[Zeka]

@iFi audio Does GTO play native DSD files?

 

[iFi audio]

@iFi audio Does GTO play native DSD files?

The GTO is a filter for PCM only. It has nothing to do with DSD streams. So yes, machines with the GTO FW can play DSD natively.

 

[keppes]

As much as we see value in smartphones (everyone has one!) and we believe they are the future of streaming, iFi is still solely focused on audio products. Hence, we have no plans to make a smartphone. Crumbs, we won’t do a better phone than Apple, audiophile or not! We’re sticking to what we know. In addition, smartphones are moving towards wireless. As a manufacturer, we’re concentrating on keeping our products ahead of the game.




As much as we like R2R technology, (it is, in fact, embedded in digital products released in the past under the AMR brand), it doesn’t work equally well for everything. We design our products to be as future-proofed as possible, (MQA, DSD, DXD and so on), which is why we don’t use R2R tech in our gear.
Discrete R2R, especially without laser trimming, or other similar solutions do not perform all that well. The technology itself is trivial, without any challenges beyond the resistor matrix precision (0.0005% precision resistors are required to produce < ½ LSB error at 16-bit) and switches (ideally multiple BJTs on a single IC). Early DACs in CD players were made like that.

(photo courtesy: Texas Instruments)

Fully laser-trimmed integrated R2R DAC chips perform better. We still consider the Philips TDA1541 as unbeaten for a multibit (16-bit chip), precisely because it is not typical R2R tech. It runs on active current steering. This circuitry is too complex for discrete options and it needs many transistors kept at the same exact temperature. This is not really practical in discrete designs.

R2R DACs also have problems with low signal levels, which is what Delta Sigma DACs avoid. Conversely Delta Sigma (including DSD) technology performs relatively poorly at high signal levels in comparison to multibit solutions.

That’s why we prefer hybrids; multibit architecture for high signal levels, (the so-called upper bits of the MSBs), and high speed (DSD256 or higher) Delta Sigma topology for lower signal levels. The Burr-Brown DSD1793 we’ve been using so much is one such hybrid and one of the best options for us.




1. Although there are no plans to tweak the micro iDSD Black Label, its successor (if one where ever to be created!?!?) will be designed with all the feedback from you guys taken into account. We’re lucky to have you and your wealth of knowledge and ideas to draw from.

2. To better the analogue volume control currently inside our micro iDSD BL, would mean a fundamental circuit re-design.

3. Your comments have been noted and passed onto R&D! We introduce them as soon as we can, so stay tuned!

4. We like it a lot, but we don't know exactly which DAC chips we'll use in the future.


(photo courtesy: Texas Instruments)




Different products require different approaches and often also different ‘looks’. Broadly-speaking, we strive to design each product to be as appealing as it can be and we like styling diversity. Audio is funky and fun. Plus, we're no Apple. We're iFi




If and when it's ready

Jesting aside, any new products will take a different tack. They will be more dedicated to portable or desktop as can be seen with the hip-dac and ZEN series respectively. But watch out, for if and when a successor does come out, it would need to be one beast of a devil.




As we've explained in the past, it's not possible to have our Pro iDSD fully Roon Ready as we've already maxed out its internal CPU! This product wasn't designed to have Roon endpoint functionality as this would require hardware alterations. We've found a different way to ‘skin this cat’ in the form of the iFi Bridge, please see here:

Realistically, that's all we could do for our Pro iDSD without making changes inside it.

Nonetheless, we're aware of how important Roon is for consumers, which is why we take it into account in our developments.




Our xDSD was designed to be something else, our first portable product with wireless functionality. As such, it doesn't compete with the micro iDSD Black Label.




We like DAPs, but we like amps, DACs and their combinations even more




To fully address this question we'd have to reveal some of our plans, which is something we can't do until we're ready. However, we're aware of the importance of MQA and the need for some middle ground.






It’s true, we had thought about discontinuing it but customers keep asking for it, so we have made restarted production!




1. As a manufacturer, we've always been into providing our customers with as much choice as we can. Our top of the line headphone amp, the Pro iCAN was designed to be as versatile a platform as we could possibly make. That's the reason why it has so many things going on its front, rear and inside too! Also, many possible connections allow users to get by without adapters. Adapters are never a good thing.

2. Headphones that are connected to the Pro iCAN via a XLR plug can’t be detected. This is why the line outputs can’t be automatically turned off.

