iFi audio NEO Stream - Sweet Streams!

[JjB067]

Replying to kboung post#89.
For the Zen Stream I mostly used the supplied standard iPower 15V, later upgrading to the iPower X 15V. The Zen then felt only slightly warm to the touch even after many hours use. One feature that I thought affected this matter was how many services were enabled inside Volumio, turning unused ones off seemed to reduce the case temperature. The new Neo Stream with the same iPower X 15V feels quite cool, a bit lower than the Zen I think. I have turned off all unused services in the Neo as well, incidentally I have only used the AI0 all-in-one mode. Also I am using the Neo is its vertical orientation on its stand, so it is not stacked on any other gear, this may help keep the temperature down. As regards the internal DAC, I am also curious and will compare to other DACs I have to hand, although without room correction as I will then be comparing analog outputs rather than digital

 

[kboung]

Replying to kboung post#89.
For the Zen Stream I mostly used the supplied standard iPower 15V, later upgrading to the iPower X 15V. The Zen then felt only slightly warm to the touch even after many hours use. One feature that I thought affected this matter was how many services were enabled inside Volumio, turning unused ones off seemed to reduce the case temperature. The new Neo Stream with the same iPower X 15V feels quite cool, a bit lower than the Zen I think. I have turned off all unused services in the Neo as well, incidentally I have only used the AI0 all-in-one mode. Also I am using the Neo is its vertical orientation on its stand, so it is not stacked on any other gear, this may help keep the temperature down. As regards the internal DAC, I am also curious and will compare to other DACs I have to hand, although without room correction as I will then be comparing analog outputs rather than digital

Thank you so much for the quick reply!!

 

[Zaurux]

... So I updated to the new version in the usual System page manner in Volumio and voila all the rebooting issues vanished entirely. No issues at all now, artwork loads correctly, no stutters or reboots, been working flawlessly since yesterday afternoon. So if you get the Neo, remember to update the software version before anything else!
...

So it's basically the same software environment (Volumio).
Have you tried logging in with ssh in a terminal to check software versions or configuration?

Like this (on Zen Stream) :

             ____ _____
                          /\  ___ ___\
                       _  \ \ \___ __/   _
                      /\_\ \ \ \__ ___  /\_\
                      \/\ \ \ \ \__ __\ \/\ \
                       \ \ \ \ \ \__ _/  \ \ \
                        \ \_\ \ \_\       \ \_\
                         \/_/  \/_/        \/_/

               IFi Streamer Music Player - Version 1.0

                  Powered by Volumio - volumio.org

Volumio Debian GNU/Linux comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY, to the extent
permitted by applicable law.
volumio@ifi:~$ uname -a
Linux ifi 4.4.167+ #37 SMP Thu Aug 12 12:25:19 CST 2021 aarch64 GNU/Linux
volumio@ifi:~$

 

[panoptikon]

I assume there is no problem at all to have a switch upstream from the Optibox? I have an English Electric 8switch.

 

[JjB067]

Replying to post #93. It is indeed the standard Volumio that we got used to with the Zen, identical as far as I can see. Unfortunately I know nothing about ssh, sounds beyond my computer experience. Maybe iFi Audio can comment on the software and whether some new flavour will occur for the Neo ?

 

[JjB067]

Replying to post#94 : The supplied Optibox takes a standard RJ45 ethernet cable as input and outputs an optical version of same, then connect to Optical SC port on the rear of the Neo with the supplied optical cable, about 1m in length by the way. The Optibox also needs 5V 1A DC, there is a supplied charger plug and USB A-C cable, again about 1m long. I have tried the optical and the conventional RJ45 connections on the Neo, it seems to detect activity on its ethernet inputs and switch accordingly without any user involvement. Upstream I have just a standard BT router, so your switch should not cause any issues to the Optibox I think.

 

[kboung]

I noticed the neo stream spec states Power consumption
"<0.5W idle, 14W max"

whereas on zen stream it is
"No Signal ~6W, Max Signal ~10W"

@iFi audio, does this mean neo stream is cooler during idle state or is it a typo?

 

[bagwell359]

Just as with the Zen stream, this bleeding edge product is using its initial customer base as beta testers. Cool when you're bought into that.

But as a user now into the later half of my 60's - no thank you. I'll ride my v40 until it's dead, then see what the velocity of complaints vs solutions is at. I'm hopeful - inside of year it'll be relatively stable or the Zen will be upgraded and stable (OK, six months after release of the Zen).

The value proposition with this brand is high but don't be fooled - part of the savings is by passing testing costs on to consumers. Software since the mid 1980's has many examples of this - from M$, Apple, Sun, Red Hat, Mentor Graphics, and so many more - in fact I can't think of a substantial software brand that this is not true for in my professional experience.

