[joe]

Guys - Let's be civil. 

 

[wahsmoh]

It is great bass, some of the best around, but like many reviews say, it isn't the "thumping" variety. Essentially, if the bass is in the material, the HE-500 will faithfully and naturally reproduce it, it's one of their best traits (and one carried on with the HE-560). In open orthos, the only one that comes close to that is the LCD-2, many would say at the expense of some clarity, but if I were the OP, I'd jump on the new closed variety of the EL-8s, or some Alpha Dogs (he could also go DIY and mod some T50RPs, if he feels handy with a screwdriver, that's a lot of fun).

I must have missed the part where you were being offensive. This is very well put together though. You aren't going to find bass from a planar anywhere near "thumping" unless you get an LCD-2. I guess the HE-400 could play the part too but that is a mixed bag. Closed planar will achieve the type of bass you are looking for though.

 

[ArmAndHammer]

 
I must have missed the part where you were being offensive. This is very well put together though. You aren't going to find bass from a planar anywhere near "thumping" unless you get an LCD-2. I guess the HE-400 could play the part too but that is a mixed bag. Closed planar will achieve the type of bass you are looking for though.

You quoted the wrong post.

 

[Magick Man]

nevermind.

 

[Koolpep]

It is great bass, some of the best around, but like many reviews say, it isn't the "thumping" variety. Essentially, if the bass is in the material, the HE-500 will faithfully and naturally reproduce it, it's one of their best traits (and one carried on with the HE-560). In open orthos, the only one that comes close to that is the LCD-2, many would say at the expense of some clarity, but if I were the OP, I'd jump on the new closed variety of the EL-8s, or some Alpha Dogs (he could also go DIY and mod some T50RPs, if he feels handy with a screwdriver, that's a lot of fun).

Very good advice. Am having myself an eye on the EL-8.

Cheers,
K

 

[TurbinePro]

in the audiophile world quantity=/=quality.....
 
a 30% improvement is A LOT......
 
hell, some people spend hundreds on lines just to feel better

 

[Flee727]

Sounds fair, affording a good headphone system is really hard for many students, and people value things diffetently as well, I understand

 

[Liu Junyuan]

  How does the bass of the HE-400 compare to the HE-500? I've never looked into the 500 because it's not at a price point for me so I honestly haven't read anything about them. Some people do say that the 400 is a borderline bass head can so maybe that would be a better option like the OP already is considering. I personally don't find the bass overwhelming but it's definitely there and it does not bleed through into the mids and highs at all. The mids and highs IMO are great so this as far as I'm concerned is going to be the OP's best bet as a next try for a better than the M50 headphone. Enough bass to satisfy, enough everything else that he can continue forward (hopefully) in listening to and appreciating other music that's not the current stuff that's coming out. And all that at half the price he paid for the HE-500. Seems like a winner to me.

I think HE-400 is a winner too. I had it briefly and can say that it does bass very well; I am sure you have heard the many claims that it surpasses most headphones in the bass department under $1000. I have not heard the LCD-2s yet, but some have said it is inferior only to the LCD-2 rev. 2 pre-fazor bass, with plenty of slam and effortless transient and decay. The HE-500 is no slouch in the bass department, though, and I feel its mids and treble are more suited toward my sensibilities. Both are great headphones, and I would not consider either a waste of money. 

 

[patchoncas]

I've only heard good things from this headphone, besides the wonky comfort.

 

[Liu Junyuan]

  Very true, this frustration and fun is going to be worth it once I find a setup that works for me, hopefully! I think I will return it, but I'm not sure whether to give them another chance or not because the seller has a 30-day return policy. I think I will decide once I figure out if the HD650 is better or not. Thanks for the reply.
 
I learn that more and more as time passes haha. I'm not really sure whether it's the headphone not meshing with my ears, or my ears not meshing with the headphones, if you know what I mean. It is true that there are plenty of other headphones out there, but in this price range I think there's only really a few desirable options (Sennheiser, HiFiMAN, and Grado, any others?). Thanks for the reply, I love your avatar!
 
Well, I can say that upgrading from Panasonic RPHJE120K to TTPOD T1E was the largest improvement I've ever experienced.
It's not? I thought that it was the perfect amp, based on...well, everything. It's a tube amp, which is nice. Actually, it's a hybrid tube amp so it provides a whole lot of power. It's got a gain switch so I can also use it with more sensitive headphones. It's affordable for a student like me. It's by Schiit, which is a no bullSchiit company lol, their products usually have good ratings.
 