3. The Pro iCAN is a desktop product. A remote volume control was what was most in demand at the time. Adjusting the volume is probably the most common thing we do with our gear from the comfort of an armchair. Plus, adding all the other switches to the remote was pretty much a no-go really.

4. We've always used DAC chips that are most suitable for the job we need them to do. That's why the Sabre DAC was a better choice for our ZEN series.

ESS Sabre chips aren’t new to us, we used these in the original iDAC. There are some applications where the Burr-Brown DSD1793 (which we like so much!) does not function as well as it could. Where that’s the case, then we use the next best (subjectively) sounding chip available. The ZEN DAC uses the Burr-Brown DSD1793, yes. But the ESS Sabre chip inside the ZEN Blue has the advantage of eliminating jitter at the source. This is why in this application the ESS chip sounds better than a DSD1793. We needed a chip that could counteract the extremely high jitter (~10,000ps) clocks of the Bluetooth chipset.




I’m partial to German beer and Stoli. Oh and Moët et Chandon.




That's very unlikely, but who knows, perhaps one day we will. Never say never But at this juncture, we don’t see DAPs as growing in popularity which is why we are hesitant in investing resources in this direction.




1. Yes, sampling at a much lower rate cannot describe a transient waveform as well in the time domain. Please think about 24 frames per second versus 60/120/240Hz refresh rates. The frame number does not matter if a picture is steady, however with rapidly moving images? It does!



2. Upsampling cannot restore time or previously lost amplitude domain information. At best, if upsampling to infinity, no additional losses occur. In reality, any form of upsampling is lossy.

3. In the purely digital domain sense, without considering conversion to analogue, any sample rate conversion (upsampling) is lossy and thus best avoided. In a system comprised of a DAC, analogue stages, amplifiers and speakers, the end result from the whole system may subjectively favour the upsampled result in spite of objective losses.

It is a highly intriguing subject and one which needs more hard science applied to it before we can make anymore statements here.




1. If you intend to use the HiBy as a transport and the nano iDSD BL as a DAC/amp combo, then yes, that's how you connect the two.

2. The nano iDSD BL's 3.5mm headphone out is S-Balanced, which means that it'll accept regular (TRS) and balanced (TRRS) 3.5mm jacks.

3. The iEMatch output was designed to transparently provide more headroom for very sensitive loads, mainly iEMs. As such, it doesn't sound different.




We got multiple questions about these items and we're looking into this. Watch this space!




I stepped away from my daily duties as director to spend more time with my family and work on recording and sound reinforcement projects (returning to my Pro roots), which are interesting to me but less so for AMR/iFi.

As an active shareholder, I continue oversee the design and tuning at AMR/iFi along with others. And reply to the odd question.




The Raal Requisite SRA1 is a very unique product. We've heard it and we've enjoyed it thoroughly, however, at this point the item you mentioned is beyond our scope.




In a way it’s not really a question of money, but more about what improvements are desired. Our Pro iDSD shares many fundamentals with the micro iDSD (both the regular & BL versions). The former’s more substantial budget not only allowed for additional features, but also unlocked alternative approaches to analogue circuitry.



Could we make a portable Pro iDSD version at say 1800 USD and without tubes? In principle yes, we could. But would such an item make commercial sense? Now that remains to be seen. If it does…




1. The ZEN DAC is a MQA renderer.

2. Correct.

3. These are LED colors you should see. Magenta indicates MQA and yellow tells you that the GTO filter is engaged.

4. The ZEN DAC was launched with the GTO firmware already installed. Read more about the GTO filter here:

https://ifi-audio.com/downloads/

...and scroll down to the 'other iFi firmware' tab, thanks!

Hi Thorsten

I asked these question in the official ZEN DAC thread but there was no answer so far:

Is the ZEN DAC a full MQA decoder or a renderer like the AQ Dragonflys?
So in TIDAL Windows application should I set Passtrough MQA?
If this option is used can I see the magenta (MQA) colour behind the volume knob, or with the GTO filter installed I can see only the yellow colour?
I ordered a ZEN DAC Yesterday. Is the GTO filter installed at factory or in any case I have to download it and install it after purchase?
Is there any way back if I like the original sound of the device compared with the GTO filter? If yes how to do it?

Many thanks
Andras

So, i have a problem with my Zen Dac and the driver. I would like to install the GTO-filter fro the ifi website. I´ve read the posts #31 and 40, but i am still confused.

