Headphone & Amp Impedance Questions? Find the answers here!

[theaudiologist1]

You are not a burden. People who reject information and insist on knowing better when they don't are a burden.

Thanks for the help, but at the end of the day I feel like my DAC/AMP sounds too quiet when listening to classical and the sound isn't "wide/full" outside the loudest moments. This is not the case with other genres. Is that my amp's problem?

Another thing: If I get balanced cables for my headphones, does the adapter also need to be balanced?

 

[71 dB]

Thanks for the help, but at the end of the day I feel like my DAC/AMP sounds too quiet when listening to classical and the sound isn't "wide/full" outside the loudest moments. This is not the case with other genres. Is that my amp's problem?

No, it should not be your amp's problem. If it plays loud parts well, it should have even easier to play the quieter parts. You are just expecting less dynamic sound than classical music is.

Another thing: If I get balanced cables for my headphones, does the adapter also need to be balanced?

What adapter are you talking about? Didn't your amp have a balanced output (4.4 Ω?)

 

[theaudiologist1]

No, it should not be your amp's problem. If it plays loud parts well, it should have even easier to play the quieter parts. You are just expecting less dynamic sound than classical music is.

Thanks. I guess it is just my ears and me having a "grass is greener" thought that a more powerful amp will make my classical recordings sound more "full".

What adapter are you talking about? Didn't your amp have a balanced output (4.4 Ω?)

Yes it does. My amp has a weird 4 pin mini-XLR as balanced. So I have to get balanced cables for my headphones and also get a 3.5/2.5mm to 4-pin mini-XLR.
btw how do you input the Ohm symbol?

 

[71 dB]

btw how do you input the Ohm symbol?

 

[71 dB]

Someone with more knowledge about he balanced connection stuff could jump in, because I don't think I can say anything of value on that.

 

[theaudiologist1]

I noticed my DSD files (SACD rips) are quieter than my PCM files (CD Rips) (or maybe it's just the mastering)

Or, as you just said recently, it's just the way classical is.

I checked. It's pretty much just classical, more specifically Romantic that's quiet. Some of my non-Classical SACD's are still quieter than my PCM music, even the very dynamic PCM ones, but they're still less quiet than Romantic. Even Baroque and Classical were less quiet.

 

[Sinistrail]

At what point will the loss of volume/dynamic range/frequency response be apparent due to underpowering?
I was fancying this flat pair of headphones, but I'd end up connect it to something which is rated about 15 Ohms lower. That's a really negligible amount, right? Or is it not/it's too hard to measure with just this data?

 

[71 dB]

At what point will the loss of volume/dynamic range/frequency response be apparent due to underpowering?
I was fancying this flat pair of headphones, but I'd end up connect it to something which is rated about 15 Ohms lower. That's a really negligible amount, right? Or is it not/it's too hard to measure with just this data?

The ratio of headphone and amp output impedances is more relevant than absolute values. Are you connecting 16 Ω cans to 1 Ω amp or 300 Ω cans to 285 Ω amp?

 

[AxeMadman81]

Hi Guys, I need Your Help
I've an ALL IN ONE Ampli+Dac by FX-AUDIO
The model is FX-AUDIO X6MKII
Taking a look at the specs I've found this:

No chance to find The Output impedence of The Amplifier,I've find This

Output Power 940 mW @ 16 Ohms, 900 mW @ 32 Ohms, 700 mW @ 64 Ohms, 450 mW @ 120 Ohms, 200 mW @ 300 Ohms.

My question is: Is this Amplifier capable to drive HD600 safely?

I'm using this calculator

Power Needed

Safe 85 db 0.07 mW
Moderate 100 db 1.98 mW
Fairly Loud 110 db 20.01 mW
Very Loud 115 db 63.08 mW
Painful 120 db 199.69 mW

If I f I have correctly interpreted the numbers, to manage the Peak of Volume, I need 199.69 mw
My amp is able to manage 200mw at 300 ohm
Is it correct?

Thanks

 

[Sinistrail]

The ratio of headphone and amp output impedances is more relevant than absolute values. Are you connecting 16 Ω cans to 1 Ω amp or 300 Ω cans to 285 Ω amp?

Eheh... I know I phrased it really badly. The headphones are 63 Ohms.

