How much of a realistic improvment from soundcard to Dac/Amp?

[chinesekiwi]

Quote:

 
You realize head-fi is not a religion or a commercial entity, right? You should always go for the most expensive phone you can afford, as it'll most likely sound better from a crappy source than a crappy phone on a good source ever will.
  
Price point doesn't mean much...some have reported the $30 RX700 to kill the $250 d2k, and even the $300 Pro750 sounded like **** to my ears(just like the d2k).
 
When ppl ask for advice, it's assumed that they are well aware of what they're buying...you don't buy a $400 cable for a $50 phone, the same way you don't buy a killer source if your phone is worthless.
 
Bottom line is: most ppl here haven't heard the AD700, so why don't ask AD700 owners what worked for them? maybe they'll tell you that they don't need an amp and aren't transparent enough to capitalize on them

 
FWIW, I've got friends using the FUN and the NG27 and they're all very happy w/ them.

The AD700's are good enough to 'captialise' on but just not via amping. It benefits very little from amping and improves far more with a better source. AD700 owner here.

 

[Kawai_man]

 
Quote:

Zoltan,
 
I own those headphones. They are not the "weak link," they are efficient. And what that means is that they don't require a lot of watts or current to do their best (I'm listening to mine directly out of an iPod Touch right now, and while it's not as good as my Senn 580s through an amp, it is very good.).
 
The reason why you're not hearing a big difference is because there is not a big difference.
 
Plug a pair of Sennheiser 650s or AKG 701s directly into your computer and they won't be driven properly. They require more power, and most soundcards simply don't have enough headroom. Your Audio Technicas work fine with your computer as a source, so the only big difference you're likely to hear is the loss of noise you might experience by getting the analog function of your DAC outside of the noisy environment of your computer. Maybe...just maybe, your computer isn't all that noisy. Mine isn't. Is it too late to send that amp back? When you upgrade to or add on a pair of demanding, high-ohm, inefficient cans, that will be the time to buy an amp.
 
In the meantime, you've gotten a whole barrage of typical audiophile board advice. IE: if your experience doesn't fit with their belief system (it is faith-based) , the fault must be somewhere else in your signal chain (throw good money after bad), or in your ears. Or the best of all...burn in. Yeah, that's it, keep the thing you're getting no value from until you're past the return policy deadline and you've talked yourself into hearing something that's not really there. Last but not least - "you have to listen for awhile before these advantages reveal themselves." Nonsense. Every scientific study on the subject ever conducted says we differentiate subtleties in sound best in a quick A/B comparison, and the basic science about memory makes it pretty clear that it changes, enhances, trends further away from reality and closer to what we want to believe with time. If you don't hear it now, you won't hear it later. Though you may imagine that you do.
 
Send the DAC/Amp back. Enjoy the music.
 
Tim

 
Very well said Tim

 

[ROBSCIX]

Sure, that is great advice, take back the gear use your onboard and some low/mid grade cans and talk yourself into the idea that their is nothing better. 

 

[Phelonious Ponk]

I believe he told the man that if he upgrades his cans, that would be the time to look into amps, but let's not allow what was actually said to interrupt your snark. In the meantime, if the difference between the headphone jack of his computer and the DAC/amp he bought is somewhere between insignificant and inaudible, what would you advise? That he keep the DAC/amp? Perhaps he should connect it to his computer with a Cardas optical cable? Maybe he should put his PC up on some isolation plinths, or set shakti stones on his head?
 
You're right, of course. "Enjoy the music" is terribly impractical advice. What fun is that when you could be obsessing over inaudible audio tweaks?
 
p

 

[ROBSCIX]

 
Quote:

I believe I told the man that if he upgrades his cans, that would be the time to look into amps, but let's not allow what was actually said to interrupt your snark. In the meantime, if the difference between the headphone jack of his computer and the DAC/amp he bought is somewhere between insignificant and inaudible, what would you advise? That he keep the DAC/amp? Perhaps he should connect it to his computer with a Cardas optical cable? Maybe he should put his PC up on some isolation plinths, or set shakti stones on his head?
 
You're right, of course. "Enjoy the music" is terribly impractical advice. What fun is that when you could be obsessing over inaudible audio tweaks?
 
