[Pro-Jules]

Edit.

I think I figured it out... HiBy Blue app gives all the control necessary to let you pick the codec, sample rates, transmission rates, etc. Additionally, and perhaps more dangerously, so does the Developer Mode.

Wow, with UAT or LDAC at high rates the range is about 2 feet before starting to get serious drop outs... at least on my v30 (LDAC) or R6 Pro (UAT).

So how is UAT playback?

Is it an improvement over LDAC?

 

[Qazi Shehryar]

Kinda curious on the sound signature of the es100 in relative to the w5. How does the two compares?

More wider, more forward, more clear... I would prefer w5's SQ and signature over es100 any day...

I will test that when I get my W5 but my problem is I am hooked on the ES100's eq
I am not sure I can survive with out an eq.

Just like es100, w5 also has its own app namely hiby blue and has equalizer which works with any app.... For me w5 is ways better than es100

 

[paruchuribros]

Sounds good. But how many hours you can play continuesly with W5? Compare to ES100.

More wider, more forward, more clear... I would prefer w5's SQ and signature over es100 any day...
Just like es100, w5 also has its own app namely hiby blue and has equalizer which works with any app.... For me w5 is ways better than es100

 

[jsmiller58]

So, I have a bit of an off the wall question... I ask this as someone who already has the W5...

Yesterday I spent several hours with my W5 while I was out and about running errands, and I had an epiphany... Why do we need the W5 or any other Bluetooth receiver for normal wired IEMs (intentionally excluding Bluetooth cables like Shure and Westone have)?

Ultimately I am still managing my wires, carrying my phone or DAP... No matter how good LDAC or UAT are, clearly they are not better than wired - they may be almost indistinguishable to wires, but not better...

So why carry wired IEMs, carry my cell phone or DAP (as source for W5), carry the W5, and deal with very finicky BT connection quality / dropouts - all for connection quality that at best is no better than I could get wired straight to the source? What use cases am I missing?

I guess one answer is if the W5 or other Bluetooth receiver has a better DAC/Amp than your cell phone or DAP... another is in the case of no headphone jack available on your cell phone but even there I have to believe that the dongle based DACs with headphone connectors have to be pretty good... To me these are both pretty weak reasons...

Thoughts?

 

[Qazi Shehryar]

So, I have a bit of an off the wall question... I ask this as someone who already has the W5...

Yesterday I spent several hours with my W5 while I was out and about running errands, and I had an epiphany... Why do we need the W5 or any other Bluetooth receiver for normal wired IEMs (intentionally excluding Bluetooth cables like Shure and Westone have)?

Ultimately I am still managing my wires, carrying my phone or DAP... No matter how good LDAC or UAT are, clearly they are not better than wired - they may be almost indistinguishable to wires, but not better...

So why carry wired IEMs, carry my cell phone or DAP (as source for W5), carry the W5, and deal with very finicky BT connection quality / dropouts - all for connection quality that at best is no better than I could get wired straight to the source? What use cases am I missing?

I guess one answer is if the W5 or other Bluetooth receiver has a better DAC/Amp than your cell phone or DAP... another is in the case of no headphone jack available on your cell phone but even there I have to believe that the dongle based DACs with headphone connectors have to be pretty good... To me these are both pretty weak reasons...

Thoughts?

Very valid argument..... but the very advantage of these wireless amp is as you said that these bluetooth amps have better DAC/Amp than our cell phones .... you will consistently get the same sound quality regardless of how cheap or pathetic your smartphone is ..... moreover, not all phones support OTG to power up wired dongles/DACs/Amps hence the solution is these bluetooth very very portable DAC/amps which can pair up with almost all android/IOS smartphones..... yes you still have to deal with wires but its lesser wires compared to wired DAC/Amps .... You are quite right that these bluetooth amps can't match with the wired ones .... i mostly use my Creative SXFI amp and it triumphs over W5 w.r.t everything (power, signature, sound quality etc)....

Sounds good. But how many hours you can play continuesly with W5? Compare to ES100.

