[kyoshiro]

i have heard from my friend that the CK4 indeed have EQ issues. I guess its not just her then. Im still lugging around my ipodtouch with my govibe magnum which has been very nice but i guess if I aint going C4, i wont be doing myself justice. Must start saving money!
Quote:

I respect your opinion on this but at the same time would suggest that you have not yet compared the two files directly, on equipment that has a high enough resolution. If you have then fair enough, we shall just have to differ on this. (Jitter plays a big part in all this) If you search some of these forums you will see that I am not alone in this conclusion and nor are you. All very interesting.
 
Comparison ? I suppose you mean between the C4 and the CK4. The CK4 offers good value for money for those who do not require the best or cannot afford it. If I did not have my C4s' I would probably be happy for a while but I have found that it is necessary to constantly alter the sound via the EQ functions to get something satisfactory. The build quality is also not up to the standard of the C4, mine has a 'floating' battery! The CK4 has no S/PDIF in or out and does not upsample. The eBook function is crap! There are also issues with some headphones, it only has the 34.5mm socket. Mine has only 8gig internal memory. But still, despite my complaints, for about £120 it's O.K. With WAV files on my iPod (16gig) the iPod sounds, to me, just as good as the CK4 in normal, non critical, listening. All my observations are based on using either player on its' own, not as part of any rig which, of course, will up the total cost. Would you like me to post photos' here to prove I have both players? It will be a pain but if that's what's need , fine.
 

[size=x-small]headfonia [/size]2 weeks ago in reply to Dave.That's what I've heard on the CK4 too, not quite the same audiophile-grade player as the C4

 
 

 

 

[ElCrazo]

Quote:

i have heard from my friend that the CK4 indeed have EQ issues. I guess its not just her then. Im still lugging around my ipodtouch with my govibe magnum which has been very nice but i guess if I aint going C4, i wont be doing myself justice. Must start saving money!
 

Hi, I have not seen the govibe magnum so looked it up and read some reviews. It sounds like a real nice bit of kit! Anyway, the best advice I have ever been given in my life is "KEEP IT SIMPLE" and I apply this to everything. I'm not in favour of using anything which is not realy necessary especially in my audio set ups. Bass, treble and EQ - no thanks, if the music/recording doesn't cut it then don't bother spending good money trying to alter what is. You have an iPod touch ? So do I, and in the past I have  often knocked this as a player but actually if you want to save money and hassle try (if you havn't already) putting some real good quality WAV files on it. Not FLAC, AAC or MP3 then have a listen through some good IEMs. You might get a pleasant surprise. I think what I'm trying to say is I don't see any point in trying to improve on sound if the original recording is crap. Crap in Crap out.
A couple of nights ago I fed my iPod straight into a simple valve pre/power amp and used an app called Tune in Radio (I wanted some regggae for a change) the sound through my speakers was perfectly good enough and surprised me. Not audiophile for sure but enjoyable.
Yes I have my C4s and yes they are the best I have ever heard, they look great (to me) and are very flexible BUT even the C4 cannot make a good sound from a bad recording. Try extracting a track from a CD you like, in WAV,  using EAC it will be in 16/44 so not a problem for the iPod. Have a listen to it on your iPod without using your govibe magnum and see what you think. You might then be happy to keep your iPod, sell your govibe magnum  and save your money. I would always recommend the C4 but not if it means going broke!
 

 

[Papagano]

