[Happy Camper]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lazarus Short /img/forum/go_quote.gif Do not assume that they see you, or are even conscious. I cannot stress that enough. I was almost run over once while wearing blaze orange coveralls, on an orange motorcycle. Really!

Fezmiester, If you had your orange Fez on, how could you expect anybody to pick you out of that. Come to think of it, they might have been fully aware of what they were doing and didn't like orange. There has to be bonus points involved for orange colored cyclists.

 

[marvin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbusuego /img/forum/go_quote.gif Your state, city or county should intall this sign.

The average driver barely notices motorcycle sized objects, and those things often have significant relative velocities and are brightly colored. The odds that they'll notice a stationary black and white sign is fairly low. Even heavy enforcement and stings only affect driver behavior for short periods of time.

Really, the only long term solution is for pedestrians to realize that they are water filled fleshbags in a world of multi-ton steel missiles and to act appropriately.

 

[colonelkernel8]

I almost died tonight as well. I think I ate an entire box of chocolate teddy grahams. This will not end well.

On another note, people are horrible drivers. I cannot tell you how many times I get pissed off because people don't know how the handle a 4 way stop when there is more than one person at it simultaneously.

Also, this is probably my first post in several months.

 

[Graphicism]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmanGeorge /img/forum/go_quote.gif Oh man, I had so many near death experiences looking the wrong way when I was walking around London. I wonder how many Brits in America / Americans in the UK get hit by cars every year.

In England (Which is why I pointed out I'm British) there is no turn on red, ever. If you are at a red light in the right lane and it is clear to turn right you cannot do so on red. The problem here is cars approaching a red merely slow down before turning, clearly not thinking about people crossing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadtonowhere08 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, there is something you can do about it: you can write traffic safety manuals, because your post was unbelievably clear and well thought out/illustrated. I am a visual person, and your picture was extremely well done especially when used in conjunction with your story. Great job explaining your story!!!

Haha thank you, I've lived here now for over 6 months and while never come this close to getting struck I've played over the illustration a thousand times in my head.

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadtonowhere08 /img/forum/go_quote.gif As far as what you can do about the laws and your near hit, I am afraid to tell you that what you went through is common in Southern California as well. In fact, I am pretty sure it is common around the country. Drivers are not trained to look for people, rather, they are only on the lookout for cars and trucks (and that is really pushing the mental limits for many). Motorcyclists, bicyclists, and pedestrians are smaller and less common, therefore drivers are in the mental zone to look for autos only. I know it is not what you want to hear, but if it makes you feel better, you had the right of way

Yeah I'm pretty sure I had the right of way too but that doesn't keep me out of harms way. I wonder if I were too 'accidentally' tap the passing cars window with a life hammer I would be held at fault.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gatto /img/forum/go_quote.gif When I was interning at Disney the light outside the dorms was like that, I almost got hit at least 4 times... and I only interned there for 5 months!

Although this happens all over Florida it could of been at the same light. I live next to the Disney dorms where all the Disney student employes live (Little Lake Bryan sound familiar?).

Quote:

Originally Posted by chesebert /img/forum/go_quote.gif This is how people drive in China. Traffic stop sign is merely a suggestion on what one 'should do' not what one 'must do'. So naturally, red light means 'go/turn when you think you can get away with it'. The drivers in China are trained to drive into a crowd of people expecting the crowd to disperse upon the incoming of a 2ton pile of metal. good luck and be safe.

I've actually seen pretty crazy driving in Spain but have never seen an accident and they atleast watch out for pedestrians, here in the states side walks end, they clearly don't plan for people walking.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlanger /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thankfully you weren't seriously injured. I am a runner and have to deal with drivers not watching for pedestrians all the time. I've had too many close calls and it's always the same. I always run towards oncoming traffic. The danger is when I come to an intersection where I have no stop sign, but the street I'm crossing has a stop sign. Drivers making a right turn towards me will often just roll through the stop sign while looking left to see if there is a car coming, never looking right or straight ahead into the direction I am coming from. Please, please do not do this. You could kill someone, and it could be me.

Thank you and I'm thankful myself, I actually have a route I run (can be seen as the cyan blue line on the left of the picture) but don't cross any major intersections or run on the road. Roll on computer cars is all I say, maybe they will have the ability to see people. And RE drivers making a right turn, exactly, there looking for passing car traffic while rolling forwards not watching!

Quote:

Originally Posted by nylan8301 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't know if there's anything you could do other than to make sure to wear reflective gear and light-colored/bright clothing and try to cross as quickly as possible. I wish there was more to offer, but that intersection is a nightmare. Nylan PS: Don't die.

I actually had a soccer shirt on that is somewhat reflective but it doesn't help, as I say the driver was watching for traffic not looking directly in front of him. Maybe a flashing light strapped to my head would help?

And thanks I don't plan too!

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericj /img/forum/go_quote.gif What you can do is lobby the city council for better control between the crosswalk signal and the left turn signal.

Considering its like this all across America, cars turning on red etc do you really think they would listen to a British national on how they should operate road rules here? If I had my way there would be no turning on red. There would be no traffic what-so-ever in the intersection while pedestrians are crossing. Personally these are no brainers, I kinda feel like they want accidents to happen here, after all more accidents equals more money for the city council.

