[Matthew Willims]

I would hold fire if I were you. I’m not a Red owner but I‘ve red a few statements in the last day or two that are at odds with those I’ve read previously in this thread. Will add a couple of comments later re my understanding, got some work deadlines…

Maybe I'll just try it, if it works I'll keep otherwise resell

 

[Krit1960]

I have the Holo Red attached to the Spring 3 level 2 with i2S. Works fine. Great sound!

For anybody how wants to run Volumio: After flashing the Volumio image to card, edit the DTOVERLAY in config.txt

dtoverlay=dwc2,dr_mode=host

Now run the Volumio setup and deselect i2s!

 

[GoldenSound]

So with Ethernet in and i2s out does it mean it’s not really doing ddc but just putting via “output” i2s

I'm not sure what you're meaning by this.
DDC is a product category. If it's converting from one digital format (PCM over ethernet for example) to another (I2S) then that is a DDC.
Technically any streamer is also a DDC, though people often use the term DDC to specifically refer to USB to I2S/AES/SPDIF devices (which the RED can also be used as if you'd prefer not to stream), but the term does technically apply to any digital to digital converter.

'DDC' isn't a particular task. You might be thinking of clocking/reclocking, which is inherent to any I2S source. You can't have an I2S output without a clock signal

 

[cglin222]

I'm not sure what you're meaning by this.
DDC is a product category. If it's converting from one digital format (PCM over ethernet for example) to another (I2S) then that is a DDC.
Technically any streamer is also a DDC, though people often use the term DDC to specifically refer to USB to I2S/AES/SPDIF devices (which the RED can also be used as if you'd prefer not to stream), but the term does technically apply to any digital to digital converter.

'DDC' isn't a particular task. You might be thinking of clocking/reclocking, which is inherent to any I2S source. You can't have an I2S output without a clock signal

I get you but I was just going over on red block diagram picture and such also email them and I got reply from Tim that when Ethernet in is used for streaming the “i2s is just an output” answer from him
My question was “So in the case of Ethernet in and i2s is it acting as streamer and ddc via i2s or just simply “output” without the ddc component engaged?”
I am not audio engineer so I don’t know just taking his answer as it is

 

[tomita]

I get you but I was just going over on red block diagram picture and such also email them and I got reply from Tim that when Ethernet in is used for streaming the “i2s is just an output” answer from him
My question was “So in the case of Ethernet in and i2s is it acting as streamer and ddc via i2s or just simply “output” without the ddc component engaged?”
I am not audio engineer so I don’t know just taking his answer as it is

What's the difference between having the RED receive the data stream through ethernet or through USB and then pass it to I2s?
I really don't understand this POV.

 

[cglin222]

What's the difference between having the RED receive the data stream through ethernet or through USB and then pass it to I2s?
I really don't understand this POV.

I don’t quite either, but going with this
https://www.kitsunehifi.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/HOLO_RED_Manual_20221221.pdf
It seems the usb ddc only activates with usb in when it’s not usb in, or in our discussion Ethernet in, it’s not engaged? Hence Tim said only as output or just pass on the audio out I guess?

 

[GoldenSound]

I get you but I was just going over on red block diagram picture and such also email them and I got reply from Tim that when Ethernet in is used for streaming the “i2s is just an output” answer from him
My question was “So in the case of Ethernet in and i2s is it acting as streamer and ddc via i2s or just simply “output” without the ddc component engaged?”
I am not audio engineer so I don’t know just taking his answer as it is

I think Tim may have thought you were asking if the I2S is normal HDMI or can be used as an input or something.
There is no such thing as a 'DDC component' per se.
The entire product which converts one digital format to another (such as ethernet to I2S) is a DDC

 

[cglin222]

I think Tim may have thought you were asking if the I2S is normal HDMI or can be used as an input or something.
There is no such thing as a 'DDC component' per se.
The entire product which converts one digital format to another (such as ethernet to I2S) is a DDC

On side note, I was looking to get the red hence asking all the questions
But what is the tf card slot used for?
Do you have to insert something for it to work in both streamer or ddc mode
Manual really don’t say anything and I couldn’t understand where it get the red os image from

 

[GoldenSound]

On side note, I was looking to get the red hence asking all the questions
But what is the tf card slot used for?
Do you have to insert something for it to work in both streamer or ddc mode
Manual really don’t say anything and I couldn’t understand where it get the red os image from

The slot is for the OS image so that you can run a third party OS like volumio if you want to.

The sd card with the os on it is included in the box. You can download the os image if you need to reflash on the kitsune product page for the red

 

[cglin222]

The slot is for the OS image so that you can run a third party OS like volumio if you want to.

