[I95North]

Well said I'm not getting rid of my set even though its not working now and i'm waiting on drivers to test. HE-400 is beastly to me also even though  i realized from the beggining they seemed colored to me but in a good way!
 
Hey again i'm not an audiophile though!
 
I compaired HE 400 to a friends AKG K701 and i was like HAh?  My HE400 is mildly recessed in the midrange.  Great lows with fantastic Hi end. It clobbered my buddies K701 In every aspect except for a wider sound stage and yes thats all nothing else. Guess what my buddy is buying next>>  HE400 over the plastic muffled sounding K701.
 
My buddy said... "Wow i never knew my akg's sound so plastic like, dull and lifeless" His words not mine....
 
Oh well   a Fiio E11 was used to test both headsets out.. Black Sabbath "War Pigs Live".. mp3 format
Quote:

For those "sitting on the fence" I would like to add, that I think it is quite difficult sometimes to get a proper idea about the scope of a certain issue with (the sound of) a headphone - in this case the "small soundstage" of the HE-400 and how "dark sounding" is it really?
 
You won't know until you hear it for yourself of course, but a comparison to a headphone you have or have heard may help. I have earlier compared the 400 to the HE-6, but many potential HE-400 buyers probably haven't, so I will add a few comments compared to my Ortofon eQ-7 and EarSonics SM3 (even though these of course are IEMs and closed). These are roughly in the same price category and are considered being in the very top of the universal fit IEMs sound quality wise - look here for instance:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/476315/top-tier-universal-iem-comparison-chart-frequency-response-charts-discussion
 
In short: the HE-400 just hammers them completely!
Both the eQ-7 and SM3 are IMO significantly flawed compared to the HE-400 - and this is specifically in terms of frequency response. If you think the HE-400 is dark sounding then the SM3 is going to sound pitch black to you. The eQ-7 has a sound signature reminding me of the AKG K701: bright sounding with a lean bass, however a tight one. Neither IEM is satisfying to me. I am going to sell them, because the HE-400 sounds som much better than these and can be driven by my HM-801 (and I seldomly listen in noisy environments). I was on the lookout for a custom IEM, but now I might "just" get the RE262 - again.
 
In terms of sound stage, if that is important to you, then you are most likely not searching for the HE-400 anyway, because then you are probably listening to classical and other genres, where this part of the reprodution is more important. If you however are mostly listening to pop, dance, rock, hip-hop and other genres, where a good bass should be present and instruments usually are recorded with the microphone quite close to them, then the HE-400 will be a very, very satisfying headphone. I actually prefer the HE-400 for pop/dance over the HE-6 - that's how good it is!
 
If you listen to classical etc. once in a while also, then the HE-400 will do this also in a quite okay manner, but won't excel in it however, because the soundstage isn't as big as for instance the AKG K701. I sold the K701 when I ordered the HE-400 and I am very satisfied with the swap. In terms of refinement, purity, transparency, resolution, timbre, even frequency response and balance etc. etc. it is very competent. Yes, it has more bass than neutral, but not much. We are talking about 3-6 dBs. It also has slightly more lower mids (maybe 2 dBs), but not anything to worry about. If you want to know what to worry for in that respect, then try the SM3! The HE-400 has a little spike at about 8kHz and 12kHz, but never sounds sibilant. Do I think the HE-400 has a V-shape (or even better: smile-shape) frequency response? Well - hmmm. Yes, I guess so, but not much.
 
Could I live with just the HE-400 and the HM-801 and not having the big setup with the HE-6, Master-6 and Ref 7.1? Yes, I actually think so. It's that good. (The big setup of course is better in terms of transparency, resolution, soundstage, frequency balance etc., but at a much, much higher price tag and also weighing in at about 25 kilos ...

 
 

 

[lintonsofly]

LarsHP pretty much sums up my thoughts on the he400 in his post.

 

[MuppetFace]

.

 

[detoxguy]

Any point or just trolling?
 
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[Il Mostro]

Quote:

Any point or just trolling?
 


 
 

Having tried these and returned them I stand by my opinion of their poor build and total lack of pre-sale QC.  That defines JUNK in my book.

 

[Phos]

Is your evaluation based on their sound or that they broke?  Honestly this kind of thing happens to the best of them once in a while, and it seems as though Fang is working to improve QC.  I mean, I doubt he made any money making a bunch of replacement drivers.  

 

[Nankai]

Hi all,
 
I was out of town last week and did not response PM or email in time previously. I believe some of you have already received the replacement drivers. Please let me know how they works. We have run-in them for 200 hrs and no one got any problem before we ship them to you. We are working on manufacturing 2nd batch right now. It will take a few days, but we are very sure that they will not have the problem any more. 
 
We could not afford a beautiful mould when we designed HE-series headphones years ago. Fortunately we can right now. We are building the connection to a mould factory who is vendor of SONY, CANON, Nokia and some other very famous brands. In the on-going project, Jade II, we will have a totally different building quality. 
 
