[Letmebefrank]

For the record I have never had a problem with any of my Schiit dacs over USB. Modi 2 Uber, modi multibit and Fulla 2; all working flawlessly.

 

[Jimster480]

For the record I have never had a problem with any of my Schiit dacs over USB. Modi 2 Uber, modi multibit and Fulla 2; all working flawlessly.

Yep but it all depends on your USB hardware and connectivity. Because if you read through these threads, I'm far from the only one to have issues.
There were alot of mixed reviews on the Fulla2 also due to the same thing, people having issues with the USB.

But its the same in this thread too and the bimby and the modi/magni thread. I did alot of research, so its obviously an issue overall with their USB implementation, it either works for you or it doesn't. Those who have the issues haven't really been able to fix them from what I have seen, and most are just using different methods of connectivity now like optical or coax (nothing you can do with the fulla2 though).

 

[winders]

  Yep but it all depends on your USB hardware and connectivity. Because if you read through these threads, I'm far from the only one to have issues.
There were alot of mixed reviews on the Fulla2 also due to the same thing, people having issues with the USB.

But its the same in this thread too and the bimby and the modi/magni thread. I did alot of research, so its obviously an issue overall with their USB implementation, it either works for you or it doesn't. Those who have the issues haven't really been able to fix them from what I have seen, and most are just using different methods of connectivity now like optical or coax (nothing you can do with the fulla2 though).

Don't conflate preference for using a different input than USB with the USB implementation being flawed. Those are two very different things. The USB input on my Modi Multibit and Yggdrasil both work fine. I just happen to think the SPDIF coax input sounds better. You will find that people with all kinds of DACs feel the same way. They prefer one of the other inputs on their DAC over using USB.

 

[Jimster480]

 
Don't conflate preference for using a different input than USB with the USB implementation being flawed. Those are two very different things. The USB input on my Modi Multibit and Yggdrasil both work fine. I just happen to think the SPDIF coax input sounds better. You will find that people with all kinds of DACs feel the same way. They prefer one of the other inputs on their DAC over using USB.

I'm not confusing them. I read through 100 pages basically and saw the issues people were having and the recommendations given.
Those who choose to use SPDIF from the get go aren't factored in.
 
Yggdrasil has a different input/chipset than Modi Multibit. Modi has the same input as the Fulla2.

 

[darkarn]

 
Yes it seems that Schiit's USB implementation is well Schiit....
But in the audio department they surely deliver, when I finally get a mimby ill run it off of optical or coax.

 
I can see what you mean there; while playing from the iPad is very easy since I don't need an USB hub (unlike any other USB DACs I see), I have a bit of problem using it on my computer. But hey, at least you get to use Schiit ASIO driver instead of having to find other ASIO driver if using optical or coaxial. It's a give and take I'll say

 

[Jimster480]

   
I can see what you mean there; while playing from the iPad is very easy since I don't need an USB hub (unlike any other USB DACs I see), I have a bit of problem using it on my computer. But hey, at least you get to use Schiit ASIO driver instead of having to find other ASIO driver if using optical or coaxial. It's a give and take I'll say

Everything is give and take, but for right now I am just enjoying my Topping stack.

 

[winders]

 
I'm not confusing them. I read through 100 pages basically and saw the issues people were having and the recommendations given.
Those who choose to use SPDIF from the get go aren't factored in.
 
Yggdrasil has a different input/chipset than Modi Multibit. Modi has the same input as the Fulla2.

The crappier the USB signal coming from the computer, the worse any DAC will perform. That's why all the decrapifiers exist. Not because all the DACs in the world suck at USB. It's because there are bunch of crappy USB implementations out there!
 
With my MacBook Pro, I have used the USB cable that Schiit sells with both my Modi Multibit and my Yggdrasil. Both work just fine. As I have stated previously, both sound a bit better using the Singxer F-1 and a SPDIF coax cable. I chalk this up to the Singxer F-1 isolating the DACs from the DC power noise and by providing the DACs proper well formed and clean digital signals.  

 

[Jimster480]

 
The crappier the USB signal coming from the computer, the worse any DAC will perform. That's why all the decrapifiers exist. Not because all the DACs in the world suck at USB. It's because there are bunch of crappy USB implementations out there!
 
With my MacBook Pro, I have used the USB cable that Schiit sells with both my Modi Multibit and my Yggdrasil. Both work just fine. As I have stated previously, both sound a bit better using the Singxer F-1 and a SPDIF coax cable. I chalk this up to the Singxer F-1 isolating the DACs from the DC power noise and by providing the DACs proper well formed and clean digital signals.  

Most of the decrapifier's are simply snake oil.
The only actual problems with USB comes from the quality of power really. This is especially tricky in laptops and other lower end desktops where USB power isn't isolated (why do you think there are pops while loading web pages, or doing heavy tasks?) and as such the voltage across the board is more linear so when the CPU clocks up (which most CPU's adjust speeds atleast 1 time per second now if not upto 1 million times per second) this affects power usage and can cause the power to dip on USB devices.
The affect on your audio device really depends on how sensitive it is to these voltage changes.