Tim

Well that is your advice. Sounds foolish when said back doesn't it?
As for the rest of your post, Don't put words in my mouth or anybody elses.
 

 

 

[maverickronin]

Quote:

I believe I told the man that if he upgrades his cans, that would be the time to look into amps, but let's not allow what was actually said to interrupt your snark. In the meantime, if the difference between the headphone jack of his computer and the DAC/amp he bought is somewhere between insignificant and inaudible, what would you advise? That he keep the DAC/amp? Perhaps he should connect it to his computer with a Cardas optical cable? Maybe he should put his PC up on some isolation plinths, or set shakti stones on his head?
 
You're right, of course. "Enjoy the music" is terribly impractical advice. What fun is that when you could be obsessing over inaudible audio tweaks?
 
Tim

 
Everyone knows the upgraded luminiferous aether significantly improves the fidelity of the audio signal! 
+1 for common sense. 

 

[haloxt]

It's sad to see all this fighting. If you aren't happy with the product, just send it back, don't get angry when we're just trying to give advice. People like hybrys are just trying to make sure there's nothing wrong with your setup, not trying to trick you into spending more money or mock you. If I saw the kind of negativity some of you are spewing when I was starting out in audiophilia, I likely would've just quit the hobby in disgust at the behavior. Luckily when I started, nice people like robscix helped me with all my questions without turning discussions into squabbles.

 

[muad]

+1  robscix

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

It's sad to see all this fighting. If you aren't happy with the product, just send it back, don't get angry when we're just trying to give advice. People like hybrys are just trying to make sure there's nothing wrong with your setup, not trying to trick you into spending more money or mock you. If I saw the kind of negativity some of you are spewing when I was starting out in audiophilia, I likely would've just quit the hobby in disgust at the behavior. Luckily when I started, nice people like robscix helped me with all my questions without turning discussions into squabbles.

Exactly, if you are not happy with it, return it and buy something else.  However, if you are new to this type of gear and not getting what you think you should be, there may be an issue.
A setting, bad media, malfunciton in the device.. bad cable..etc..etc.etc.  If you are sure everything is working as it should be and it is not for you....send it back.  Simple as that.
People are offering advice, you can take it or leave it.
 

 

[charnk]

Quote:

 
This made my day..."those who know don't speak, and those who speak don't know"

 
Realtek RMAA: http://www.mediafire.com/file/tuy3myzu1my/%5BMME%5D%20Realtek%20ALC888.zip
 
a proper external DAC on a DPS: http://www.firestone.idv.tw/rmaa/spitfire.htm
 

a year or two? Audio-GD is way overhyped on head-fi...you've just learned it the hard way, don't believe everything you read next time.

 
Well said, I'm glad I didn't go for the head-fi darling audio-gd.
 

 

[angle_sh00ter]

I've always stayed well clear of audio-gd for some reason.
I don't know why but it just seems like budget brand/gear - even tho they got the high end stuff too.

 

[francisdemarte]

OP comes here to ask about amps and dacs for the AD700 and complete silliness ensues...I own the AD700's and own and have owned a few dac and amps.
 
1) I agree with chinesekiwi, the AD700 does NOT benefit much from an amp. There is a slight improvement but I don't think it's hundreds of dollars worth of improvement.
 
2) You will probably not hear a huge difference between a good sound card and cheap external DAC. 
 
3) The AD700's have very poor isolation. The most notable improvement would be to find a quiet spot with less noise and distractions. In my opinion, critical listening is a practiced skill, unless your good at it you won't notice a difference between DAC's and even some amps.

 

[muad]

 
Quote:

 
This made my day..."those who know don't speak, and those who speak don't know"

 
Realtek RMAA: http://www.mediafire.com/file/tuy3myzu1my/%5BMME%5D%20Realtek%20ALC888.zip
 
a proper external DAC on a DPS: http://www.firestone.idv.tw/rmaa/spitfire.htm
 

a year or two? Audio-GD is way overhyped on head-fi...you've just learned it the hard way, don't believe everything you read next time.

 
Well said, I'm glad I didn't go for the head-fi darling audio-gd.

 
 
Where's your audio-gd Fun results?