[Hifiearspeakers]

Actually, I am a new comer. I bought a HEKSE new and didn't upgrade from the HEKv2, and never heard the HEKv1 and HEKv2....

Ok my bad.

 

[Hifiearspeakers]

The HiFiMAN Edition X sounds pretty nice actually

The HEX V2 is my second favorite Hifiman headphone behind the SE. It has more bass and the treble is simply perfect. It’s easily the most forgiving. My only issue with it is that the mids are a little recessed and it’s just not as detailed as the higher end Hifiman. But what it does right, it really does right. It’s a fantastic sounding headphone!

 

[mixman]

The HEX V2 is my second favorite Hifiman headphone behind the SE. It has more bass and the treble is simply perfect. It’s easily the most forgiving. My only issue with it is that the mids are a little recessed and it’s just not as detailed as the higher end Hifiman. But what it does right, it really does right. It’s a fantastic sounding headphone!

Yep. If the HEX had a bit more resolution and detail. I wouldn't be reading this thread because I would just stop right there.

 

[sahmen]

There is one thing that is important to consider in these debates, and that is the type of cable one is using to listen to one's HeK model. I personally found aspects of the highs on my original He-1000 to be rather harsh and unpleasant, until I got a Norne Audio Silvergarde S Clear cable for it. With the Silvergarde S Clear cable,, the top-end became smooth like butter... In fact, It became so nice and smooth that I refused to do the HeKV2 upgrade when it came up, because I honestly did not expect the V2 to be much better than the V1 (of course I could have been wrong about that, but the point I am making is that I did not find anything to be wrong with, or need correction, in the V1, so I kept it. I only tried the v2's pads on the v.1, and that produced a slight difference in the SQ of the HeK, but that difference amounted more to a sidegrade than an upgrade to my ears so I stayed put).

I even got the HeXV2 somewhere along the line, and noted its smoothness, but I resold it not too long afterwards, not because it sounded bad. On the contrary, it sounded too much like an He-1000 lite in tonality, without doing anything better. Now since the he-K sounded so similar in tonality to the HeXV2, while doing everything (in soundstage, extension, detail retrieval, and air around instruments) significantly better, I soon realized that I'll really never have a strong inclination to reach for the He-XV2 as long as the similar but superior He-K was around, so He-X had become rather redundant and simply had to go,

It is also that sense of satisfaction with the HeK that has made me resist the HeKSE upgrade until now. However, I have finally decided to cave in, and since yesterday, I am a new owner of an HeKSE, even though my new unit is going to take a little under a week to get to me, because I shipped out my HeK for the upgrade only this morning... Why did I finally cave? It is because I finally feel persuaded by many of the glowing reviews and impressions that I have read about the HeKSE, that it is at least worth a trial. Besides, I have owned the HeK for more than 3 years now, and I feel ready for a fresh pleasant surprise from Hifiman, which finally helped me to decide that upgrade at half the price of the original isn't too bad (especially, since i got the original too at half the price... . Yes I did, but I am not going to go into it now)...

Now to get back to the issue of cables, which is .the point of this entire rant, I think Hifiman's cables typically suck big time, and I am glad I am not the only one to have recognized or said that... This is why the reported "conflicting reviews and impressions do not surprise me at all... If someone were to ask me to write two reviews of the original HeK, one with the stock cable, and the other with my Norne Audio Silvergarde S or Draug v3 cable, I feel certain that I would come up with two very divergent reviews of that same headphones...This is true of he Stock or replacement cables for both the He-K and the He-XV2 alike, and without having heard them yet, I do not expect the HeKSE or even the Susvara to be any different with regard to the quality of their stock cables,

 

[franz12]

There is one thing that is important to consider in these debates, and that is the type of cable one is using to listen to one's HeK model. I personally found aspects of the highs on my original He-1000 to be rather harsh and unpleasant, until I got a Norne Audio Silvergarde S Clear cable for it. With the Silvergarde S Clear cable,, the top-end became smooth like butter... In fact, It became so nice and smooth that I refused to do the HeKV2 upgrade when it came up, because I honestly did not expect the V2 to be much better than the V1 (of course I could have been wrong about that, but the point I am making is that I did not find anything to be wrong with, or need correction, in the V1, so I kept it. I only tried the v2's pads on the v.1, and that produced a slight difference in the SQ of the HeK, but that difference amounted more to a sidegrade than an upgrade to my ears so I stayed put).

