the issues i described whether the UPnP server runs on Windows or on QNAP/Linux.

Whatever it is - there is some issue with the Pro iDSD when streaming to it over network of from locally attached SD/disk. I have better success streaming the same source to my Marantz or Pioneer receivers even though - when it works the Pro iDSD sounds better.

 

[flyte3333]

Understood. I use UPnP but until yesterday my UPnP server was running on Windows. I now use a UPnP server on QNAP which actually is Linux. I see the issues i described whether the UPnP server runs on Windows or on QNAP/Linux.

Whatever it is - there is some issue with the Pro iDSD when streaming to it over network of from locally attached SD/disk. I have better success streaming the same source to my Marantz or Pioneer receivers even though - when it works the Pro iDSD sounds better.

Noted. This is not the same XMOS bug but you definitely have a problem that I hope iFi sorts out for you.

 

[lichie]

Unfortunately I am having a lot of issues with this DAC. I just created an account here in hope that I can receive some support, seeing that ifi looks to be very active in this thread. Please excuse me if there is a firmware fix for these problems out there already! I looked around and couldn't find any on the ifi website but I could be looking in the wrong places. Also apologies if this has been reported in this thread already, but I could not feasibly check all pages of the thread.

First, and the more minor issue, is that often when switching to a new song, the pro idsd takes a second or two to start playing and I miss the first couple seconds of the song. I find that this only happens with high res files, almost always only 24/192. Pressing play again usually works. This could be an issue with Roon but I haven't experienced it with any of my other dacs. This is a problem I can probably live with considering it never happens when letting playback naturally move to the next track, and only when explicitly pressing play to start a new song.

The next issue is a deal breaker and I will be returning the DAC if it can't be resolved with some kind of firmware fix very soon.

When playing ANY file with lower sampling rate, I am getting very audible random popping noises. I am able to reproduce this with both 16 and 24 bit, 44.1khz and 48khz. I have not been able to reproduce the popping with files of higher sampling rate. No matter which file I play, I will get 5-10 loud pops throughout the song at seemingly random points. I have been able to reproduce this on all digital filter and DSD upsampling combinations, including with no upsampling. I've reproduced the issue with 4 different headphones and 3 different amps. Switching out the Pro iDSD with my Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ and keeping everything else the exact same (except usb2 vs usb3 cable) makes the problem go away.

Is anyone else able to reproduce this issue?

It has been a few months since I made this post and I should follow up with how I solved it.

It turned out the problem seemingly was caused by high amounts of USB noise from my computer's motherboard. I eventually connected the DAC to my laptop and all the problems went away.
I purchased an iFi Audio iDefender 3.0 and added that to the USB chain and all the popping problems went away.

 

[bluesaint]

It has been a few months since I made this post and I should follow up with how I solved it.

It turned out the problem seemingly was caused by high amounts of USB noise from my computer's motherboard. I eventually connected the DAC to my laptop and all the problems went away.
I purchased an iFi Audio iDefender 3.0 and added that to the USB chain and all the popping problems went away.

Now that's actually fascinating.. I thought iDSD Pro does the following with all inputs:

1. Galvanic Isolation
2. Buffers, Reclocks and Regenerates the signal

I'm curious with those two operations, how are the high amount of USB noise affects the sound.... @iFi audio ?

 

[gordec]

Now that's actually fascinating.. I thought iDSD Pro does the following with all inputs:

1. Galvanic Isolation
2. Buffers, Reclocks and Regenerates the signal

I'm curious with those two operations, how are the high amount of USB noise affects the sound.... @iFi audio ?

Pro iDSD has one of the best USB inputs. However, if your USB source is noisy, it limits the DAC's upside. I use a dedicated USB card which is powered by the Uptone JS2 LPS which also powers the Pro iDSD. If you want to go crazy with noise reduction like me, you add a conditioner like Niagara 1000 and Electra 7 power cables. For noise, it's not just how quiet the background is. It also has to do with all analog signals are converted through your chain. Noise can distort the wave form since all digital signals are not perfect sine waves. They are actually square waves which the DAC has to interpret into sine waves.

 

[flyte3333]

It has been a few months since I made this post and I should follow up with how I solved it.

It turned out the problem seemingly was caused by high amounts of USB noise from my computer's motherboard. I eventually connected the DAC to my laptop and all the problems went away.
I purchased an iFi Audio iDefender 3.0 and added that to the USB chain and all the popping problems went away.

Did you need iDefender 3.0 with the laptop for all problems to go away?

Or does the laptop alone as USB source make all the problems go away?

 

[bluesaint]

Did you need iDefender 3.0 with the laptop for all problems to go away?

Or does the laptop alone as USB source make all the problems go away?

if he used iDefender and worked means he has a ground related noise issue since thats what iDefender 3.0 do. IFI already made it clear in earlier postings that upstream tweaks related to Rebalance/clock/generate won't do anything for the iDSD Pro as those concepts are built from the grounds up into the iDSD Pro. So the only thing that it doesn't solve is ground related noise which iDefender seems to take care of.

 

[flyte3333]

So the only thing that it doesn't solve is ground related noise

Pro iDSD's USB input isolates the USB ground.. that's part of what USB galvanic isolation involves...

The report of pops MAY (or not) mean this is something different to you what you're talk about...

 

[lichie]

if he used iDefender and worked means he has a ground related noise issue since thats what iDefender 3.0 do. IFI already made it clear in earlier postings that upstream tweaks related to Rebalance/clock/generate won't do anything for the iDSD Pro as those concepts are built from the grounds up into the iDSD Pro. So the only thing that it doesn't solve is ground related noise which iDefender seems to take care of.

Yeah, I was already aware that I had this ground noise problem. It has caused me problems with some dacs in the past (especially schiit dacs). I already owned the iDefender because of this. What was strange with the iDSD was the way the problem manifested. With some other DAC (like the schiit dacs) I can immediately tell there is a problem because I can hear the ground noise hum through the dac at all times, even with no music playing. But with the iDSD there was no sign of any noise or any problems until you started playing music (and only 44khz/48khz files). And even then there was no noise (even with the output level low), but just small pops every now and then.

Again, I don't really consider it a flaw with the DAC, but it definitely made it hard to figure out the problem.

 

[iFi audio]

Now that's actually fascinating.. I thought iDSD Pro does the following with all inputs:

1. Galvanic Isolation
2. Buffers, Reclocks and Regenerates the signal

I'm curious with those two operations, how are the high amount of USB noise affects the sound.... @iFi audio ?

The iDSD Pro can be effected by packet errors the same way any USB device can. However, it is not affected by:

• noise on the USB power (it does not use USB power)
• ground/earth loops via USB or other inputs (because it uses galvanic isolation)

 

[iFi audio]

Also, we have just released a short but sweet guide about MQA via SPDIF on Pro iDSD in Tidal. Enjoy!

 

[peterjgross]

The iDSD Pro can be effected by packet errors the same way any USB device can. However, it is not affected by:

• noise on the USB power (it does not use USB power)
• ground/earth loops via USB or other inputs (because it uses galvanic isolation)

If the popping issue the customer reported is a symptom for packet errors caused by noise at the source computer is there an explanation why this occurs only at 44/48kHz, but not at files with higher sampling rates?

 

[gordec]

If the popping issue the customer reported is a symptom for packet errors caused by noise at the source computer is there an explanation why this occurs only at 44/48kHz, but not at files with higher sampling rates?

Have you tried running Pro iDSD straight out of USB port? Does it still pop? At least this would help narrow down the problem.