What would a speaker amp do to improve the HE-500? It would supply a lot of power, but wouldn't that just end up making the headphones louder? And how could that possibly be better when the Lyr 2 is a headphone amp so it is designed for use specifically with headphones meaning that it has a low noise floor and whatnot?
What tubes do you recommend? (pls not tubes that cost $100+ each lol that's crazy!)
Thanks! I appreciate your compliments 

My response to your points in order:
 
1. In what ways exactly is the difference between the HD650 and the HE500? I've heard varying answers to this question, ranging from big difference to very small difference according to some people. Some people said that the HE-500 was like a better version of the HD650, but I'm looking for a more detailed answer than that, but not one that claims a night and day difference. Which one do you prefer and why? Also, yes the biggest reason why I'm probably disappointed is because I'm coming from a headphone like the M50. I don't like that way the M50 seems rather congested, but when I come to the HE-500, I''ve not yet become accustomed to such a different sound signature and I end up missing all that bass from the M50. I guess I'll just have to get used to it?
 
2. I don't really listen to Mariah Carey lol. I just mentioned her here because she came up on Pandora and she can bring her voice up pretty high. I've had the HE-500 for around a week now and I've been giving them a good 45min to an hour of listening each day in my small amount of free time. I was actually out of town for a week so I've had them for two weeks, but I've only been listening to them for one week. I listen to so many different genres of music that it would be more convenient to tell you what I don't listen to lol but I think I cover the whole spectrum of different music. I don't really listen to hardcore techno and electronica like Tiesto, but I listen to a lot of other electronic genres like EDM, dubstep, hardstyle, and trap. I use Soundcloud a lot.as well as Spotify. Other than that, I do have music from HDTracks as well as the testing tracks from Dr. Chesky, which is part of what I use to evaluate any equipment because those are the highest quality files that I have.
 
3. I did everything I could without modding the headphones to make them sound as good as they can, I think. I haven't replaced the stock tubes on my Lyr 2 yet, but I replaced the pleather pads with the included velour pads because a lot of people claimed that there was a noticeable difference when switching. I thought that replacing the pads to alter the sound was nonsense but I did it anyways. I've never experienced velour ear pads on a headphone, they feel funny on my head. I might buy the new pads from HiFiMAN later on if I decide to keep this headphone.
 
4. I will probably do that mod if it's 100% safe and reversible if I decide to keep these headphones. They do sound pretty closed in right now. Another disappointment when I was expecting them to sound really spacious out of the box.
 
5. I want to give them more time, but I don't have much time left before I must make a firm decision because the seller I purchased these from has a 30-day return policy. Also, it's still at least $20 to ship them back. I'm really stuck between returning them and giving them another chance. Keep in mind that this is my first high-end headphone.
 
I really appreciate your reply, thank you! I'll go take a look at that thread.
A lot of people claim that after a while they became fond of their headphones. However, I don't really know how that works. How exactly does one come to enjoy something simply due to becoming exposed to it for a prolonged period of time? I've been listening to my HE-500s for a week for around 45 minutes to an hour each day. When you say they "got used to the sound", it seems like they should then become less impressed by the sound and not the other way around, similar to when one enters a kitchen and smells the delicious smell in air, but after some minutes the sensation goes away as they get used to the smell. It could be my brain that needs to burn in and not the headphones because I've heard that if you don't like the sound of a headphone, you most likely won't like it any more after burning them in. So, it could also be that this sound signature just doesn't really work out for me. That's hard to figure out, and I don't know how I would predict or evaluate if it's me that needs to burn in my brain or that they don't work out for my ears.
The bass of the M50s is pretty congested. I guess you could call the bass of the HE-500s "polite" but I would then reply by saying that it is too polite IMHO. I didn't choose the HE-400 for a number of reasons. I didn't feel that it was a worthy upgrade to my M50s. As I've previously stated, I'm a student so I don't have much spending ability. Also, I've read many people warning others not to get on the hype train of the HE-400, and that they are very sibilant and not worth the sound which was extremely V shaped. My M50s are already V shaped and they don't have sibilance problems and they generally receive no complaints and a lot of praise instead. Another reason is that I got these HE-500s for $500, while the HE-400 was still at $400. 

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

You don't need to spend $100 to get an improvement out of the Lyr. All of mine are around the 50-60$ mark because I can't afford expensive tubes either. See my sig for which tubes I have. 
 