Fang

 

[donunus]

 
could it also possibly get the problems after shaking so much during shipping? The screws used need a bigger thread so that they can be tightened more without stripping IMO

 

[Il Mostro]

 
Quote:

Is your evaluation based on their sound or that they broke?  Honestly this kind of thing happens to the best of them once in a while, and it seems as though Fang is working to improve QC.  I mean, I doubt he made any money making a bunch of replacement drivers.  

Both.  While they certainly do not lack impact, they are way too tilted at both the bottom and top for me.  Also, they fall short in resolving detail. But the biggest issue for me is the defect that mine had and overall build quality.  Should I have to self-repair brand new headphones myself? Only in Bizarro World, or Hifiman World. To be fair, when mine played they were pretty good sound for the money but, ultimately too uneven.  I cannot, however, trust them for the long haul.  And I cannot trust the company to support them.
 
Now there is yet another new model coming out per Fangs latest post.  New model -- new supplier. Chinese fire drill, no pun intended. I do not give a rats ass about what is done to correct a product that has an admitted "design defect" (owner's words) after the fact.  Absolutely zero points for that. Maybe it would be a good idea to get it right before chasing the buck and taking people's money. Sending new drivers for owners to self-repair is strictly amateur hour.  Do you think maybe it would be prudent to know about this before releasing the product?  I'll bet any amount that they tested the free models given out for reviews at CES, but not the ones that were paid for.
 
And, no, this does not "happen to the best of them".  What orifice did you pull that out of?
 
As I have stated before, these guys are fast and loose -- releasing half-baked products and then coming out with another one which "corrects" the deficiencies of earlier versions.  Not the right way to run a business.  How much obsolesce can a relatively new company have?  Audeze, despite their CS warts, do not fail on the products like Hifiman does. Nor do they take a machine gun approach to "new and improved models". Take a look inside HE-400's and see for yourself.  Now the Jade II "project" rears its head, while the resale value of orphan products go straight down the toilet.
 
I simply feel that potential buyers should hear both sides of the story before parting with their cash.

 

[dleblanc343]

I see you like alfa romeo. That's my favourite car company and I inherited a 1973 Alfa Romeo Gtv from my grandfather which is in pristine condition.
 
Ironically, I find Alfa Romeo's older cars can compare to Hifiman. They are fantastic once you try them, and you fall in love... But troubleshooting comes with it.
 
You've gotta learn to appreciate things in life.
 
Having a 40 thousand dollar car to maintain at 19 years of age is definitely harder to deal with/ unpleasant than some iffy first batch release of a headphone.
 
Just throwing that out there
 
Quote:

 


Both.  While they certainly do not lack impact, they are way too tilted at both the bottom and top for me.  Also, they fall short in resolving detail. But the biggest issue for me is the defect that mine had and overall build quality.  Should I have to self-repair brand new headphones myself? Only in Bizarro World, or Hifiman World. To be fair, when mine played they were pretty good sound for the money but, ultimately too uneven.  I cannot, however, trust them for the long haul.  And I cannot trust the company to support them.
 
Now there is yet another new model coming out per Fangs latest post.  New model -- new supplier. Chinese fire drill, no pun intended. I do not give a rats ass about what is done to correct a product that has an admitted "design defect" (owner's words) after the fact.  Absolutely zero points for that. Maybe it would be a good idea to get it right before chasing the buck and taking people's money. Sending new drivers for owners to self-repair is strictly amateur hour.  Do you think maybe it would be prudent to know about this before releasing the product?  I'll bet any amount that they tested the free models given out for reviews at CES, but not the ones that were paid for.
 
And, no, this does not "happen to the best of them".  What orifice did you pull that out of?
 
As I have stated before, these guys are fast and loose -- releasing half-baked products and then coming out with another one which "corrects" the deficiencies of earlier versions.  Not the right way to run a business.  How much obsolesce can a relatively new company have?  Audeze, despite their CS warts, do not fail on the products like Hifiman does. Nor do they take a machine gun approach to "new and improved models" Take a look inside HE-400's and see for yourself.  Enjoy the Jade II while the resale value of your orphan products goes straight down the toilet.
 
I simply feel that potential buyers should hear both sides of the story before parting with their cash.

 

 

[stuckonsound]

Quote:

 


Both.  While they certainly do not lack impact, they are way too tilted at both the bottom and top for me.  Also, they fall short in resolving detail. But the biggest issue for me is the defect that mine had and overall build quality.  Should I have to self-repair brand new headphones myself? Only in Bizarro World, or Hifiman World. To be fair, when mine played they were pretty good sound for the money but, ultimately too uneven.  I cannot, however, trust them for the long haul.  And I cannot trust the company to support them.
 
