Gustard X22 DAC

Discussion in 'Dedicated Source Components' started by mtoc, Nov 3, 2017.
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  1. peteg
    I was looking at the LKS and was pretty close to ordering it but it just seemed problematic, I've never had a problem with Gustard (U12,X12,X20 and listened to X20pro). I'm not the type to scream it's the best thing since sliced bread, but to me it is a upgrade over the previous models. But at the end of the day we ALL have our personal preferences.
     
  2. allhifi
    " ...But this could be the consequence of to much simplifying circuit design and some poor components I mentioned before..."

    Hmmm, have you ever "peeked" inside a Chord DAC, or Calyx 'Femto', Berkeley 'Alpha DAC Series-2 MQA', shown here; http://www.berkeleyaudiodesign.com/alpha-dac-reference-series-2/
    or Bricasti's sensational M-1 SE, MSB? (and several other ultra-primo $10K-$20K US$ examples I've missed), or even the highly regarded (and reasonably priced) Mytek 'Brooklyn +'' ($2,200. US$) ?

    In all cases, a look inside (virtually all mentioned) will reveal a startingly 'bare' interior composition ! Coincidence? Nothing to it/no reason for it ?

    Sooo, when I hear/read: " ... simplifying circuit design and some poor components .... YOU mentioned before" , I must take exception to a clearly naive understanding of what constitutes premium design/sound.

    Additionally, Peteg is gracious enough to share his immediate -and continuing- SQ observations that we should be grateful for (these insights).
    At the 100-hour mark, I suspect he might be 50% on the way to a 200-300 hour requirement (I'm guessing).

    I'll also venture to say that the X-22 will be considerably superior to the (already impressive) X-20PRO, once fully settled.

    pj
     
  3. allhifi
    Hi peteg: Thank you for sharing. Vibrapods (with/out metal ball component ?)

    I suspect your X-22 will be clarly superior to the X-20PRO once fully settled (200-300 hours?). To expedite "burn-in" may I recommend that you (over the course of the first week) get it to 'operating temps', ten turn OFF (for 5-15 minutes), fire back up and let play (signal through) for the next 5-10 hours, turn OFF again, repeat and so forthfor a few days. I assure you, upon every 're-start ' you'll notice clear improvements.

    Looking forard to continuing SQ observations (X-22). Have you by chance had the opportunity to evaluate the LKS MDX-004?

    Thanks again,

    pj
     
  4. peteg
    Vibrapods do not have Metal balls, they are rubber-plastic pads. There is a lot of different isolators out there and most work very good.

    I've never tried the off-on method to burn-in gear but I'll start today. X22 is definitely sounding non-fatiguing /digital and more air this morning.

    Never heard the LKS MDX-004, looked for it at the last RMAF/Canjam.
     
  5. rafabro
    Yes I have. Many times. You missed Accuphase DC-950, Gryphon, ECS, Esoteric, Meitner. And many more highend DACs. It doesn't mean X22 will play at same level of SQ.
    They don't over complicate design.

    btw MSB it is ladder dac, not delta-sigma. No point to compare design.

    Anyway, I was expecting 2 x 9038pro from Gustard.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  6. Byang
    After some burning in, a little warmer. Also, found balaced outputs produce better high frequencies.this tells that single ened output has extra low quality capacitor in signal path,mod would tell the truth. I will post once mod done
     
  7. allhifi
    A premature, ridiculous comment (pre break-in). Was that said in effort to encourage peteg from posting impressions (that I requested) as the unit is breaking in ?
    It's clear to see that some don't understand the (far from linear) 'Break-in Blues'. Experience (vast) teaches us it's unpredictable going through various stages until complete. More so in this case with a brand-new skew/model.
    (I'll guess the X-22 will be in the 200-300 hour mark tops -likely closer to 200 until it settles. Even then, further improvements may be evident over the course of the following two weeks).

    Thank you for posting peteg.

    pj
     
  8. allhifi
    Understood.

    Thank you.

    pj
     
  9. DBB1
    No need for hostility by calling my comment ridiculous. It was simply a comment on how it sounds after 100 hours. I never said it did not need more break in or the 100 hour sound was the last word. I said I looked forward to the next installment.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  10. allhifi
    Hi peteg: Yes (Vibrapods), I think I understand the two types of Vibrapods -one rubber (circular, while the other -Vibrapod- a cone shaped rubber device (with ball at the end) that integrates with the round, rubber Vibrapod. I'll take a look and send/reference a link.

    Cheers,

    pj

    (P.S. BREAK-IN: The first few days turning ON (then OFF briefly -15minutes), then ON for many hours, OFF, repeat has expedited 'break-in' for so many different devices (including cables) I'd be interested in your impressions. Specifically, it would be the "charging/heating " of internal parts, then 'draining' the energy/heat -cool down, re-heat, repeat. This of course will electrically (and micro-mechanically) "loosen" the internal parts; stress/release, heat/cold I believe highly effective in the first few days of use).
     
  11. DBB1
    delete
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  12. allhifi
    There's no hostility, choose words more considerately: " Interesting. It seem to me that the X22 is disappointing after 100 hours since I've read comments where the x20 and x20 pro was beating the Yggy. I'm looking forward to the next installment."

    If one understands the diversity (and necessity) of break-in 'dynamics' -particularly with the X-20PRO (Gustard) that by near all accounts requires 300 + hours, it's therefore strange to use "disappointment" when it's near universally understood what a truly bizzare (but painfully real) phenomenon burn-in time /sound generates. And at 100-hours, some "ugliness" may surface. Additionally, peteg invested $1,000. (US$) -it'd be nice to offer some support & encouragement considering his kind consideration to share these initial observations.

    If I were to comment (to peteg), I'd say " Great, the most painful hours are behind you -nothing but greater things to look forward to ...."

    I strongly suspect the X-22 will be considerably superior to the (already impressive) X-20PRO.
    Designer;'s learn a thing or two as the industry evolves (exponentially it seems) particularly concerning digital processing techniques/understanding.
    The era of digital's complete superiority (over analog/vinyl) is before us. By no means a knock on vinyl, it kept (and keeps) us thoroughly and genuinely entertained (particularly through CD's dark age's -982-1999). And of course, today as well.

    pj

    P.S. Happy New Year to all !
     
  13. allhifi
    Good additional examples. However, I know not whether those have a more simple (or populated) internal architecture as the ones I listed.

    The point a simple one; many of the DAC's I listed have/use a minimalist design approach. I mentioned this in response to the chap who claimed the X-22 was inferior to the X-20 due to his equating a populated internal chassis with premium sound. Clearly this is not the case.

    pj
     
  14. DBB1
    A fine example of pompous, pretentious, and condescending bloviating. I look forward to reading your white paper on "break-in dynamics". Yes there is a self-important hostility in your words, if one understands the terms. Please be courteous to the others on this forum and when you disagree don't accuse people of being ridiculous and not choosing words considerately. Simply say something like: "I don't think the sound at 100 hours is significant, but of course you acknowledged that by saying you looked forward to the next installment". No need for personal attacks. Kindly do not reply. I don't think we need trolling.
     
  15. allhifi
    " A fine example of pompous, pretentious, and condescending bloviating" (lol)

    A couple things|:

    1) You sure it's a fine example ?
    2) I'll have to look up "bloviating" ! (did you too -how long did it take you to find that "just-right" word?)

    And thirdly, Happy New Year ! ....

    pj
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2018
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