1. The HE-500 does not at all replace the HD 650 in my stable; they are different enough from one another to justify keeping both. The mids on the HE-500 are just slightly more transparent than those of the HD 650 (but the HE-560's mids are even moreso to the HE-500s) while still retaining a warm signature. The HD 650s have a certain organic, rich tone though that can best be described as "magical," and I still debate which headphone produces a more pleasant mid-range to my ears (this is a good thing). HD 650s give the sense of being slightly slower than the HE-500s, which is probably to do with the attack and decay; notes hang slightly longer on the Sennheisers. This is actually one of its characteristic virtues, though, and gives it a sort of natural magic (acoustic notes may also hang). Mids on both headphones are superb in their own way. 
 
The bass on the Senns is quite different than that of the HiFiMANs; whereas the Senns have a slight mid-bass hump and rolled-off sub-bass, the HiFiMANs hit deeper and create a sense where the bass is enveloping you, almost like an underlying hum (when the track calls for it). Both, to my ears thus far, are equally textured in the bass. I suppose one might say the HiFiMAN's have an unfair advantage over the Senns for being orthodynamics. HE-400 bass may surpass both, depending on your preferences. 
 
Treble on the Senns is slightly rolled off and laidback whereas the HE-500's treble is more extended. At some times, I have found the treble on the HE-500s to become tizzy, particularly at 4 kHz, but this is one thing the "fuzzor mod" seeks to address. The HE-560s arguably do treble better than the HE-500s.. The Sennheiser's treble, on the other hand, will never fatigue you, and somehow they remain extraordinarily detailed, a remarkable achievement indeed. How does one create an ultra-detailed treble that is nevertheless smooth and non-fatiguing? Sennheiser did it. The HD-650s are one of the smoothest headphones to listen to, which is a perk and a detriment, depending on the user and the purpose of listening. That's why I keep both!
 
A greater contrast can be seen between the HD 650s and the HE-560s, though, as became apparent to me recently when trying out the HE-560s. There is a warmness and a body to both HE-500 and HD 650 that I suppose may be behind the similarity others perceive between the two headphones. HE-560s have mids that are slightly leaner and that are more transparent than both.
 
2. Good, lol. Even HD Tracks may not have the best recordings, though. It's useful to just listen to a variety of recordings and to exploit your eclectic musical tastes to the full. 320 kpbs and FLAC files are just fine. 
 
3.It isn't at all nonsense about changing the pads. Headphone manufacturers spend a great deal of time, money, and research on engineering their pads since they realize how drastically pads can solidify the driver's sonic signature. Witness the Jergpad thread or the Oppo-PM1, which has released an alternative pad to the first-production pads based on feedback and which noticeably changes the signature. Pads do shape the sound of a headphone. 
 
4. These mods are 100% reversible. The easiest one is to visit the Grill-mod thread to learn how to simply remove the grills. You can just put them back in when you want; should you decide to keep the headphones, you can later make a new grill for them easily. HiFiMAN originally experimented with this mod prior to Jerg, and as one may see in the newest statement headphone from the company, the company has implemented its own grill mod of sorts, drastically opening up the soundstage. The fuzzor mod is equally, if not more, important should you decided to keep the headphones, but it is also 100% reversible. This mod aims to address the backwave reflections that are intrinsic to planar dynamic drivers, especially the double magnets that we have in these older HiFiMAN models. 
 
5. It sounds like you've made your decision, but I thought I would reply anyways. Best of luck!

 

[whatup69]

Insatiableone, did u get my reply regarding the a900x? Any questions just hit me up mate

 

[wahsmoh]

I think the HE-500 sounds like an improved DT880 to me. It is like a DT880 but with improved mids, bass, and highs. Imagine the DT880 without treble sparkle, warmer mids, and slightly better bass. I know that sounds very generalized but those were my impressions. The bass still sounded like open headphone bass and might be more geared towards instruments and not electronic bass that needs a lot of slam. <--this is going strictly by sound impressions, the HE-500 weighs a ton compared to the DT880

 

[Sonic Defender]

  I think the HE-500 sounds like an improved DT880 to me. It is like a DT880 but with improved mids, bass, and highs. Imagine the DT880 without treble sparkle, warmer mids, and slightly better bass. I know that sounds very generalized but those were my impressions. The bass still sounded like open headphone bass and might be more geared towards instruments and not electronic bass that needs a lot of slam. <--this is going strictly by sound impressions, the HE-500 weighs a ton compared to the DT880

Interesting comparison, I loved my DT 880 and constantly think about getting another set. I used to love the treble back in the day with the 880, I wonder if I still would now? Maybe that is the one advantage of getting older, no matter who you are you start to lose high frequency acuity so suddenly spikey designs are not at all an issue.