Colorfly C4 vs. Hifiman 801. I own the Colorfly C4 and the Hifiman 801. They are both outstanding, high-quality music players that are better than any other I have heard.   I also have the Hifiman 602, which is the most portable of the three, but the other two sound better. Have a fine and faithful old Cowon S9 too, but it is not in the league of the C4 or either Hifiman player. I listen especially to classical music and Jazz, and have been doing so seriously for decades. My headphones for listening to these players are the Shure SE535 and the Audeze LCD-2. I use the Audeze for more critical listening. Of course, they may sound different with other headphones and different types of music. They both play lossless formats. There is some concern that Colorfly’s PR makes more of its lossless playing capability than is substantiated, but that has not affected its sound, to my ears. Both units play most of the best available recorded music, although I have at least one high quality CD that neither the 801 nor the 602 can play, but the C4 does.  Both players are easy to use.  The 801 has a user replicable battery. The C4 does not. A great feature of the 801 is that the user can change the amplifier for one that sounds more to his/her liking, while there is no such feature in the C4. However, the latter can be charged by UBS or outlet, while the 801 requires a cumbersome external charging module. The C4 comes with a more comprehensive manual and has more information on the manufacturer’s website. The 801 has features such as “Favorite” and “Cue” which I have not found how to use.  It also has a user adjustable equalizer while the C4 does not, the latter’s equalizer being limited to choices of kinds of music (e.g. “Normal,”” Jazz,” “Classical,” “Rock,” "Bass"). The 801 has a “Hold” button while the C4 does not, making the latter more susceptible to you accidentally changing the settings. The 801 has more gain than the C4, but they both sound effortless. The C4 is a bit longer, slightly thinner and noticeably lighter than the 801. The C4 comes with 32 GB internal memory expandable by micro SD card to 64GB. The 801 has 2 GB internal memory and takes a 32 GB class 4 memory card. They both seem well made. The most significant difference between them is in the sound. The 801 has a richer, warmer and darker sound than the C4. The former has more prominent bass, which though impressive, is boosted, which sometimes muddies the lower midrange. It  has more ambience, with a sound that places you in the mid-front of the instruments. The C4’s sound is less aggressive, placing you a bit more away from the instruments, but not that much, although it has a wider soundstage. The bass of the C4, while not as prominent as that of the 801, does not muddy the lower midrange. While the 801 impresses with general impact, the C4 has a less aggressive presentation, but jolts you with sudden impact when the music calls for it. The 801, an impressive music player, sometimes sounds a bit mechanical, especially when reproducing complex orchestral chords. The C4 also has a cleaner sounding treble. Not sure which resolves more detail. However, in the final analysis, the C4 sounds   more musical to my ears. And musicality, after all, is what these players are supposed to be all about. No machine is perfect, -- especially since cost to make and sell it is always a factor -- but within the limits of normal imperfection, the C4 is the best available portable sounding player I have heard

 

[estreeter]

Quote:

The most significant difference between them is in the sound. The 801 has a richer, warmer and darker sound than the C4. The former has more prominent bass, which though impressive, is boosted, which sometimes muddies the lower midrange. It  has more ambience, with a sound that places you in the mid-front of the instruments. The C4’s sound is less aggressive, placing you a bit more away from the instruments, but not that much, although it has a wider soundstage. The bass of the C4, while not as prominent as that of the 801, does not muddy the lower midrange. While the 801 impresses with general impact, the C4 has a less aggressive presentation, but jolts you with sudden impact when the music calls for it. The 801, an impressive music player, sometimes sounds a bit mechanical, especially when reproducing complex orchestral chords. The C4 also has a cleaner sounding treble. Not sure which resolves more detail. However, in the final analysis, the C4 sounds   more musical to my ears. And musicality, after all, is what these players are supposed to be all about. No machine is perfect, -- especially since cost to make and sell it is always a factor -- but within the limits of normal imperfection, the C4 is the best available portable sounding player I have heard

Papagano, thank you so much for this, and I wish we could sticky your SQ comparison. I've quoted only the part that interests me - as a T51 owner, clearly I'll endure any UI deficiencies for good sound - and I would note that your conclusion is roughly 180 degrees away from Headfonia Mike, but that really does come down to his oft-stated preference for warmth over treble clarity. I find it interesting that, of the two players, you consider the 801 to be more 'mechanical' - again, 180 degrees away from other opinions I have read elsewhere. The important thing is that you have given us another point of reference in the ongoing debate over which is 'the best' - kudos.
 
If I can play Devil's Advocate, I havent heard of anything like the 801's balanced amp modules for the Colorfly - for many, that is pure overkill, but given that you have LCD-2s it may have been interesting to hear your impressions with said module. Either way, both are expensive options but I'm very happy that they are even an option - compare 2011 to 2008, for example, and it was iMod, X1060 or your choice of Cowon players. We are living in a golden age for the audiophile DAP.

 

[shamu144]

Bump for this thread, as I have myself purchased a Colorfly C4 for portable and even home use...I needed an alternative to my main system which requires longer warm up and listening session. I was basically looking for something to have more frequent and shorter listens, while still preserving some decent sound quality.
 