Now there is yet another new model coming out per Fangs latest post.  New model -- new supplier. Chinese fire drill, no pun intended. I do not give a rats ass about what is done to correct a product that has an admitted "design defect" (owner's words) after the fact.  Absolutely zero points for that. Maybe it would be a good idea to get it right before chasing the buck and taking people's money. Sending new drivers for owners to self-repair is strictly amateur hour.  Do you think maybe it would be prudent to know about this before releasing the product?  I'll bet any amount that they tested the free models given out for reviews at CES, but not the ones that were paid for.
 
And, no, this does not "happen to the best of them".  What orifice did you pull that out of?
 
As I have stated before, these guys are fast and loose -- releasing half-baked products and then coming out with another one which "corrects" the deficiencies of earlier versions.  Not the right way to run a business.  How much obsolesce can a relatively new company have?  Audeze, despite their CS warts, do not fail on the products like Hifiman does. Nor do they take a machine gun approach to "new and improved models" Take a look inside HE-400's and see for yourself.  Enjoy the Jade II while the resale value of your orphan products goes straight down the toilet.
 
I simply feel that potential buyers should hear both sides of the story before parting with their cash.

Fang isn't forcing anyone to do self repairs. It was an option for those who didn't want to wait to ship them back and forth. 
 
As far as QC, yeah he should have done a little more performance evaluation before releasing the first batch. I think he has made an honest effort to correct the situation though. I think you have have to remember Hifiman is more of a boutique company without a huge RD budget.
 
I think Jade I was an electrostatic headphone not a magneplanar.
 
Oh yeah, Audeze had a batch of failed drivers released last spring.
 

 

[Il Mostro]

 
Quote:

I see you like alfa romeo. That's my favourite car company and I inherited a 1973 Alfa Romeo Gtv from my grandfather which is in pristine condition.
 
Ironically, I find Alfa Romeo's older cars can compare to Hifiman. They are fantastic once you try them, and you fall in love... But troubleshooting comes with it.
 
You've gotta learn to appreciate things in life.
 
Having a 40 thousand dollar car to maintain at 19 years of age is definitely harder to deal with/ unpleasant than some iffy first batch release of a headphone.
 
Just throwing that out there
 


 

I am down to two Alfa's -- a 1994 164 Super (Euro specs and then some -- just put Quadrifoglio runners on last week). And a 1969 GTV with all period correct mods -- big valve 1750 (Sperry head from the days when Mike still worked and built them himself), 11mm Autodelta cams, GTA header, two sets of Italian made Webers (40's for the street, 45's for the track), full Ward & Dean suspension, GTA exhaust, LSD from a '74 with 50% lock.  I recently sold my track prep'd '86 3 liter GTV6 (which stomped the donkey **** out of my old 308 carb'd GT4 on the track).  If properly maintained, these are no different than the most mundane cars. 115 chassis models are so simple and bullet proof.  
 
Your analogy is a real reach, but is still appreciated because you are Alfisti.  HF-man is an effin' joke compared to the long and glorious history of Alfa Romeo.  I do not think there are any Enzo Ferrari, Tazio Nuvolari, Juan Manuel Fangio or Sergio Scaglietti types lurking at Hifiman.
 
Maintaining and restoring a GTV at age 19 will be a chore if you are a checkbook mechanic -- learn to wrench my friend.  BTW, where are you located?   Does yours have the double-bubble dash and flying buttress seats or is it 1974 style minus the LSD?   Maybe '71 was the last of the double bubble dashes.  I tend to think that '67 "step noses" and '69 models are the pick of the litter.  Amaranto Rosso is my favorite color for this vintage.

 

[Phos]

Ya know we had the option to send them in for repair, I just did it myself because it was faster.  
 
It sounds to me like the implied new version is a cosmetic upgrade.  Considering the size of the drivers (which probably isn't going to change) they're really only going to be able to look so different.  Wait, "Jade II"?  Sounds like it's a new version of this, which when it comes to build quality and ascetics, well, let's just say it's no accident that they don't have a clear picture of them on the store page.  
 
And you might be right that this whole thing has been a faux pas (And probably was regardless), but I still have the impression that it was an issue that needed the phones to be shipped half way around the world to be revealed, that it's more a weakness of robustness rather than wear.  

 

[Nankai]

Quote:

 
could it also possibly get the problems after shaking so much during shipping? The screws used need a bigger thread so that they can be tightened more without stripping IMO

 
It is not a shipping problem. Cutting out is because of poor contact between metal trace and frame, not shacking. 
 

 

[Il Mostro]

Quote:

Fang isn't forcing anyone to do self repairs. It was an option for those who didn't want to wait to ship them back and forth. 
 
As far as QC, yeah he should have done a little more performance evaluation before releasing the first batch. I think he has made an honest effort to correct the situation though. I think you have have to remember Hifiman is more of a boutique company without a huge RD budget.
 
I think Jade I was an electrostatic headphone not a magneplanar.
 
Oh yeah, Audeze had a batch of failed drivers released last spring.
 

No, they are not a boutique.  Boutiques do things in-house.  He outsourced to achieve a price point and entirely skipped QC to do so.   Totally different ballgame.