W5 itself has around 5 hours of battery backup as claimed by HiBY (still has to check this) .... however it comes with a very handy small charging cradle which acts like a power bank for W5 and can charge it 4 times giving 20 hours of battery backup .... downside is that you have to carry the cradle along for this ..... I have owned ES100 for around 1.5 years now and own W5 for merely 15 days but i love and prefer W5 due to its power and sound quality

 

[Pro-Jules]

So why carry wired IEMs, carry my cell phone or DAP (as source for W5), carry the W5, and deal with very finicky BT connection quality / dropouts - all for connection quality that at best is no better than I could get wired straight to the source? What use cases am I missing?
Thoughts?

I find it a drag to pull any device connected to headphone wires from my pockets. I would rather the wires lead to a BT receiver clipped near my top shirt button or collar or my shirt pocket or inside jacket pocket. Then I can pull my DAP or phone out of another pocket, mess around with it, put it back and not get wires snagged up. I can tuck wires under a shirt.

Also (as with ES100) in multi pair mode, call and message alerts interrupt the music (that good as I do 70% of my work on my phone and work remotely / anywhere) and I am able to seamlessly take a call without yanking an earpiece out and holding the phone up to my ear (losing the use of one hand for the duration of the call)

These are my use cases. People here have dubbed this mode "semi wireless". I am a fan.

 

[jsmiller58]

Very valid argument..... but the very advantage of these wireless amp is as you said that these bluetooth amps have better DAC/Amp than our cell phones .... you will consistently get the same sound quality regardless of how cheap or pathetic your smartphone is ..... moreover, not all phones support OTG to power up wired dongles/DACs/Amps hence the solution is these bluetooth very very portable DAC/amps which can pair up with almost all android/IOS smartphones..... yes you still have to deal with wires but its lesser wires compared to wired DAC/Amps .... You are quite right that these bluetooth amps can't match with the wired ones .... i mostly use my Creative SXFI amp and it triumphs over W5 w.r.t everything (power, signature, sound quality etc)....

I find it a drag to pull any device connected to headphone wires from my pockets. I would rather the wires lead to a BT receiver clipped near my top shirt button or collar or my shirt pocket or inside jacket pocket. Then I can pull my DAP or phone out of another pocket, mess around with it, put it back and not get wires snagged up. I can tuck wires under a shirt.

Also (as with ES100) in multi pair mode, call and message alerts interrupt the music (that good as I do 70% of my work on my phone and work remotely / anywhere) and I am able to seamlessly take a call without yanking an earpiece out and holding the phone up to my ear (losing the use of one hand for the duration of the call)

These are my use cases. People here have dubbed this mode "semi wireless". I am a fan.

Great arguments!

For me I have an LG v30 and R6 Pro, so I have good sources for my wired IEMs, but I can see that others may not, and they may not have dongles as options either, so that use case makes sense...

As to a phone free of wires... that is a very interesting observation...! I will have to use this more this way to see if this is my use model as well! The only issue with this is the poor connection quality with LDAC and UAT causing lots of drop outs and “static” when set at reasonably high quality levels and the distance more than even a few inches. I will need to play with this.

 

[Pro-Jules]

The distance for dropout for Hiby R6 pro & ES100 in highest quality LDAC is fine for walking around. Each component can be on separate sides of your body no problems.

 

[jsmiller58]

The distance for dropout for Hiby R6 pro & ES100 in highest quality LDAC is fine for walking around. Each component can be on separate sides of your body no problems.

I know it is probably implied in your comment, what data rates are you using on LDAC - 900 or 600?

 

[Pro-Jules]

It's not clear to me how to set LDAC for the highest on the HiBy. That's all I can see. I dont see the sort of options I had on my Fii0 M9 for "best connectivity" or "best sound quality" I understand there are 3 tiers of LDAC.
I am assuming the HiBy will do its best and downgrade the audio as distance increases.

Here is the display on the ES100

 

[jsmiller58]

It's not clear to me how to set LDAC for the highest on the HiBy. That's all I can see. I dont see the sort of options I had on my Fii0 M9 for "best connectivity" or "best sound quality" I understand there are 3 tiers of LDAC.
I am assuming the HiBy will do its best and downgrade the audio as distance increases.

Here is the display on the ES100

Try the HiBy Blue app - that will give you the information you want as well as finer grain control over the quality settings (and an EQ for good measure).