 

[ctrlm]

New Head-Fi user here, thought I would give my experience of the new iFi Neo Stream which I received a few days ago. I have used the original iFi Zen Stream since it was launched last year, and am quite impressed with the sound quality of that device. Would the new Neo be even better ?

Just a few words about the rest of my system. I usually use the USB Audio Out of either streamer, put it through a Denafrips IRIS DDC and feed via AES into a miniDSP SHD Studio all-digital room correction box employing full range Dirac Live 3. This is a great box and makes a big difference to the room sound, lots of digital input options possible. The room corrected coaxial output from this box then drives the DAC used in these tests, namely the RME ADI-2 FS with an MCRU LPS as power supply. Compared to the standard SMPS supplied with the DAC, the sound is bigger with more dynamics and even detail, quite noticeable improvement. The analog out over XLR balanced cable then feeds a pre/power combo from Denafrips, the Hestia/Hyperion. Speakers are the Wharfedale EVO 4.3 floorstanders. With this system, the original iFi Zen Stream as source sounds very good indeed.

First impressions on the Neo Stream as a device : quite compact elegant device with a dinky colour screen which shows artwork not just from local FLAC library (my usual source) but also when using Spotify Connect. Rear panel bristles with lots of inputs and outputs, the new Optical SC fiberoptic LAN connection fed from the supplied Optibox Transceiver works very well. Just remember to remove the plastic covers from the fiberoptic ends and orient correctly before insertion. Connection feels solid especially compared with the TOSLINK style connectors. The supplied SMPS power supply was the iPowerX 9V 2.5A. So I used the USBA connections on the rear to connect my FLAC library (top port, 1Tb Sandisk SSD), lower port is the USB AUDIO OUT. There is also a front panel USBC bidirectional port but I have not tried this yet. The Neo has 3 main operational modes : Analog (using inbuilt Burr Brown DAC), Digital, USB Audio. You select these on the unit itself by pressing the settings button then the volume knob to select and activate an option. You can also switch between these options inside the control software (app or direct into Web page method), the interface is the well known Volumio identical to that for controlling the Zen Stream. The supplied software version was 2.15.8, but see below. One thing that became obvious quite quickly was that the device ran quite warm. Also occasionally the art work would not load to the screen, but more worryingly some stutter occurred on music playback. Worse still this then developed into the device randomly rebooting, the problems seemed to mount as time progressed. I have never seen any such issues with the older Zen Stream.

So wondering about the temperature of the unit, I decided to switch out the supplied SMPS for an iPowerX rated for 15V 1.5A, this was previously powering up my Zen Stream. This certainly resulted in cooler unit operation. Unfortunately the random rebooting issues did not dissappear. After a soft factory reset (inside Volumio not the rear panel hard button), no change unfortunately. At this stage I tried the SPDIF coaxial digital out rather than USB, this straight into SHD Studio with no intervening DDC, this sounded a little bit sharper but still the random reboots continued randomly during playback. Next step was to raise a support ticket with iFi Audio. They replied promptly and informed me that a new software version was just available that day (yesterday v2.15.13). So I updated to the new version in the usual System page manner in Volumio and voila all the rebooting issues vanished entirely. No issues at all now, artwork loads correctly, no stutters or reboots, been working flawlessly since yesterday afternoon. So if you get the Neo, remember to update the software version before anything else!

How does it sound? Well it sounds very good indeed to my ear but the Zen Stream was also very good it has to be remembered. Overall I would say the overall feeling is that the two streamers sound quite similar maybe identical. However after listening for a while, I got the feeling that there were some subtle improvements in overall clarity with the Neo over the Zen. When listening via Spotify Connect, this felt even stronger, I am a bit amazed that Spotify sounds this good really. So quite close between the two streamers, with the Neo having a possible uptick in overall clarity would be my summary.

So small apparent differences, could be placebo as I want to hear a difference given the cost? I think I will proceed to listen to the two streamers side by side and arrange a more A/B comparison with as short as possible switching time between sources. Overall I like the new streamer a lot in overall design and features. Slightly disappointed that the Volumio software interface has not been altered or improved, but as long as it works OK then we should not complain too much. Hope these first impressions help others with their purchasing decision.

Thanks for the write up, mine is arriving next Monday.

I too use digital room correction in my speaker setup via a MiniDSP DDRC-22D and I already use a ZEN Stream as a dedicated NAA in my desktop headphone setup. So I will be trying the NEO Stream in three different scenarios, one with and two without using the internal DAC:

1. Living Room Speaker Setup: NEO Stream (ethernet) > AES EBU to DDRC-22D > AES EBU to Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE DAC > MF M6 500i integrated amp > B&W 803D speakers
2. Desktop Headphone Setup: M1 MacBook Air > HQ Player > WiFi to NEO Stream (NAA) > Holo Audio Azure headphone amp
3. Living Room Headphone Setup: M1 MacBook Air > HQ Player > ethernet LAN or WiFi to NEO Stream (NAA) > Holo Audio Spring 3 DAC > Violectric HPA V550 headphone amp

I will compare straight ethernet LAN to optical LAN in scenario 1 & 3.

