[SilverEars]

Just for the record it had a cheapo copper XLR cable from China, a set of Ether Angled pads, some felt and dynamat on the back side. I did note several times it didn't seem to scale. You didn't like it, I don't like it, and my son who knows a good deal took them twice, but gave them back both times.

Even if that is all true, it doesn't mean the 400 I owned, 400i and 400S I've heard is a match for the 500. The 500 is similar to a HE-6 (probably the most respected can over the past 10 years) - except the trace is aluminum not gold, and it was tuned to have richer mids. The highest slot the 400 has occupied was 3rd in the HFM line-up after the 500 and 6. Now in the HFM line it's what? Susvara, HEKse, HEKv2, Arya, 560, Ananda, Sundara. Seven. If this was 9 months ago HE6se would have made eight.

What makes it so hard to drive, the gold? I don't have an idea what the purpose of gold was, although the driver response does seem to differentiate between the two. Is it just the gold? And if so, what about the gold such demand on power and also the sound character? Perhaps somebody has an idea?

 

[trellus]

I have the HE-400 (my second unit, first I no longer have), and I used to have an HE-500 -- to me, it wasn't close, the HE-500 was definitely a step up, the HE-500 was magical. Wish I still had one. Oh and my HE-500 was stock, so not even getting the most out of it from what people tell me.

 

[reeltime]

Way too much time on my hands. Enjoy.

 

[The Third]

A little update: installed a new firmware on my Topping E30. Now instead of 44.1PCM it says 48.0PCM (while in Spotify). Quite sure it changed the sound for the better. Maybe the old firmware was not playing nice with my computer, and downsampled the output of the sound?

 

[sennfan83261]

Way too much time on my hands. Enjoy.

Wrong thread, try here: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/drop-x-hifiman-he-5xx.945708/

 

[vlach]

What makes it so hard to drive, the gold? I don't have an idea what the purpose of gold was, although the driver response does seem to differentiate between the two. Is it just the gold? And if so, what about the gold such demand on power and also the sound character? Perhaps somebody has an idea?

I could be right (Bagwell can correct me) but i believe this is due to the double sided magnets on the HE-500.

 

[SilverEars]

I could be right (Bagwell can correct me) but i believe this is due to the double sided magnets on the HE-500.

I mean why is HE-6 83dB sensitivity whereas 500 being 87? Bagwell said the difference is the gold traces on the HE6, but is that all?

 

[bagwell359]

What makes it so hard to drive, the gold? I don't have an idea what the purpose of gold was, although the driver response does seem to differentiate between the two. Is it just the gold? And if so, what about the gold such demand on power and also the sound character? Perhaps somebody has an idea?

Aluminum is cheap but doesn't conduct as well as gold, but maybe that's not it, because the 500 is more efficient. So maybe its the magnet strength? From what I've read the claim is traces are different and they added more tuning for midrange. I wonder what would happen with traces made of .9999 silver? Those are airtight so they won't tarnish in air, and such a small amount of silver isn't very expensive.

 

[bagwell359]

I could be right (Bagwell can correct me) but i believe this is due to the double sided magnets on the HE-500.

Magnets in the HE-6 6 screw and 500 look like twins (shape wise) - but who knows? Different magnetic strength would make them quite different.

Think to back in 2010. How many headphone fans were ready to drive the 6? They may well have detuned the 6 for lower cost and better drivability. I'm quite sure the 500 sold a lot more than the HE-6 either version for those two major reasons and that speaker like warm mid sound.

 

[SilverEars]

Magnets in the HE-6 6 screw and 500 look like twins (shape wise) - but who knows? Different magnetic strength would make them quite different.

Think to back in 2010. How many headphone fans were ready to drive the 6? They may well have detuned the 6 for lower cost and better drivability. I'm quite sure the 500 sold a lot more than the HE-6 either version for those two major reasons and that speaker like warm mid sound.

Back in 2010? I can't imagine people knowing if they should be driven with high current source. People either used cheap and weak amps, or really expensive custom made stuff, so the chances are people were using weak sauce amps to drive HE-6 had no idea how better they should be driven. And I'm sure people that were driving the HE-6 out of speaker taps were looked at as crazy. I'll be honest, I was a bit in disbelief at the time when I first read about using speaker taps. lol

Maybe magnet strength are different between the two with one requirement more current to move the driver better? No idea.

I can't recall if this was truth, but I heard 500 was more expensive than 6 at some point when it was more popular. I can see 500 being more popular due to easier to drive, and at least until it caught on that HE-6 needed something stronger to drive properly. Also, Tyll endorsed the 500 over the 6, you can see it in his Hifiman round-up review.

Looking back, Tyll's videos were really informative. At the time, I've seen it every week so didn't think much of them. lol But, it was always a treat when you see his new video posted on his blog. And the chats on his blog was very constructive in terms of discourse.

 

[bagwell359]

Back in 2010? I can't imagine people knowing if they should be driven with high current source. People either used cheap and weak amps, or really expensive custom made stuff, so the chances are people were using weak sauce amps to drive HE-6 had no idea how better they should be driven. And I'm sure people that were driving the HE-6 out of speaker taps were looked at as crazy. I'll be honest, I was a bit in disbelief at the time when I first read about using speaker taps. lol

That's what I was talking about, nobody had the right amps. HFM may have done some spade work with reviewers and the amp adaptor as time moved ahead. But the 500 was another way to make the technology available more easily.

Interesting to note that the HE-6 4, HE-6 6, and HE-6se all are in the low 80's db, even though the SE is about 7 years newer than the 6 screw.