 

[Insatiable One]

Yes, I think I will begin to actually use the equalizer. Previously, I've just been too lazy to experiment with it. The first time I tried using an equalizer...well, it was ugly haha
However, I think that I have changed my mind again. I just sold my old iPod Classic 5th Gen to a friend who is a collector LOL! Who collects iPods?! He said that he didn't want to purchase one from eBay because it was either being sold for too much or was in poor condition.
Now that I have a little extra money, I am looking at the ZMF x Vibro, but I'm still reading up on it. At first, it sounds like it will be better than the HE-400. It sounds like a very interesting headphone, because it is meant to combine attributes from both dynamic and orthodynamic headphones! So, in short, good mids and highs + bass.
Also, sorry, I misread your post. I thought that you were saying that you purchased to HE-400s to compare haha! That would be...strange. I was looking at the Fidelio X2 as a gift to my little brother, but he likes a brighter sound signature with neutral bass. 
Btw, I like your music taste. Five Finger's Bad Company makes me want to go out and kick ass, but my headphone cables only go so far 

 

At first glance, it may appear like a waste of money. It is only a waste of money if I was looking for something along the lines of a bassy M50 signature. Actually, I was looking to step out of that illusion that more bass=better sound and I was looking to try something different. I feel that my money was very much well spent here. Though I am returning this headphone, in the end I truly enjoyed it and I learned a lot from this experience. Also, I think that by "dry sounding" Tyll means it's a little boring. Or maybe he means that its not juicy and overflowing, but instead lacking in quantity, which is what I initially felt. I like Tyll's reviews, he is very knowledgeable. 

You should also take a look at the ZMF stuff; I tend to prefer it to the Mad/Alpha Dogs.

Hello, Ishcabible. Thank you for the reply. I have heard about the ZMF headphones a while back, I had forgotten about them. Thank you for reminding me, they are now my primary choice that I am currently considering. I have picked up a little extra money from selling and old iPod, and $500 is the price range that I am looking at again. Which ZMF headphone do you recommend? I cannot afford their Blackwood headphone, but I am considering the ZMFxVibro. It seems like the perfect signature, but I am still reading up on it. They claim to have created a headphone that combines attributes from both dynamic and orthodynamic headphones. First, I was looking at the Master Model. But now that I've picked up some extra cash, I think that the ZMF x Vibro is a much better buy. What is your opinion? 

I'm not quite sure on the exact number of hours they now have on them, but I bought them new. Also, I listen from 30 minutes to 2 hours every day depending on how much time I have. I've had them for a little over 2 weeks. I believe in burn in, but I don't believe that it has a night and day effect. If you don't like a headphone, I don't think that you would like it after burn in. From what I've read, burn in has an audible but minor effect. Mostly smoothing over harsher tones in the headphone, and maybe some extension of the highs or lows.
How exactly do you get a good fit and seal with a headphone? I know that a good seal is crucial to an IEM, but this headphone is open back anyways, so what will a good seal do? When I put my headphones on, I give them a slight squeeze like I was squishing a pillow to make it fluffier, if that makes any sense. 

Sorry for overlooking this post. Glad you at least had a decent experience trying them out and best wishes on your head-fi journeys!

Thank you!

Even the Lyr is not enough? I think that the Lyr 2 has some good specs. I bought it as sort of a future proof amp in case I purchase some less sensitive headphones later on.
Also, why would I even purchase an old speaker amp? Wouldn't that just end up making the sound a poorer quality? And whoa there, a cable that costs roughly $450? No way I'm getting that lol! 
Thanks for the reply, and yes I have given them enough listening time.

Wow, you're a basshead AND like the HE-500. Well, we all have different ears, and to each his own The HE-500 does perform superbly with electronic music.
Thanks for the reply. 

 

[Insatiable One]

  Guys - Let's be civil. 

Hey Joe! 

  You quoted the wrong post.

wow what is going on lol

  I think HE-400 is a winner too. I had it briefly and can say that it does bass very well; I am sure you have heard the many claims that it surpasses most headphones in the bass department under $1000. I have not heard the LCD-2s yet, but some have said it is inferior only to the LCD-2 rev. 2 pre-fazor bass, with plenty of slam and effortless transient and decay. The HE-500 is no slouch in the bass department, though, and I feel its mids and treble are more suited toward my sensibilities. Both are great headphones, and I would not consider either a waste of money. 

Yes, I was considering the HE-400, but I am now considering the ZMF x Vibro. What do you think about those?

 

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

You don't need to spend $100 to get an improvement out of the Lyr. All of mine are around the 50-60$ mark because I can't afford expensive tubes either. See my sig for which tubes I have. 
 
