Have $750.00 for new source.
Jan 2, 2004 at 3:12 AM Post #2 of 49
I guess that depends on how much you "hate" the sound of the NAD 541i and how quickly you can accumulate more funds. If it is a matter of just a couple of months to add say, $400 or $500 I'd save rather than buy now. At $1200 you could get the SACDMods Sony 555ES or check out the used market as I think that amount might get more than $750. I haven't heard any of the Shanling models myself but they have gotten some good reviews.
 
Jan 2, 2004 at 5:45 AM Post #6 of 49
Quote:

Originally posted by Brad Harper
I was considering a level 1+ upgraded Music Hall CD25 or maybe a used Cary 308. Any help would be appreciated. Should I wait until I can afford Shanling?

I am currently using a NAD 541i, but I really hate the thin sound, although, it does sound good for HDCD. This would be placed in main rig with Audio Valve RKV MK2 and HD600/Cardas phones.


Just basically went through this myself. I read allot of reviews both editorial and personal. Some of my conclusions.

A buddy of mine choose a Jolida CD Player (tube), compared to a level-1 mod Music Hall I believe a tube source is a better choice. Especially if you don’t have any tube equipment. Changing (rolling) tubes can greatly alter the sound. Tubes for sources or preamps are not expensive at all, even rare vintage tubes are cheap in retrospect.
If you feel the highs are too bright, change the tube. Bass too muddy? Change the tube. Basically the source can sound a dozen different ways by just swapping tubs of different brands. A Music Hall or Sony is going to sound the way it is and that’s it, good or bad. SACD and DVD-A are too analytical for my taste, no robustness or soul, if you mind. If you are living with a mid-fi home theater system with multiple speakers and subs, DVD-A, SACD or HDCD could be fun for a while. If you are building a fairly serious 2-channel system and already have hundreds of CD’s then you will not give a rats ass for SACD or any other new format after the 1-week novelty wears off. Soon enough DA converters will mature enough for the Hi-Fi market (if they haven’t already) but until recently even 20 and 24 bit processors were frowned upon.

I had a mid-fi Denon DVD Player (24/96) which sounded ok. I decided to look for a higher quality hi-fi DA component ‘used’ from eBay or Audiogon.com. For under $500 I found a very nice California Audio Labs DA converter with a single tube output stage fitted with a vintage Telefunken tube ($100+ value) and an excellent quality Burr Brown 24-bit/96kHz upgrade board. I use my existing DVD Player as a transport with a MIT Terminator3 digital cable. I also use the units optical input from my PC that blows any audio sound card – I also have an M-Audio Delta410 and a Revolution 7.1. The intel onboard digital optical out through a glass optical cable is 10X’s better.
I am not an audio snob and I do like the 24-bit Burr Brown converters, I think they are more detailed and have great imaging and presence. I could have found a more discrete dual tube DAC or player that was 18-bit or 20-bit for about the same as I spent, but as with all things, a 24-bit, dual tube DAC or Player from CAL or similar level brands were closer to $2000 new and still sell for half that or more used today.

I have a Bryston Preamp and a buddy of mine with the Jolida has a Conrad Johnson pre and a Headsave headphone amp. We both have Sennheiser HD600’s (he has the Zu Mobius cable and I’m still looking for one). In comparing the CAL DAC to the Jolida, I’d say there both surpurb and are very musical. He stuffed a set of vintage Mullard tubes in the Jolida and tried a handful of Russian, Asian and American tubes as well. Each tube had its own significant sound. My CAL with the Telefunken has great sound stage depth with very good bass extension and clarity, the Jolida with the Mullard has a more forcefull midrange for vocals with a fast high end and is also a transport.

From what I have read of people comparing these units with ones from Music Hall, Denon and Sony, even with modifications they don’t appear to have the level of robustness as a Carry or a Rouge. But then again, the price of these units are twice that. My California Audio Labs is about 3 years old and with its upgrades cost close to $1000 without a transport. A Jolida with Mullards is close to the same but sound more like $1500-$2000 players.

I think staying away from brands like Denon, Sony, NEC and the such is a step towards Hi-Fi. Brands like Music Hall can satisfy your taste for HiFi if that’s what you’re looking for but will lack the flexibility of a tube component. Brands like Rough and Shanling are very nice but come with a price.

BTW: the stock tubes that shipped with the Jolida are horrible. If I were to judge the sound of this player by the stock tube, I’d tell you it sucks!! But, pull the stock Asian tubes and stuff in a pair of 1960’s Mullards and you have something very special that the Music Hall can’t compare to. It will all NOW depend on what you listen to. If your taste is not that fussy and you like bright, in-your-face highs and listen to Metalica and/or classic rock exclusively, buy a Sony – You’ll love it. If your more into the hobby and like to listen with passion, tubes will give you the flexibility – more so then cable rolling, which is another story.