I connected the zen to my pc and to my laptop via usb 3.0 cable. Both computers use windows 10. On both computers there is no ifi installation folder. On both computers there is the driver "USBaudio 2" by microsoft, which runs the device named "ifi (by AMR) HD USB Audio". The drivers are installed automatically in "C:\windows\system32\drivers\usbaudio2.sys". So:
1. How can I see which driver / (GTO-)filter is installed on the ifi zen?
2. How can i change the driver manually? I have already downloaded the gto filter from the ifi website. I have no access to iFiHDUSBAudio_dfuapp.exe or an ifi folder on my hdd.
3. Is it possible that the gto filter is already installed on the zen by default?

During use the ifi zen dac indicates green light.

Greetings

Andy

 

[technobear]

2. How can i change the driver manually? I have already downloaded the gto filter from the ifi website. I have no access to iFiHDUSBAudio_dfuapp.exe or an ifi folder on my hdd.

The iFi USB Audio driver doesn't install by magic. You have to install it yourself. You can download it from the iFi website:

https://ifi-audio.com/firmware/windows-usb-2-0-drivers/

Perhaps you are confusing the USB Driver and the DAC Firmware. They are different things. You need the USB driver installed first.

 

[keppes]

The iFi USB Audio driver doesn't install by magic. You have to install it yourself. You can download it from the iFi website:

https://ifi-audio.com/firmware/windows-usb-2-0-drivers/

Perhaps you are confusing the USB Driver and the DAC Firmware. They are different things. You need the USB driver installed first.

Thank you, that was my problem. Now i have installed the USB driver and the GTO filter. Thank you very much

 

[iFi audio]

The iFi USB Audio driver doesn't install by magic. You have to install it yourself. You can download it from the iFi website:

https://ifi-audio.com/firmware/windows-usb-2-0-drivers/

Perhaps you are confusing the USB Driver and the DAC Firmware. They are different things. You need the USB driver installed first.

My hero

 

[technobear]

My hero

Anytime!

(you can just pop my free Pro iCAN in the post )

 

[Zeka]

Soon!

How soon will it be?

 

[keppes]

Does the zen DAC need a power supply with positive or negative polarity?

 

[Zeka]

Does the zen DAC need a power supply with positive or negative polarity?

What do you mean?

 

[iFi audio]

How soon will it be?

I have nothing other than another "soon", sorry!

 

[technobear]

What do you mean?

He means "Does the zen DAC need a power supply with positive or negative polarity? "

It's not stated on the back of the device where one would expect a little drawing.

It's also not stated in the user manual.

 

[keppes]

External power supplies can be categorized as:



AC (Alternating Current)- power supplies

or

DC (Direct Current) – power supplies



Since the ifi ipower is described as VAC, i think, i need an ac-power supply. AC power supplies alternate between positive and negative polarities, so that they „have equal amounts of positive and negativ polarities“. DC power supplies don´t alternate between positive or negative polarities. They are either positive or negative. The power supply and a device have to use the same polarity, otherwise the device can be damaged.



The sticker on the ifi ipower shows that the ipower is an VAC, which uses alternating polarity. At the same time the +/--symbol on the ipower-sticker shows, that the ipower has positive polarity. And it is confusing for me, that an alternating current – power supply, which should have equal amounts of positive and negative polarity, is described as being a positive polarity power supply. Also i don´t know, if the Zen Dac is a device, which needs positive or negative polarity or alternating polarity.



So my questions are:

• Which polarity has the Zen DAC (negative, positive or alternating)?
• If i buy an external power supply, which is not the ipower, does it need to be an ac- or a dc-power suply? (I think i need ac)
• Since usual ac-power supplies aren´t positive or negative: Why is the ipower-ac categorized as having positive polarity?

Sorry for my bad english. I hope my text is understandable.



Greetings



Andy

Edit: Or to make it simple: Can i use this https://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B01I1JEWPU/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 without damaging the zen DAC?

 

[Zeka]

It's not stated on the back of the device where one would expect a little drawing.

What's the problem?

 

[keppes]

What's the problem?

What does the "- - -"-symbol on the picture mean? And why is the ipower categorized as AC and the drawing on the ifi Zen says, that it needs an DC?

Edit: Also, when the - - - drawing on the back of the zen DAC means, that the zen dac needs a DC with negative polarity, why is the ipower classified as AC and has positive polarity?