 

[hamcha]

I got a simple two for a not-so-smart noobie on old equipment and hopeful holiday addition.

• Does an old vintage receiver (Kenwood KR-9400) have enough power to get the most out of the Sennheiser HD 600 or Hifiman Sundara?
• Does the Little Dot 1+ have enough power to get the most out of the Sennheiser HD 600 or Hifiman Sundara?

Thank you!!!

 

[harry501501]

So a few non technical questions on DACs and amps.

1) I just bought the FIIO K5 Pro ESS and really enjoying it. It has three gains. When you go from one gain to the other, are you only adding power/volume?

E.g. I listen to my FIIO FD5 on LOW at 30%. I press to MEDIUM at same volume it's louder, at HIGH louder still. So is the increase in 'loudness' at 30% basically the whole point of a gain setting? OR is that added power to bring out the best in your headphone... E.g. tighter bass, more air, etc?

2) I read sometimes people saying a "good DAC should let you hear your gear and not the DAC", similar for headphone amps. I also read that different headphone AMPs should have no effect on your headphone gear, except for power. Which of these is more likely tho to have an impact on sound e.g. smoother, brighter, etc (dac or amp)? Or is it both equally? I do hear a difference between my SMSL DAC with AK4993 and FIIO with ESS for example. A lot of information and opinions seem very contradictory at times depending on the person. Very confusing.

 

[castleofargh]

I see no indication of a change in impedance with a different gain setting, so most likely it just makes sound louder on the higher settings.
There can be different reasons to use gain settings, but often enough it’s to optimize things and make an amplifier easier to use with a wider range of headphones and perhaps IEM. It's nice to have gain settings but they don’t make your car go faster and won’t shoot lasers. It’s about voltage gain, which correlates with loudness(twice the voltage makes the music 6dB louder).
I don’t know that device, but there is a rule of thumb for gain that tends to apply to almost all amps sections:
Because higher gain almost always means higher noise, even though it’s rarely important and often inaudible, objectively speaking you should probably try to stick to the lowest gain value that manages to gives you enough loudness with a given transducer.
Also, depending on how the volume level is handled, it’s possible for the volume knob to show bigger channel imbalance near the lowest volume position. At a lower gain you have to turn the knob up and often avoid or reduce channel imbalance.

 

[gregorio]

In addition to what castleofargh stated:

I also read that different headphone AMPs should have no effect on your headphone gear, except for power.

This is correct. However, there are a few exceptions, tube amps will commonly add audible distortion and so can a solid state amp if it’s the wrong amp for your HPs, for example if it’s underpowered and you have to run it at or near max gain.

Which of these is more likely tho to have an impact on sound e.g. smoother, brighter, etc (dac or amp)? Or is it both equally? I do hear a difference between my SMSL DAC with AK4993 and FIIO with ESS for example.

With the above exceptions for amps, plus a NOS DAC for DACs, no amp or DAC should have any “impact on sound”. Or more precisely, there is a minuscule impact on the sound but not enough to be audible.

A lot of information and opinions seem very contradictory at times depending on the person. Very confusing.

That’s because psychoacoustics comes into play, the science of the perception of sound. For example, if we play music at a low level, it will obviously be quieter but it will also appear to change balance, it will seem to have less bass and treble, even though the balance hasn’t changed at all. This effect has been studied in detail for nearly a century and first published in the early 1930’s (Fletcher/Munson Equal Loudness Contours) and audiophiles can have many different ways of describing this perceived balance change: Richer, brighter, smoother, etc.

In addition there is a psychoacoustic effect which is closely related to the “placebo effect”; if we see or know a different piece of equipment is being used, our brain will often create a difference in our hearing perception to reflect this, even though there is no audible difference. If and what this (imagined/placebo) difference will be, varies from person to person, which is why there are different and often “very contradictory” perceptions and opinions. Unfortunately, audiophiles typically do not accept they, like all other humans, are subject to this “placebo effect” and therefore have to invent information to explain this audible difference in sound that doesn’t actually exist, which is why that information is often “very contradictory” and “confusing”.

G

 

[bigshot]

The biggest error I see audiophiles make is thinking that if they are aware of expectation bias, they can consciously suppress it by just listening more carefully. That belief shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the placebo effect. You can't eliminate human nature by force of will.