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaron313 /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's your job as a pedestrian to be constantly looking around for reckless/unobservant drivers. It is unfair, but you will get killed or badly injured if you are not excessively vigilant. And it really can be impossible to predict which driver will break the law. Still, most drivers are not concentrating on following the law, so being a pedestrian is inherently dangerous.

Oh I do look all the time, in fact if I didn't stop and take a couple steps back with my wife in hand we would of both been hit. The driver wasn't even looking forward, he was watching for traffic in C.

I have almost been run over several times, including once recently in Israel. I was so angry that I could have torn the guy's heart out of his chest with my bare hands. Fortunately for both of us, he just sat in his car while I let loose a stream of the most foul expletives I could muster. I was rattled for the rest of the day, so I know how you feel.[/QUOTE]

Yeah I didn't have time to react, it was probably for the best otherwise I'd be sat in jail tonight.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wuwhere /img/forum/go_quote.gif Used to be on red, right turn was not allowed. So to save fuel, they allowed it only after a full stop (like a stop sign) and if there are no cars on the lane you are turning to or more importantly, pedestrians.

I didn't know that, I bet pedestrians get hit all the time now because of this rule... I'd have to argue is it ever worth a persons life to save a little fuel.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbusuego /img/forum/go_quote.gif Your state, city or county should intall this sign.

Too right, here in Orlando though it would need to be covered in lights, flash, and perhaps say FREE in the corner for it to grab anyones attention.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3X0 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Glad you're alive. There's no shortage of oblivious drivers.. I'm one of them.

Thank you, hey well maybe it will make you think in the future? Perhaps preemptive thinking, could there be a pedestrian, I don't want to kill anyone.

 

[Graphicism]

Quote:

Originally Posted by marvin /img/forum/go_quote.gif The average driver barely notices motorcycle sized objects, and those things often have significant relative velocities and are brightly colored. The odds that they'll notice a stationary black and white sign is fairly low. Even heavy enforcement and stings only affect driver behavior for short periods of time. Really, the only long term solution is for pedestrians to realize that they are water filled fleshbags in a world of multi-ton steel missiles and to act appropriately.

Yeah exactly it would go unnoticed... perhaps I the water filled fleshbag should be swinging a medieval ball and chain while crossing the road... legal?

Quote:

Originally Posted by colonelkernel8 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I almost died tonight as well. I think I ate an entire box of chocolate teddy grahams. This will not end well. On another note, people are horrible drivers. I cannot tell you how many times I get pissed off because people don't know how the handle a 4 way stop when there is more than one person at it simultaneously. Also, this is probably my first post in several months.

And the entire box of chocolate teddy grahams led to you surfing head-fi, sorry about your wallet... again

 

[wuwhere]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graphicism /img/forum/go_quote.gif I didn't know that, I bet pedestrians get hit all the time now because of this rule... I'd have to argue is it ever worth a persons life to save a little fuel.

This was back in the '70s oil crisis when the speed limit was also lowered to 55MPH on the highway.

 

[uraflit]

law is in your favor

health is not in your favor

lol

 

[craiglester]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbusuego /img/forum/go_quote.gif Your state, city or county should intall this sign.

Wow I so need some of these near me..

I've lost count of the number of times I've almost been run down, on the crosswalk, with the walk now guy lit.

I always wait for the crossing signal, never run out in front of cars when I don't have the signals, and STILL at least monthly someone doesn't look and almost drives into me..

Most odd is that the drivers seem upset with me that I'm getting in their way or something. I've been honked at, shouted at, been threatend, and on one memorable occasion, spat at, for crossing when I'm supposed to.

I can't speak for other states, but here in Colorado, pedestrians have right of way when they have the light, but time and time again, people seem to think oh well I'm in a car, screw the pedestrian. Cars turning left with a light, or turning right without looking is the most common, but I've had cars just blow through a light and swerve to avoid me at the last moment..

 

[Ares]

My two cents:

America needs more roundabouts- many drivers do not know how to correctly handle four way stops. While most drivers do not know to yield to the driver on the right the ones who do almost always wait for visual confirmation for fear that the other driver does not follow the simple rule. Ergo, roundabouts simplify the rule into one simple rule - yield to everyone while entering the roundabout. This speeds up traffic and reduces accidents due to communication error. This will also minimize the dangerous left hand turn.

Speed limits need to be raised to an acceptable level. Many states maintain low speed limits in order for the DOT to raise money and to 'save gas'. Nevertheless, the difference in speed created by people driving the speed limit and people speeding to the level that they feel is acceptable causes accidents. For example, the difference causes errors in judgment, erratic driving, and unlawful passing.

Turn signals need to be modernized. Left hand turns are very dangerous, but sometimes they are necessary. Using capacitance plates and pedestrian coordination left turn signals can be upgraded to a state that allows them to be indicative of clear roadway.

People need to stop passing on the right unless necessary and trucks need to stop driving in the farthest left lane.