Maybe magnet strength are different between the two with one requirement more current to move the driver better? No idea.

I can't recall if this was truth, but I heard 500 was more expensive than 6 at some point when it was more popular. I can see 500 being more popular due to easier to drive, and at least until it caught on that HE-6 needed something stronger to drive properly. Also, Tyll endorsed the 500 over the 6, you can see it in his Hifiman round-up review.

It's possible the 500 was more expensive for a time, but overall I would think not. Tyll's opinion was taken up by some. but by 2017 the owners determined the 6 was better (the attack of the bass (1st two versions) is still scary on the 6). The 500 does have that.

Looking back, Tyll's videos were really informative. At the time I found them, I watched them avidly. (oops changed text here by mistake - bags). But, it was always a treat when you see his new video posted on his blog. And the chats on his blog was very constructive in terms of discourse.

Only a couple of posters will know what I am talking about here: Those Tyll videos when I absorbed the whole series around 2015-16 were like the revolution started by audiophile mag "The Absolute Sound" in 1974 (Issue 4) with the Dahlquist DQ-10 review which I just dug up about in an old storage box about 3 weeks ago.

 

[DenverW]

Has anyone tried the verite be2 pads on the he500? I’m curious if they’d pair as well as the eikon perforated sused.

 

[The Third]

A little update again. I took your guys advice and turned the actual amp up with the pre-amp lowered. This thing really does like all the juice, on lower amp levels it does not play well at all: then I especially find the highs harsh/uncontrolled, and the sub-bass lacking in volume. On higher amp levels this thing is indeed a beast. There also seemed to be a polarity issue with my E30 that is now resolved after firmware updating. Sharp roll off now sounds more than decent as well, though I'd still prefer this with slow roll-off as it removes a bit of the edginess from the treble that can show up (though pleather pads on the HE-500 also removes this edge, though velour/velpads are more detailed sounding). Lastly, I believe the HE-400 still has it's place and differences are more explained by the colouration than anything else. The colouration can favour some tracks and wreck others for the HE-400, while the HE-500 is a much better all-rounder. The biggest difference here is the tuning, the raised bass kick, extra sub-bass presence, the skewed midrange which creates the perception of a bigger soundstage, extra treble sparkle and darker mids makes the HE-400 still have it's own place in certain circumstances. To describe them emotionally, the HE-400 is when you want to get pumped up with energy right before a party or just before going to exercise but also serves movies/movie soundtracks better with it's darker mids creating more spaciousness. The HE-500 will always provide the better timbre to allow you to hone in on details and all layers much easier, and is for when critically listening and preferring to get lost in the details of soundtracks in any mood of the day. I still need to get to know the HE-500 more but, despite them having a bit too small of a soundstage, I really like them for being so balanced and detailed. Maybe down the road I'll write a review on these too...

 

[bagwell359]

A little update again. I took your guys advice and turned the actual amp up with the pre-amp lowered. This thing really does like all the juice, on lower amp levels it does not play well at all: then I especially find the highs harsh/uncontrolled, and the sub-bass lacking in volume. On higher amp levels this thing is indeed a beast. There also seemed to be a polarity issue with my E30 that is now resolved after firmware updating.

500's are indeed backwards wrt polarity. Dunno why, but that seems to be a more pervasive issue in room systems. Easily changed but I've never bothered.

Sharp roll off now sounds more than decent as well, though I'd still prefer this with slow roll-off as it removes a bit of the edginess from the treble

500's like most cans is a mountain range over 10k. Some areas need to be raised (14.5 k), and some need to be lower (9.5k, 18k and up).

that can show up (though pleather pads on the HE-500 also removes this edge, though velour/velpads are more detailed sounding).

Not disputing your findings, but in a bigger sample size my results are different.

Lastly, I believe the HE-400 still has it's place and differences are more explained by the colouration than anything else. The colouration can favour some tracks and wreck others for the HE-400, while the HE-500 is a much better all-rounder. The biggest difference here is the tuning, the raised bass kick, extra sub-bass presence, the skewed midrange which creates the perception of a bigger soundstage, extra treble sparkle and darker mids makes the HE-400 still have it's own place in certain circumstances. To describe them emotionally, the HE-400 is when you want to get pumped up with energy right before a party or just before going to exercise but also serves movies/movie soundtracks better with it's darker mids creating more spaciousness. The HE-500 will always provide the better timbre to allow you to hone in on details and all layers much easier, and is for when critically listening and preferring to get lost in the details of soundtracks in any mood of the day. I still need to get to know the HE-500 more but, despite them having a bit too small of a soundstage, I really like them for being so balanced and detailed. Maybe down the road I'll write a review on these too...

Well written and quite accurate.

 

[bagwell359]

I could be right (Bagwell can correct me) but i believe this is due to the double sided magnets on the HE-500.

Not 100% sure of the context, but HE-6 (all 3) and 500 all double sided.

That gives more depth (like a dipole speaker), but you have to swallow up enough reflections so you don't have time smear - like the "fuzzor mod", screens off, etc. What you get when you have early reflections eaten pretty well is a lot of ambiance, depth, and even 3-D images (not perfect, don't get carried away). I find the magic mids are easier to get from the 500. The 6 is a bit sharper in the highs, majestically punchy in the bass, and a bit recessed in the mids. The 500 seems to have a lot of everything, a bit like the 400, but the 400 is more like Bam Bam's club, while the 500 is a katana, and the 6 is a broadsword - if you don't mind me stretching that a bit.