I already use an iFi ZEN DAC Signature V2 with the ZEN Stream as an NAA in my desktop setup and whilst I'm not expecting to hear any real difference in this scenario, it will be interesting to compare anyway.

I currently use my trusty Auralic Aries Femto as the streamer powered by an Uptone JS-2 in my speaker setup and the MacBook Air via USB to the Spring 3 in the living room headphone setup. The only reason I don't currently use the ZEN Stream in the living room headphone setup, is the 384kHz limitation in upsampling to the Spring 3 and the NEO will at least give me 768kHz.

So once I've tried all of the above, I will give my impressions. Should take about a month or so -

 

[Vitor Goncalves]

The not so funny thing about the marketing of this product is the fact that iFi decided to market the worst trait of this device as its main asset - the software interface. Freedom to use whatever platform you like. Really? I've been using the Zen Stream for 9 months and like it very much. This is a product that has over time received much deserved recognition for its sound qualities and very widespread criticism for a very poor software interface and, supposedly, operational problems. I wouldn't trade it for a Bluesound Node because the Zen Stream offers better sound quality. I use Roon and have used Tidal Connect in the past, both without any issues. However, I could use both with the Node and for those who want an easy to use and bullet-proof navigation system, with seamingless integration to just about any streaming service on the planet, the Node, just as a bunch of other products, offers BluOS. Why on earth iFi came to the conclusion that this was an advantage of the Neo Stream? It is not. The advantage is sound quality, assuming it is at least as good as the Zen Stream. But know we're looking at 1,300 Euros, not 400. So, what are the real improvements of the Neo Stream? Is this the Zen Stream with a DAC? Is it better? How?

 

[Clemmaster]

New Head-Fi user here, thought I would give my experience of the new iFi Neo Stream which I received a few days ago. I have used the original iFi Zen Stream since it was launched last year, and am quite impressed with the sound quality of that device. Would the new Neo be even better ?

Just a few words about the rest of my system. I usually use the USB Audio Out of either streamer, put it through a Denafrips IRIS DDC and feed via AES into a miniDSP SHD Studio all-digital room correction box employing full range Dirac Live 3. This is a great box and makes a big difference to the room sound, lots of digital input options possible. The room corrected coaxial output from this box then drives the DAC used in these tests, namely the RME ADI-2 FS with an MCRU LPS as power supply. Compared to the standard SMPS supplied with the DAC, the sound is bigger with more dynamics and even detail, quite noticeable improvement. The analog out over XLR balanced cable then feeds a pre/power combo from Denafrips, the Hestia/Hyperion. Speakers are the Wharfedale EVO 4.3 floorstanders. With this system, the original iFi Zen Stream as source sounds very good indeed.

First impressions on the Neo Stream as a device : quite compact elegant device with a dinky colour screen which shows artwork not just from local FLAC library (my usual source) but also when using Spotify Connect. Rear panel bristles with lots of inputs and outputs, the new Optical SC fiberoptic LAN connection fed from the supplied Optibox Transceiver works very well. Just remember to remove the plastic covers from the fiberoptic ends and orient correctly before insertion. Connection feels solid especially compared with the TOSLINK style connectors. The supplied SMPS power supply was the iPowerX 9V 2.5A. So I used the USBA connections on the rear to connect my FLAC library (top port, 1Tb Sandisk SSD), lower port is the USB AUDIO OUT. There is also a front panel USBC bidirectional port but I have not tried this yet. The Neo has 3 main operational modes : Analog (using inbuilt Burr Brown DAC), Digital, USB Audio. You select these on the unit itself by pressing the settings button then the volume knob to select and activate an option. You can also switch between these options inside the control software (app or direct into Web page method), the interface is the well known Volumio identical to that for controlling the Zen Stream. The supplied software version was 2.15.8, but see below. One thing that became obvious quite quickly was that the device ran quite warm. Also occasionally the art work would not load to the screen, but more worryingly some stutter occurred on music playback. Worse still this then developed into the device randomly rebooting, the problems seemed to mount as time progressed. I have never seen any such issues with the older Zen Stream.