I even got the HeXV2 somewhere along the line, and noted its smoothness, but I resold it not too long afterwards, not because it sounded bad. On the contrary, it sounded too much like an He-1000 lite in tonality, without doing anything better. Now since the he-K sounded so similar in tonality to the HeXV2, while doing everything (in soundstage, extension, detail retrieval, and air around instruments) significantly better, I soon realized that I'll really never have a strong inclination to reach for the He-XV2 as long as the similar but superior He-K was around, so He-X had become rather redundant and simply had to go,

It is also that sense of satisfaction with the HeK that has made me resist the HeKSE upgrade until now. However, I have finally decided to cave in, and since yesterday, I am a new owner of an HeKSE, even though my new unit is going to take a little under a week to get to me, because I shipped out my HeK for the upgrade only this morning... Why did I finally cave? It is because I finally feel persuaded by many of the glowing reviews and impressions that I have read about the HeKSE, that it is at least worth a trial. Besides, I have owned the HeK for more than 3 years now, and I feel ready for a fresh pleasant surprise from Hifiman, which finally helped me to decide that upgrade at half the price of the original isn't too bad (especially, since i got the original too at half the price... . Yes I did, but I am not going to go into it now)...

Now to get back to the issue of cables, which is .the point of this entire rant, I think Hifiman's cables typically suck big time, and I am glad I am not the only one to have recognized or said that... This is why the reported "conflicting reviews and impressions do not surprise me at all... If someone were to ask me to write two reviews of the original HeK, one with the stock cable, and the other with my Norne Audio Silvergarde S or Draug v3 cable, I feel certain that I would come up with two very divergent reviews of that same headphones...This is true of he Stock or replacement cables for both the He-K and the He-XV2 alike, and without having heard them yet, I do not expect the HeKSE or even the Susvara to be any different with regard to the quality of their stock cables,

This sounds interesting to me. HEKse doesn't have the best control on treble to my ears. Is there anyone who noticed significantly better treble control with a third party cable?
HEKse is an amazing headphone. I think it plays above the Utopia in terms of sound purity, imaging, and transparency. But I would welcome better control on treble.

 

[JaZZ]

This sounds interesting to me. HEKse doesn't have the best control on treble to my ears. Is there anyone who noticed significantly better treble control with a third party cable?
HEKse is an amazing headphone. I think it plays above the Utopia in terms of sound purity, imaging, and transparency. But I would welcome better control on treble.

What exactly do you mean with «control»? I'm asking because an amp or a cable doesn't have any sort of control over the membrane movement, it just adds its own flavor – in the ideal case as little as possible. I can imagine that you wish better accuracy, better imaging.

I still have the original HE1000 with V2 pads (currently being repaired), and changing the cable was mandatory. First I went for the Silver Dragon (originally terminated for the HD 800), which brought a relatively massive improvement in terms of resolution (finer grain) and smoothness, particularly noticeable in the treble, which was a bit rough with the stock cable. Later I «upgraded» to the Lavricables Master Silver, which revealed the Silver Dragon's tendency to sleekness, as it offered better detail and accuracy – again most striking in the treble –, while at the same time retaining a welcome smoothness. The final upgrade was the Lavricables Grand. It took accuracy to the next level and seemed to expand the bandwidth to even higher frequencies. Maybe that's what you're looking for.

A question to the HE1000SE owners: Do you think the low-frequency extension is the same as with the predecessors? I'm asking because one of the two available frequency-response graphs seems to indicate a drop-off below 50 Hz.

 

[UsoppNoKami]

This sounds interesting to me. HEKse doesn't have the best control on treble to my ears. Is there anyone who noticed significantly better treble control with a third party cable?
HEKse is an amazing headphone. I think it plays above the Utopia in terms of sound purity, imaging, and transparency. But I would welcome better control on treble.

HE1000SE with Norne Audio Silvergarde S3 all the way, best all around TOTL headphone I have heard so far. I have not used the stock cable even once, feels like silicone hoses in the car engine bay. Will have a longer Einvaldi cable coming (8 wire) when Trevor clears his backlog, can hardly wait .. any treble harshness i have heard is the fault of the recording (eg metal/rock crashing drums, not the headphone... and can be remedied by swapping out my tung sol BGRP tubes to mullard ecc33.

 

[franz12]

What exactly do you mean with «control»? I'm asking because an amp or a cable doesn't have any sort of control over the membrane movement, it just adds its own flavor – in the ideal case as little as possible. I can imagine that you wish better accuracy, better imaging.

I still have the original HE1000 with V2 pads (currently being repaired), and changing the cable was mandatory. First I went for the Silver Dragon (originally terminated for the HD 800), which brought a relatively massive improvement in terms of resolution (finer grain) and smoothness, particularly noticeable in the treble, which was a bit rough with the stock cable. Later I «upgraded» to the Lavricables Master Silver, which revealed the Silver Dragon's tendency to sleekness, as it offered better detail and accuracy – again most striking in the treble –, while at the same time retaining a welcome smoothness. The final upgrade was the Lavricables Grand. It took accuracy to the next level and seemed to expand the bandwidth to even higher frequencies. Maybe that's what you're looking for.

A question to the HE1000SE owners: Do you think the low-frequency extension is the same as with the predecessors? I'm asking because one of the two available frequency-response graphs seems to indicate a drop-off below 50 Hz.