1. The HE-500 does not at all replace the HD 650 in my stable; they are different enough from one another to justify keeping both. The mids on the HE-500 are just slightly more transparent than those of the HD 650 (but the HE-560's mids are even moreso to the HE-500s) while still retaining a warm signature. The HD 650s have a certain organic, rich tone though that can best be described as "magical," and I still debate which headphone produces a more pleasant mid-range to my ears (this is a good thing). HD 650s give the sense of being slightly slower than the HE-500s, which is probably to do with the attack and decay; notes hang slightly longer on the Sennheisers. This is actually one of its characteristic virtues, though, and gives it a sort of natural magic (acoustic notes may also hang). Mids on both headphones are superb in their own way. 
 
The bass on the Senns is quite different than that of the HiFiMANs; whereas the Senns have a slight mid-bass hump and rolled-off sub-bass, the HiFiMANs hit deeper and create a sense where the bass is enveloping you, almost like an underlying hum (when the track calls for it). Both, to my ears thus far, are equally textured in the bass. I suppose one might say the HiFiMAN's have an unfair advantage over the Senns for being orthodynamics. HE-400 bass may surpass both, depending on your preferences. 
 
Treble on the Senns is slightly rolled off and laidback whereas the HE-500's treble is more extended. At some times, I have found the treble on the HE-500s to become tizzy, particularly at 4 kHz, but this is one thing the "fuzzor mod" seeks to address. The HE-560s arguably do treble better than the HE-500s.. The Sennheiser's treble, on the other hand, will never fatigue you, and somehow they remain extraordinarily detailed, a remarkable achievement indeed. How does one create an ultra-detailed treble that is nevertheless smooth and non-fatiguing? Sennheiser did it. The HD-650s are one of the smoothest headphones to listen to, which is a perk and a detriment, depending on the user and the purpose of listening. That's why I keep both!
 
A greater contrast can be seen between the HD 650s and the HE-560s, though, as became apparent to me recently when trying out the HE-560s. There is a warmness and a body to both HE-500 and HD 650 that I suppose may be behind the similarity others perceive between the two headphones. HE-560s have mids that are slightly leaner and that are more transparent than both.
 
2. Good, lol. Even HD Tracks may not have the best recordings, though. It's useful to just listen to a variety of recordings and to exploit your eclectic musical tastes to the full. 320 kpbs and FLAC files are just fine. 
 
3.It isn't at all nonsense about changing the pads. Headphone manufacturers spend a great deal of time, money, and research on engineering their pads since they realize how drastically pads can solidify the driver's sonic signature. Witness the Jergpad thread or the Oppo-PM1, which has released an alternative pad to the first-production pads based on feedback and which noticeably changes the signature. Pads do shape the sound of a headphone. 
 
4. These mods are 100% reversible. The easiest one is to visit the Grill-mod thread to learn how to simply remove the grills. You can just put them back in when you want; should you decide to keep the headphones, you can later make a new grill for them easily. HiFiMAN originally experimented with this mod prior to Jerg, and as one may see in the newest statement headphone from the company, the company has implemented its own grill mod of sorts, drastically opening up the soundstage. The fuzzor mod is equally, if not more, important should you decided to keep the headphones, but it is also 100% reversible. This mod aims to address the backwave reflections that are intrinsic to planar dynamic drivers, especially the double magnets that we have in these older HiFiMAN models. 
 
5. It sounds like you've made your decision, but I thought I would reply anyways. Best of luck!

I think I will upgrade my tubes later on, as I don't have any extra money I want to allocate to that. I have read this article and I have been trying to figure out if NOS tubes are New Old Stock or Nasty Old Stuff. 
With regards to audio quality, I think that the quality of the mastering matters way more that the actual quality of the file and its bit rate and bit depth and whatnot.
I guess it's not all nonsense with the pads, but replacing the pleather pads with the included velour pads had almost no difference. The minute difference I think I heard was probably my mind playing tricks on me. I saw that the cloth on the velour pads was thinner than the cloth on the pleather pads and that light shined through.
Again, thanks for the reply 

Insatiableone, did u get my reply regarding the a900x? Any questions just hit me up mate

Yes, I did read your reply. My apologies m8, I forgot to respond to it. I once considered the ATH-700/900/X series when I started looking for an upgrade to my M50s. Of course, the first place I started looking was the same brand because I knew about Audio Technica as being a good brand for both headphones and microphones. When I read about the ATH-700/900/X series, the general comments on it were good, but some said that there was better. Also, they didn't seem like a worthy upgrade. By that I mean that I didn't feel that the step up from the M50 would be a significant enough to be worth my time.
 
 
 
Thanks a bunch for all of the replies!
 

 
-K