I have to say I am really impressed by this little box. It is not flawless, but takes the portable sound to a level I was not expecting.
 
A few remarks about ergonomics issues: I get a loud pop when I turn the unit on/off with headphones on, so better to unplug the phones first. Also, for some reasons, the compatibility with Mac is not 100% (no problem on PC). Otherwise, the object is trully beautiful and well designed/build. Very little complain here so far (well, I would really like the gapless support).
 
Breakin seem a must with this player and is easily perceived.... After 90 hours, it keeps improving, so give it some well deserved time. First hours the sound was rather hard, but this goes away with some time.
 
The ability to play true high res files is impressive and well worth it. I do upsample all my 16/44 files to 24/88 with a Mac software (Sample Manager, featuring advanced iZotope SRC and dither). I get bloody brilliant results using the "slow" attenuation digital filter. It is possible to choose another digital filter setting ("fast attenuation"), but with high res music, aliasing occuring around Nyquist at 48khz shouldn't be too much of concern. The player is remarkably transparent, while offering a very natural, full and cohesive sound at the same time. No digital hardness at all, unlike iPods & co. A joy to listen and relax into the music.
 
It drives the 300 ohms Sennheiser HD250 II with ease (volume slider between 50% and 80% for me). And it drives effortlessly low impedance / high sensitivity headphones (my Sony ZX700, CAL).
 
Only concern so far is the low end (<100 Hz), which I feel is a bit rolled off and dry, but that is compared to my reference system, absolutely not compared to an iPod. I wouldn't pair it with bass light phones though...
 
I think the performance of this little DAP is mind blowing and just right for the price... It can seem expensive, but I really feel its sound is worth it (and maybe even more than that). It could substitute a full size set up which would cost a bit more of money. Great value.

 

[shigzeo]

The C4 drives 600Ω DT880 with ease as well, but better yet, has almost no noise even with very sensitive IEMs to boot. And, its volume is almost perfectly matched from very very low volumes. If I were into 'audiophile' players and wanted to pay loads extra for a headache of a player that had a few good sound features, I'd go for the C4. But, I'm not, so I won't. It is the best sounding and probably best technically of all the current audiophile players that do not include the DX100 (which I've not heard). 
 
But, it doesn't hold a candle to an iPod and CLAS and decent amp, but it is smaller and more ooh aah worthy.

 

[elfary]

@Shamu144
 
You have skilled ears.
 
Colorfly rolls off low bass when driving low impedance loads. Same Cowon flaw but a bit more intense here.
 
http://www.markuskraus.com/RMAA/Colorfly/tf10/data.htm
 
Thus for iems i think an iPhone is a better choice. Or a DX100.
 
For full sized cans with high impedance it's a fine player.

 

[shamu144]

 
Quote:

Originally Posted by shigzeo /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
But, it doesn't hold a candle to an iPod and CLAS and decent amp, but it is smaller and more ooh aah worthy.

 
Well, that was the point of my purchase: avoid a multi-box solution which is always such a PITA to carry around (from me at least). I had a Meier stepdance at some point, and just couldn't get use to it. I much prefer the simplicity of the C4. 
 
Quote:

@Shamu144
 
You have skilled ears.
 
Colorfly rolls off low bass when driving low impedance loads. Same Cowon flaw but a bit more intense here.
 
http://www.markuskraus.com/RMAA/Colorfly/tf10/data.htm
 
Thus for iems i think an iPhone is a better choice. Or a DX100.
 
For full sized cans with high impedance it's a fine player.

 
Thanks for this info. I find that even with the 300 ohms Senn HD250II, I do get a bit of bass roll off, but nothing alarming. This might change though with more breakin (would like to reach 200 hours before full evaluation). I reckon the manual states that the C4 is intended for impedance > 32 ohms... You could always use IEM with a non intrusive inline impedance adapter.

 

[elfary]

Last year i exchanged some emails with a Westone engineer and he prevented me from using impedance adapters. He went like "...If you really want to ruin the optimal frequency response of your UM3x just use an impedance adapter".
 
I'd rather accept the fact that this device is intended to drive heavy headphones (impedance wise).I'm not the one that would try to offset one flaw with another flaw. Staying away from the first flaw might do you better.