So wondering about the temperature of the unit, I decided to switch out the supplied SMPS for an iPowerX rated for 15V 1.5A, this was previously powering up my Zen Stream. This certainly resulted in cooler unit operation. Unfortunately the random rebooting issues did not dissappear. After a soft factory reset (inside Volumio not the rear panel hard button), no change unfortunately. At this stage I tried the SPDIF coaxial digital out rather than USB, this straight into SHD Studio with no intervening DDC, this sounded a little bit sharper but still the random reboots continued randomly during playback. Next step was to raise a support ticket with iFi Audio. They replied promptly and informed me that a new software version was just available that day (yesterday v2.15.13). So I updated to the new version in the usual System page manner in Volumio and voila all the rebooting issues vanished entirely. No issues at all now, artwork loads correctly, no stutters or reboots, been working flawlessly since yesterday afternoon. So if you get the Neo, remember to update the software version before anything else!

How does it sound? Well it sounds very good indeed to my ear but the Zen Stream was also very good it has to be remembered. Overall I would say the overall feeling is that the two streamers sound quite similar maybe identical. However after listening for a while, I got the feeling that there were some subtle improvements in overall clarity with the Neo over the Zen. When listening via Spotify Connect, this felt even stronger, I am a bit amazed that Spotify sounds this good really. So quite close between the two streamers, with the Neo having a possible uptick in overall clarity would be my summary.

So small apparent differences, could be placebo as I want to hear a difference given the cost? I think I will proceed to listen to the two streamers side by side and arrange a more A/B comparison with as short as possible switching time between sources. Overall I like the new streamer a lot in overall design and features. Slightly disappointed that the Volumio software interface has not been altered or improved, but as long as it works OK then we should not complain too much. Hope these first impressions help others with their purchasing decision.

Thanks for the detailed feedback, very informative!

Were you using the original Zen Stream via WiFi or Ethernet?

 

[Mr BubbaHyde]

Thanks for the write up, mine is arriving next Monday.

I too use digital room correction in my speaker setup via a MiniDSP DDRC-22D and I already use a ZEN Stream as a dedicated NAA in my desktop headphone setup. So I will be trying the NEO Stream in three different scenarios, one with and two without using the internal DAC:

1. Living Room Speaker Setup: NEO Stream (ethernet) > AES EBU to DDRC-22D > AES EBU to Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE DAC > MF M6 500i integrated amp > B&W 803D speakers
2. Desktop Headphone Setup: M1 MacBook Air > HQ Player > WiFi to NEO Stream (NAA) > Holo Audio Azure headphone amp
3. Living Room Headphone Setup: M1 MacBook Air > HQ Player > ethernet LAN or WiFi to NEO Stream (NAA) > Holo Audio Spring 3 DAC > Violectric HPA V550 headphone amp

I will compare straight ethernet LAN to optical LAN in scenario 1 & 3.

I already use an iFi ZEN DAC Signature V2 with the ZEN Stream as an NAA in my desktop setup and whilst I'm not expecting to hear any real difference in this scenario, it will be interesting to compare anyway.

I currently use my trusty Auralic Aries Femto as the streamer powered by an Uptone JS-2 in my speaker setup and the MacBook Air via USB to the Spring 3 in the living room headphone setup. The only reason I don't currently use the ZEN Stream in the living room headphone setup, is the 384kHz limitation in upsampling to the Spring 3 and the NEO will at least give me 768kHz.

So once I've tried all of the above, I will give my impressions. Should take about a month or so -

Looking forward to your impressions, as that is some great gear!

Cheers!!

 

[JjB067]

Just an update to my original post on the Neo Stream. Software updated again today to v 2.15.14, loaded fine no new issues to report. Have now also tried the front panel USBC port to connect my SSD disk, no problems. I was slightly apprehensive as this is a bidirectional port and I am choosing the USB Audio OUT, however the Neo seems to understand what the connected devices can do and what they can't. Unit is sounding great regardless of local files or Spotify Connect as sources.

 

[JjB067]

Replying to post #101, I only use wired Internet on either the Zen or the Neo, not WiFi. The Optibox of course only deals with a wired input, so if you want to gain any of it's supposed benefits you have to go wired on the Neo.

 

[Mr BubbaHyde]

Just an update to my original post on the Neo Stream. Software updated again today to v 2.15.14, loaded fine no new issues to report. Have now also tried the front panel USBC port to connect my SSD disk, no problems. I was slightly apprehensive as this is a bidirectional port and I am choosing the USB Audio OUT, however the Neo seems to understand what the connected devices can do and what they can't. The unit is sounding great regardless of local files or Spotify Connect as sources.

This is one of the things I am most interested in, as one thing I think the ZS does extremely well is Spotify. I am not a huge fan of Spotify and am extremely disappointed that Spotify HiFi never came to fruition, and when I say not a fan, I mean the fact that it's not at least CD quality, but I do love the platform, and its functionality.

If I am listening to Spotify, I have found at least for me that using the ZS for this brings me the most satisfaction when I do, I am hoping that if possible the new Neo can bring some further Improvement to my listening, and without having to Click my homemade dial in back to change modes, now done on the front of the unit in the new Neo.

Looking forward to more impressions on this!

Cheers!!