 

[shotgunshane]

Some quick thoughts on my W5 experience:

• SQ is fantastic with the Tanchjim Oxygen and Massdrop Plus
• Clip is useless for thicker garments, like belts and jean's pockets. Trying to fiddle with the clip is maddening as you accidentally press the button over and over. Anything other than shirt thickness need not apply.
• Touch operation seems half baked. Sometimes press and it's not registered. Would have preferred a simpler approach: physical buttons
• No volume operation on unit. There can be lag when changing volume on your phone. Take care and don't blow out your ears by pressing again and again thinking it's just not taking. It is, just seconds later.
• Bluetooth range just so so. Not as good as my BTR1K and ES100 experience but not terrible either. No issues if phone is in my pocket.
• Did I mention SQ is pretty damn good? At this early stage of use, I'll give it a slight edge over the ES100, which is already better than the Fiio.

 

[jsmiller58]

Some quick thoughts on my W5 experience:

• SQ is fantastic with the Tanchjim Oxygen and Massdrop Plus
• Clip is useless for thicker garments, like belts and jean's pockets. Trying to fiddle with the clip is maddening as you accidentally press the button over and over. Anything other than shirt thickness need not apply.
• Touch operation seems half baked. Sometimes press and it's not registered. Would have preferred a simpler approach: physical buttons
• No volume operation on unit. There can be lag when changing volume on your phone. Take care and don't blow out your ears by pressing again and again thinking it's just not taking. It is, just seconds later.
• Bluetooth range just so so. Not as good as my BTR1K and ES100 experience but not terrible either. No issues if phone is in my pocket.
• Did I mention SQ is pretty damn good? At this early stage of use, I'll give it a slight edge over the ES100, which is already better than the Fiio.

I agree - the touch control implemenation is a hot mess. I believe that the HiBy Blue app has an option to lock the haptic touch to a limited number of functions and introduces some delay to avoid the issue of affecting functionality by inadvertently touching it... if they had just done it that way to start it would have been perceived better...

 

[Pro-Jules]

I wonder if the 192K 24bit UAT Bluetooth audio integrity is preserved via the HiBy Blue app?

All that effort to transmit hi res UAT

I hope using the eq doesn't down-sample it

@Joe Bloggs are you able to get some info on this please?

Thanks.

 

[SilverEars]

So, I have a bit of an off the wall question... I ask this as someone who already has the W5...

Yesterday I spent several hours with my W5 while I was out and about running errands, and I had an epiphany... Why do we need the W5 or any other Bluetooth receiver for normal wired IEMs (intentionally excluding Bluetooth cables like Shure and Westone have)?

Ultimately I am still managing my wires, carrying my phone or DAP... No matter how good LDAC or UAT are, clearly they are not better than wired - they may be almost indistinguishable to wires, but not better...

So why carry wired IEMs, carry my cell phone or DAP (as source for W5), carry the W5, and deal with very finicky BT connection quality / dropouts - all for connection quality that at best is no better than I could get wired straight to the source? What use cases am I missing?

I guess one answer is if the W5 or other Bluetooth receiver has a better DAC/Amp than your cell phone or DAP... another is in the case of no headphone jack available on your cell phone but even there I have to believe that the dongle based DACs with headphone connectors have to be pretty good... To me these are both pretty weak reasons...

Thoughts?

Depends on whether or not the device fits a solution to a situation you want resolved. For example, I've been looking at BT iems for gym usage. I generally prefer wired as it's most reliable and to me, most convenient (since it's plug and play with no charging required, which another thing you'd have to worry about). I yanked the wire of my phone (happened more than once) at the gym while running, and I realized that I needed something without wires so that my hand doesn't yank the wire. But, also at the same time, there were various codecs and bit-rate out there, and wanted something reliable in terms of connection with high fidelity bit-rate. I did end up with a true wireless (Jabra 65t) due form factor being just right for gym usage, but I had to compromise due to true wireless codec being limited to ether SBC or AAC. It turned out the non-true wireless iems happens have more stable connections.

I was also looking at alternative options. Using Shanling M0 as an adaptor to make my iems wireless to be able to use my better sounding iems wirelessly. Still turned out 65t's convenience had more weight for gym usage.

I think UAT sounds quite interesting in this case due to the higher bit-rate. I know LDAC connection is not reliably stable, and can easily break up in certain environments, and given UAT is greater bit-rate, I'd have to be assured of it being capable of reliable connection (no breakage). Is UAT even supported yet? Shouldn't it be supported before releasing it? Why sell a product unfinished?

Personally, other than gym usage, I'd just go wired. Just too convenient (and stable) with all considered.