Nevertheless, idiots will still exist. While driving on I-95 the other day I was passed by a motorcycle from the right lane. It passed me in between two cars - on the line. Moreover, it was traveling at about 75-85 MPH. After he passed my car, he swerved in front of it and proudly displayed his middle finger as a penalty for not moving over lanes to give him room to pass. Additionally, It was clear that it was racing a vehicle that was also traveling at a high rate of speed. This, along with other incidents, leads me to believe that there are always indecent and inconsiderate individuals in the world.

 

[wuwhere]

Americans are not used to roundabouts, like KPH that was a flop.

 

[roadtonowhere08]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wuwhere /img/forum/go_quote.gif Americans are not used to roundabouts, like KPH that was a flop.

Geez, can you imagine how many accidents those would cause over here? I personally love them in lesser traveled areas (most of France), but in a U.S. city? With U.S. drivers? The traffic report would go from being on the 5's to on the 1-9's

 

[PhilS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graphicism /img/forum/go_quote.gif I didn't know that, I bet pedestrians get hit all the time now because of this rule... I'd have to argue is it ever worth a persons life to save a little fuel.

We put people's lives at risk every day to save money here and there, i.e., we balance the cost of fuel, etc. against the value of human life. There's really no other choice as a practical matter. Glad you and your wife are ok, though.

 

[Uncle Erik]

First, I'm really glad it was only a close call and you weren't injured.

If you want to do something about it, arrange a meeting with the community affairs officer (or similar public contact) at your local police station. They will have an officer available for people to talk to.

Tell the officer your story and bring your diagram along. Ask the officer to set up a pedestrian crossing sting operation.

Those have been run successfully here in California, and I'm sure many other states and cities have done the same. This is where they'll hide a motorcycle cop or two near the intersection and put out anothe officer or two in plainclothes to make crossings as a pedestrian. When someone does something stupid - like what happened to you - a motorcycle will appear and deliver an appropriate ticket.

Now, the police often like stings like this. They'll sometimes put out press releases and have the media promote a "pedestrian safety enforcement" campaign. This is the sort of thing that makes them look good. They can put someone in a crisp uniform on TV explaining how they're promoting the public good, etc. It's terrific PR for the police - be sure to remind them of this. It can also generate a lot revenue from tickets, which is also something that makes them happy. Talk it up as something that will make the police look good and help people.

You might also want to enlist your city council member. There should be one for where you live. Arrange a meeting and ask for a pedestrian safety campaign and sting operation. The Council often controls the police budget, so if your councilor asks, the police tend to be quite responsive. Again, this will give your councilor a chance to go on TV and talk about Doing Civic Good. It's helpful in reelection campaigns, too.

You might also want to look for community groups/organizations for the handicapped and senior citizens. They're likely to be pedestrians and would likely support pedestrian enforcement. This also plays strongly to the PR angle. The councilor and police would probably love to get out there and make noise about the safety of the elderly and handicapped.

Oh, and you might want to do some homework on car/pedestrian accidents. The city likely keeps public records on this and you can access them. That could really strengthen your case.

Finally, find out who represents your district in the Florida Legislature. You will have a senator and a representative or two. Contact their offices and ask them to sponsor a pedestrian safety bill in the next session. It's not generally known, but representatives sponsor quite a few bills at the request of constituents. Again, they love this sort of thing. Law and order bills usually pass easily and it looks terrific in campaign literature. Who will argue with a bill that protects pedestrians? Ask for larger fines (always popular) and stiffening point violations on offenders' licenses. You might also want to ask for upgraded intersections, safety equipment, etc. There might be federal highway funds available fornsuch things which would provide extra motivation. If the representative can get a bill though that lands fexeral pork they can dole out to construction companies that give campaign contributions that makes them happy.

Anyhow, I'm glad you're OK. All this might seem like a bit of work, but the government really does respond if you start pushing the right buttons. This is precisely the sort of thing they love, too. It involves revenue, possible federal pork and great PR.

 

[Graphicism]

You raised some excellent points Uncle Erik, it does sound like a lot of work but I am at the very least going to write a letter. You would think it always in there interest to scout out such areas, especially after the accident last week but it doesn't look like there doing anything. I guess I feel somewhat hopeless, so what if I get them to setup a sting operation for a week, it will only happen a week later, or at another intersection.

Perhaps I'm aiming high, in fact I know I am, but I'd like to see the law changed completely.

• No going on red at any time.
• No going while pedestrians are crossing the road at any time.
• No crossing oncoming traffic unless you have a green arrow.

This would save 12* pedestrian lives everyday.

2008
Fatal Crashes: 34,017 (lowest it's been since the statistics started in 1994)
34,017 / 365 days a year = 93 per day
* 4,378 are pedestrians
4,378 / 365 days a year = 12 per day

 

[Sherwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graphicism /img/forum/go_quote.gif I didn't know that, I bet pedestrians get hit all the time now because of this rule... I'd have to argue is it ever worth a persons life to save a little fuel.

Absolutely it is. Sounds callous, but we all agree it is. Does anyone legitimately want 35 mph. speed limits enforced on all roads across the country? Lots of people die in car accidents, and we accept this for speed and fuel efficiency. Lives are not of infinite worth anywhere in the world.