 

[shamu144]

Quote:

Last year i exchanged some emails with a Westone engineer and he prevented me from using impedance adapters. He went like "...If you really want to ruin the optimal frequency response of your UM3x just use an impedance adapter".
 
I'd rather accept the fact that this device is intended to drive heavy headphones (impedance wise).I'm not the one that would try to offset one flaw with another flaw. Staying away from the first flaw might do you better.

 
Good points.

 

[sfh2110]

Hi elfary,
 
I just bought a colorfly C4 yesterday. I noticed a bass roll off when listening with my Westone 4R IEMs (31 Ohms) with the 3.5mm port. This was quite disappointing as my cheaper Ipod and Samsung Galaxy S i9000 (with Voodoo Sound Mod) goes deeper. I dont have a custom eq to boost the low frequency either. 

 
I saw that you posted that colorfly rolls off low bass (<100Hz) with low impedance loads but with high impedance headphones it should be fine. What impedance do you think it should be fine with? I purchased a Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro 80 ohm, do you think that will be fine. Also I was wondering what would happen if I used an impedance adapter with my IEM (3.5 to 6.3mm adapter +75 Ohms). Would that increase the bass response?
 
I was just really looking forward to it. Everything is perfect just this lack of bass is distracting. Any suggestions?
 
P.S. I am yet to use the 6.3mm port. Some people said that it has more power and the sound seems to be better.
 
Thanks and best regards,
SFH

 

[dickywoollard]

I can compare: bought the C4 yesterday from the same retailer (Jaben, in Mong Kok, Hong Kong).
 
With the built in DAC and the really high end components throughout the output is warm, clean, clear, superbly balanced and - for my ear - the best portable I have ever listened to in my 52 years (of course the original ones were crystal sets with a cats whisker, so they don't count).
 
Compared to the Cowon S9 - the nearest in terms of colour and balance - the C4 is a more rounded performer. For classical or rock, pop or dubstep, it play the music the way the artists' master was mixed. The bass is probably a little less banging than the S9, the vocals are so clear you almost wipe the singers spit off your ear. I could hear the batton tapping the lecturn when John Elliott Gardiner was conducting Bream for the rodrigo...
 
Using Bose Quiet Comfort 15, or Sony XBA-4 IE's
 
Anyway
Enough of this - I'm going to listen some more.
 
OH - A question for you guys....
I struggle to find Download Site for FLAC or MP3 320 that will allow me to get my tunes here in Hong Kong. We seem to be barred from most of the mainstream (excuse the pun) suppliers.
 
Dicky

 

[Yggdrassilious]

Every Jaben store should have a large collection of lossless files - 2TB+. If you bring a hard drive there they will let you take some since you bought from them. I know this is a standard practice in mainland, not sure about Jaben HK but it's worth a try. 

 

[spkrs01]

Congratulations on your C4 purchase, and the folks at Jaben HK are nice.
 
I have the C4 and enjoy listening to it very much as it sounds rather good. However, the troubling thing for me about the C4 is the fact that it actually sounds sensational playing Hi Rez files, but in the gaps between songs, there is an almighty crash/static noise which makes it, for me, unusable as a player for Hi Rez music

. 
 
Another thing, the player works better with 32gig cards and no more than class 6. With 64 gig class 10 cards, you can't even get through 1 song without the dreaded ERROR message.
 
Such a shame.................

 

[H20Fidelity]

Congratulations on your C4 purchase, and the folks at Jaben HK are nice.

I have the C4 and enjoy listening to it very much as it sounds rather good. However, the troubling thing for me about the C4 is the fact that it actually sounds sensational playing Hi Rez files, but in the gaps between songs, there is an almighty crash/static noise which makes it, for me, unusable as a player for Hi Rez music

. 


Another thing, the player works better with 32gig cards and no more than class 6. With 64 gig class 10 cards, you can't even get through 1 song without the dreaded ERROR message.

Such a shame.................

Did you update the C4 firmware to see if that noise inbetween tracks was fixed?

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&ved=0CDgQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.colorfly.eu%2Fdownload.html&ei=BtZKUYCAEaiTiAePmoHIBg&usg=AFQjCNHpqRjRv7SAT4EgRPCP_fYxQkWPrA&sig2=mdF7m-KXSsXngb6JNqRCGg&bvm=bv.44158598,d.dGY

prevent noise between music tracks during switching in some cases