Async USB has been a thing for quite some time and speeds and reliability are through the roof and have been for a long time.
The audio industry needs to invent problems to fix because the reality is that $10 chips and $5 OP Amps are all you actually need to be able to have perfect clarity in all music.
 
My Fulla2 just doesn't work properly with either of my laptops (but its much worse on this Sandy i7 quad core laptop) especially as other things are going on in the background or the system is under more stress (for me thats the entire time I am using it basically). Even with the external power it still pops and cracks regularly.
Now I have a FiiO K1 and that has literally 0 problems on the same laptop, listening for 8 hours or more I might have heard one small skip but in all honesty its hard to say if thats the fault of spotify or the K1.
I got my Topping D30/A30 stack setup and that is using XMOS for its USB implementation, 0 issues there aswell and I've listened to it for around 9 hours total now between the 2 days.

 

[winders]

 
Most of the decrapifier's are simply snake oil.
The only actual problems with USB comes from the quality of power really. This is especially tricky in laptops and other lower end desktops where USB power isn't isolated (why do you think there are pops while loading web pages, or doing heavy tasks?) and as such the voltage across the board is more linear so when the CPU clocks up (which most CPU's adjust speeds atleast 1 time per second now if not upto 1 million times per second) this affects power usage and can cause the power to dip on USB devices.
The affect on your audio device really depends on how sensitive it is to these voltage changes.

Async USB has been a thing for quite some time and speeds and reliability are through the roof and have been for a long time.
The audio industry needs to invent problems to fix because the reality is that $10 chips and $5 OP Amps are all you actually need to be able to have perfect clarity in all music.
 
My Fulla2 just doesn't work properly with either of my laptops (but its much worse on this Sandy i7 quad core laptop) especially as other things are going on in the background or the system is under more stress (for me thats the entire time I am using it basically). Even with the external power it still pops and cracks regularly.
Now I have a FiiO K1 and that has literally 0 problems on the same laptop, listening for 8 hours or more I might have heard one small skip but in all honesty its hard to say if thats the fault of spotify or the K1.
I got my Topping D30/A30 stack setup and that is using XMOS for its USB implementation, 0 issues there aswell and I've listened to it for around 9 hours total now between the 2 days.

Well, I guess we will never see eye to eye. Because I know there are more problems with USB than just power. USB signals generated by computers are often out of balance, have jitter, and have impedance mismatched. Of course having the noise on the DC power line contaminate the DAC is bad too. If you want to use USB, I think a device like the up coming UpTone Audio ISO Regen powered by the UpTone Audio LPS-1 is ideal. It acts to isolate the PC from the audio equipment and provides the DAC with a near perfect USB packet sequence. I plan on using the ISO Regen between my MacBook Pro and Singxer F-1.
 
You think too simplistically if you think all you need a is a few $5 and $10 chips to have "perfect clarity in all music".
 
I don't have a Fulla 2 nor do I anticipate ever owning one. All I can do is comment on the DACs I have owned.

 

[bigro]

Have you guys checked you USB Power Management? USB Selective suspend in windows has cause issues in the past.

 

[jcn3]

just want to chime in that i also have NEVER had any problems with USB on schiit dacs.  i used a bifrost uber and gumby on win7, win8, and win10 on at least four different pcs.  never a single issue.  i've used usb direct from pc and through an uptone regen.

 

[RickB]

I can say I've had no playback problems with USB under Windows 10 on my laptop. The only reason I use a Wyrd in my chain is that the sound is less sharp sounding with it in place. 

 

[Jimster480]

Well, I guess we will never see eye to eye. Because I know there are more problems with USB than just power. USB signals generated by computers are often out of balance, have jitter, and have impedance mismatched. Of course having the noise on the DC power line contaminate the DAC is bad too. If you want to use USB, I think a device like the up coming UpTone Audio ISO Regen powered by the UpTone Audio LPS-1 is ideal. It acts to isolate the PC from the audio equipment and provides the DAC with a near perfect USB packet sequence. I plan on using the ISO Regen between my MacBook Pro and Singxer F-1.

You think too simplistically if you think all you need a is a few $5 and $10 chips to have "perfect clarity in all music".

I don't have a Fulla 2 nor do I anticipate ever owning one. All I can do is comment on the DACs I have owned.

Jitter is a timing error.
Digital signals don't have impedance.
Since USB is a serial interface packets should normally go in the right order, but when they don't this is fixed via the USB interface chips, just like your network cards fix packet sequences through the Internet.
Additionally SPDIF has jitter but it can be even harder to fix due to it being a proprietary interface largely dependent on 2 base clocks. But even then the job is more than acceptable.

Audio data is not large by any means and compared to today's USB implementations / specs doesn't even use 1% of the available bandwidth.

As far as audio reproduction... Well there are various products from various companies that all achieve the same audio quality using various "qualities" or classes of chips.
The warmth in a sound comes from the analog section of a DAC or the AMP itself, it depends on the chips and op amps chosen and beyond that it's all down to implementation.

 

[Jimster480]

Have you guys checked you USB Power Management? USB Selective suspend in windows has cause issues in the past.

I have already played around with that. The problems are not software but power filtering in the motherboard and USB hub chipset choice.

 

[darkarn]

I took the easy way out and used the onboard optical and coaxial for Windows instead, leaving the USB for Mac and iOS