I already mentioned that measurement in my previous post. Two days ago, I asked the sonarworks whether they have measured the HE1000SE because I was interested in, but they said they never measured the HE1000SE yet.
Again, they said they only measured HE1000V1 and HE1000 V2 quite a few times via e-mail conversation.
The graph you are showing maybe measurements of the HEKV1 or HEKV2. I don't know.

 

[franz12]

What exactly do you mean with «control»? I'm asking because an amp or a cable doesn't have any sort of control over the membrane movement, it just adds its own flavor – in the ideal case as little as possible. I can imagine that you wish better accuracy, better imaging.

I still have the original HE1000 with V2 pads (currently being repaired), and changing the cable was mandatory. First I went for the Silver Dragon (originally terminated for the HD 800), which brought a relatively massive improvement in terms of resolution (finer grain) and smoothness, particularly noticeable in the treble, which was a bit rough with the stock cable. Later I «upgraded» to the Lavricables Master Silver, which revealed the Silver Dragon's tendency to sleekness, as it offered better detail and accuracy – again most striking in the treble –, while at the same time retaining a welcome smoothness. The final upgrade was the Lavricables Grand. It took accuracy to the next level and seemed to expand the bandwidth to even higher frequencies. Maybe that's what you're looking for.

A question to the HE1000SE owners: Do you think the low-frequency extension is the same as with the predecessors? I'm asking because one of the two available frequency-response graphs seems to indicate a drop-off below 50 Hz.

I attached their LCD4z measurement. It seems almost everything drops off below 50 hz.

 

[JaZZ]

I already mentioned that measurement in my previous post. Two days ago, I asked the sonarworks whether they have measured the HE1000SE because I was interested in, but they said they never measured the HE1000SE yet.
Again, they said they only measured HE1000V1 and HE1000 V2 quite a few times via e-mail conversation.
The graph you are showing maybe measurements of the HEKV1 or HEKV2. I don't know.

I'm puzzled: What does this graph have to do with Sonarworks? Well, at least I was, before I've gone back to the source and realized that the poster is indeed a Sonarworker. However, the curve can't show neither the HE1000 nor the HE1000 V2, since both don't show any such drop-off in various other measurements, which moreover show characteristically different humps and dips.

Thanks for the LCD-4z curve! It's quite telling in this respect.

 

[franz12]

I'm puzzled: What does this Graph have to do with Sonarworks? Well at least I was, before I've gome back to the source and realized that the Poster is indeed a Sonarworker. However, the curve can't show neither the HE1000 nor the HE1000 V2, since both don't show any such drop-off in various other measurements, which moreover show characteristically different humps and dips.

I think it has something to do with their compensation curve. You can see even more massive drop off below 50hz with the LCD-X.

 

[chimney189]

I think that a cable swap makes a HUGE difference, especially at this level of fidelity.

 

[Articnoise]

I've seen one posted on the Suerbestaudiofriends..... emyrean thread, 4th page (I won't post a link). I don't know the the measurement techniques or compensation curves applied, but the big takeaway for me was a significant channel imbalance in the treble region, where the left channel had big peaks at 6khz and 12khz compared to the right. Both Empyrean and SE had broad dips around 2khz - not sure what that's about - one has to be very careful when interpreting FR measurements.



No headphone has a perfect FR curve, and the HEK V2 is better than many, but it (and V1) absolutely does have a measured peak around 8khz-9khz (possibly in other places, but that's the only one that I felt necessary to EQ down). I would call it a thinness rather than shouty, but lots depends on the recording and rest of the system.

My final word on recent hifiman love/hate posts: I think it is perfectly reasonable to praise a company for the things it does well, and to criticise the things it does badly. I tend to ignore the extreme posts from either side. Whilst we shouldn't let a company get away with bad practice, we should also give praise where due. In this case, I think the SE upgrade option was one of hifiman's better decisions.

Which "extreme posts on either sides" are you refering to?

And why are they extreme?

 

[franz12]

HE1000SE with Norne Audio Silvergarde S3 all the way, best all around TOTL headphone I have heard so far. I have not used the stock cable even once, feels like silicone hoses in the car engine bay. Will have a longer Einvaldi cable coming (8 wire) when Trevor clears his backlog, can hardly wait .. any treble harshness i have heard is the fault of the recording (eg metal/rock crashing drums, not the headphone... and can be remedied by swapping out my tung sol BGRP tubes to mullard ecc33.

Thanks for the suggestion. To solve this cable myth, I will probably buy a third-party cable, and then send my unit to the Sonarworks having them measure with two different cables to see they indeed change a FR.

 

[JaZZ]

Thanks for the suggestion. To solve this cable myth, I will probably buy a third-party cable, and then send my unit to the Sonarworks having them measure with two different cables to see they indeed change a FR.

That would be money wasted. Cables don't alter the measurable frequency response, as has been shown numerous times. Even amps with clearly discernable characteristics usually don't (save for those with high output impedances).