I listen to a very wide assortment of music. I love Led Zeppelin but adour Joss Stone and Frank Sinatra as well as Holly Cole and Vivaldi. It makes it even more difficult to find a happy medium. However, if I’m in a female vocalist mood I’ll leave my Telefunkens in place, if my choice of listening shifts to Led Zeppelin, Van Hallen and Judas Priest, then I may want to use a Russian tube. Its easy as pie to change and cheap enough. If my Music Hall sounds great playing Michael Buble but sucks with Janes Addition then I’m just ****ed. Know what I mean?
 
Jan 2, 2004 at 12:25 PM Post #7 of 49
The only advice I will give you is to be patient. Why buy something now when you know it's not what you really want. If your heart is set on the Shanling, you will never be happy until you get it. I always feel that you should wait until you can afford what you really want. I personally think you should save the extra 5 to 6 hundred dollars and get either the Shanling (Used) or the Sacdmods 555. I wanted the 555 for five months before I had the money to get it (And this is just the player itself). I was very tempted to get a Music Hall, an NAD, a 222ES and even a CE775. Fortunately I had the patience to wait it out. Now I have the 555 and I'm shipping to Sacdmods in 2 weeks for the mods. I might have been OK with one of the lesser players but in my heart, I would have always wanted the 555. So glad I waited.

Anyway, good luck.
 
Jan 2, 2004 at 3:40 PM Post #8 of 49
You guys are right of course. If I just get something to tide me over then I will sell it in a year for something else. I could sell one of my Neumann microphones that has not seen any use in the past years to come up with the rest of the cash and that is what I will probably do. I am selling the NAD 541i that I have been listening to and repaired my Denon so that it is functioning for me now until I can decide. I think I like the sound of my Sony D303 portable better than either of these units.

I appreceate the comments. I do have tubes in line with the Audio Valve RKV MK2 amplifier, but I am certainly considering tubed CD players as well. The Shanling is a very exotic looking piece and the Cary and Jolida are exciting options for me as well.

The 555ES seems like a good way to go as does the Shanling. I have read mixed reviews on the Jolida but have never heard it myself. I am sure it is a far better source than what I listen to.

Brad
 
Jan 2, 2004 at 3:44 PM Post #9 of 49
I have owned both the level 1+ music hall cd25 and Shanling CDT100. In my opinion, the music hall is very close to the Shanling, I would say about 95% of the shanling. The music hall is more aggressive, has more energy, while the shanling is smoother, more refined, and slightly warmer. They are so close that it's hard to justify the $500 difference. The Shanling just looks a tad sexier, if that matters to you. I'd say go for the Music Hall if you can't wait, get a taste of the Shanling sound (the cd25 is a Shanling afterall), if you like it then move on to the CDT100 if you feel you want the extra 5% in performance.
 
Jan 2, 2004 at 4:15 PM Post #11 of 49
I didn't really like the Jolida. It's too laid back for my taste, slow, not as accurate, and soundstage is not as wide as the Music Hall or Shanling. It does however have a very sweet midrange.

If you like an aggressive, accurate type of sound, the Music Hall or Shanling is for you. If you like a laid back, warm, smooth sound, then the Jolida might fit you. Out of the three, I preferred the Shanling the most, then the Music Hall and lastly the Jolida.

If you can stretch your budget to $1000-1100, you can find a used Meridian 508.20 on Audiogon. It has both the sonic qualities of the Shanling/Music Hall and the Jolida. A very neutral player, yet fun to listen to.
 
Jan 2, 2004 at 4:39 PM Post #12 of 49
Quote:

Originally posted by Xeno7651
I didn't really like the Jolida. It's too laid back for my taste, slow, not as accurate, and soundstage is not as big as the Music Hall or Shanling. It does however have a very sweet midrange.

If you like an aggressive, accurate type of sound, the Music Hall or Shanling is for you. If you like a laid back, warm, smooth sound, then the Jolida might fit you. Out of the three, I preferred the Shanling the most, then the Music Hall and lastly the Jolida.

If you can stretch your budget to $1000-1100, you can find a used Meridian 508.20 on Audiogon. It has both the sonic qualities of the Shanling/Music Hall and the Jolida. A very neutral player, yet fun to listen to. I would say it's a step above the Shanling and a step or two above the Music Hall and Jolida.


Did you hear it with the stock tubes? If you did then you didn't hear the Jolida, the stock tubes suck!!
Stick a set of Mullards or RCA's in and it’s an entirely different animal. Can you do that with the Music Hall? That’s why it’s almost impossible to review a tube component.


http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/jolida-jd100_e.html
 
Jan 3, 2004 at 3:11 AM Post #14 of 49
NEW BUDGET.

I am liquidating some audio gear that rarely gets used so my budget has increased to $1500.00. Now were talking.

What say yee now?
biggrin.gif
 
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