The sd card with the os on it is included in the box. You can download the os image if you need to reflash on the kitsune product page for the red

Ok in other words you have to insert the card to boot up the device in default basically
And where is the download link can’t even find it on their own website

 

[Jake2]

Maybe I'll just try it, if it works I'll keep otherwise resell

I see @GoldenOne has addressed one of the points I was going to make more eloquently than I would have - that conversion from ethernet to I2S or other digital outputs is still doing a digital-to-digital conversion whilst also acting as a streaming endpoint/renderer. I would add there is no 'just' about such a conversion, doing this well maintaining very low jitter levels is a non-trivial matter, rather it would seem it is damn hard to do, otherwise more streamers (or non-streaming DDCs for that matter) - including those at higher pricepoints - would manage this.

My other points relevant to your described use-case with the DI-20HE, are IIRC from discussion upthread (Red owners/reviewers to please confirm accuracy):

• switching from DDC (USB input) to streamer (ethernet input) can only be achieved by plugging/unplugging the USB input cable and restarting. i.e. if the USB input cable is connected on restart then DDC function is selected, if not connected on restart then its Streamer function is selected.
• the USB audio output is only available when operating as a streamer i.e. no DDC USB in > clean USB audio out. This wouldn't of course be fatal to your intended use with the DI-20HE, given its s/pdif input, though it would limit your sample rate vs the DI-20's USB input. Might be a non-issue if your DDC use is limited to gaming, video etc.

 

[incredulousity]

I see @GoldenOne has addressed one of the points I was going to make more eloquently than I would have - that conversion from ethernet to I2S or other digital outputs is still doing a digital-to-digital conversion whilst also acting as a streaming endpoint/renderer. I would add there is no 'just' about such a conversion, doing this well maintaining very low jitter levels is a non-trivial matter, rather it would seem it is damn hard to do, otherwise more streamers (or non-streaming DDCs for that matter) - including those at higher pricepoints - would manage this.

My other points relevant to your described use-case with the DI-20HE, are IIRC from discussion upthread (Red owners/reviewers to please confirm accuracy):

• switching from DDC (USB input) to streamer (ethernet input) can only be achieved by plugging/unplugging the USB input cable and restarting. i.e. if the USB input cable is connected on restart then DDC function is selected, if not connected on restart then its Streamer function is selected.
• the USB audio output is only available when operating as a streamer i.e. no DDC USB in > clean USB audio out. This wouldn't of course be fatal to your intended use with the DI-20HE, given its s/pdif input, though it would limit your sample rate vs the DI-20's USB input. Might be a non-issue if your DDC use is limited to gaming, video etc.

Both of these things are true.

 

[Matthew Willims]

Yes, I'll just need to keep a separate DDC in place for video content. I was hoping I could simplify things and reduce box count though it seems thats not going to happen. Anyway, I'll see if I find any sonic benefit with streaming on the USB output

 

[GoldenSound]

I see @GoldenOne has addressed one of the points I was going to make more eloquently than I would have - that conversion from ethernet to I2S or other digital outputs is still doing a digital-to-digital conversion whilst also acting as a streaming endpoint/renderer. I would add there is no 'just' about such a conversion, doing this well maintaining very low jitter levels is a non-trivial matter, rather it would seem it is damn hard to do, otherwise more streamers (or non-streaming DDCs for that matter) - including those at higher pricepoints - would manage this.

My other points relevant to your described use-case with the DI-20HE, are IIRC from discussion upthread (Red owners/reviewers to please confirm accuracy):

• switching from DDC (USB input) to streamer (ethernet input) can only be achieved by plugging/unplugging the USB input cable and restarting. i.e. if the USB input cable is connected on restart then DDC function is selected, if not connected on restart then its Streamer function is selected.
• the USB audio output is only available when operating as a streamer i.e. no DDC USB in > clean USB audio out. This wouldn't of course be fatal to your intended use with the DI-20HE, given its s/pdif input, though it would limit your sample rate vs the DI-20's USB input. Might be a non-issue if your DDC use is limited to gaming, video etc.

Yes, I'll just need to keep a separate DDC in place for video content. I was hoping I could simplify things and reduce box count though it seems thats not going to happen. Anyway, I'll see if I find any sonic benefit with streaming on the USB output

You can use the USB in and the streaming simultaneously.
You have to restart if you want to swap the I2S/AES etc outputs from the USB input to the streamer, BUT, if you set it so that the 'USB redirector' forces the I2S/AES/SPDIF outputs to the USB input, then you can use both at the same time, allowing USB input to control the I2S/AES/SPDIF outs and the streamer to control the USB out

 

[EMINENT]

You can use the USB in and the streaming simultaneously.
You have to restart if you want to swap the I2S/AES etc outputs from the USB input to the streamer, BUT, if you set it so that the 'USB redirector' forces the I2S/AES/SPDIF outputs to the USB input, then you can use both at the same time, allowing USB input to control the I2S/AES/SPDIF outs and the streamer to control the USB out

I never understood the purpose of the redirector. Could you please explain what scenario that could be used for as I use mine only as a streamer.