Gustard U18
Jan 19, 2023 at 8:43 PM Post #1,456 of 1,991
What is this? On which devices do you use it?
Mini grounding boxes. The idea behind grounding boxes is they provide an effective and clean ground to offload electrical noise in the system such as from EMI, and the ability to do so at multiple points in a signal chain. See here https://quartzacoustic.com/audio-ground-box-the-whys-and-the-hows/

I understand they typically they weigh 2kg or more like the linked Quartz Acoustics ones (recommended up-thread I believe), whereas these guys I got are teensy - just 45 grams each. Even so, they're apparently effective, based on a lot of positive feedback on AliX and from memory one or two on forums here.

I understand you can connect them to any and all pieces of equipment in a hifi system chain (which is why I got a range of connectors), though some may benefit more than others. It's a bit of an experiment, If I find them effective I'll likely try a Quartz Acoustics 2kg number.
 
Jan 19, 2023 at 8:52 PM Post #1,457 of 1,991
Mini grounding boxes. The idea behind grounding boxes is they provide an effective and clean ground to offload electrical noise in the system such as from EMI, and the ability to do so at multiple points in a signal chain. See here https://quartzacoustic.com/audio-ground-box-the-whys-and-the-hows/

I understand they typically they weigh 2kg or more like the linked Quartz Acoustics ones (recommended up-thread I believe), whereas these guys I got are teensy - just 45 grams each. Even so, they're apparently effective, based on a lot of positive feedback on AliX and from memory one or two on forums here.

I understand you can connect them to any and all pieces of equipment in a hifi system chain (which is why I got a range of connectors), though some may benefit more than others. It's a bit of an experiment, If I find them effective I'll likely try a Quartz Acoustics 2kg number.
On the Ali cables thread, there are some contributors who make their ground boxes with obscure alchemy formulas.
The ones on your picture seem smaller, and easy to use.
Where did you order them?
 
Jan 19, 2023 at 8:56 PM Post #1,458 of 1,991
On the Ali cables thread, there are some contributors who make their ground boxes with obscure alchemy formulas.
The ones on your picture seem smaller, and easy to use.
Where did you order them?
There's a hyperlink to the AliX product page at the top of my first post - here it is again -the 18AWG version.

Edit - what is it about AliExpress breaking copied hyperlinks, not letting you easily share or copy em... (I even logged out before copying it)

Ground box.JPG
 
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Jan 19, 2023 at 9:15 PM Post #1,459 of 1,991
There's a hyperlink to the AliX product page at the top of my first post - here it is again -the 18AWG version.

Edit - what is it about AliExpress breaking copied hyperlinks, not letting you easily share or copy em... (I even logged out before copying it)

Ground box.JPG
Thank you for the information.
And do these cables have a beneficial effect without the clumsy gounding box?
 
Jan 19, 2023 at 9:24 PM Post #1,460 of 1,991
Thank you for the information.
And do these cables have a beneficial effect without the clumsy gounding box?
I very much doubt it - presume you mean just the wires, not the boxes of earth like material which acts as the ground. Assuming the full boxes/tubes have an effect of course. I've not tried them here, and it's approaching Friday evening here in NZ, so that may be a tomorrow thing. Will keep you posted.

I'd welcome any advice from experienced users of these as to how to best use them. e.g. for the U18 (token ref to get slightly back on topic :smile:) how do you attach them?
 
Jan 19, 2023 at 9:52 PM Post #1,461 of 1,991
Look what just arrived. The 18AWG version. Just dipping my toes in these waters, but as they're affordable enough I thought in for a penny, in for a pound - get enough to connect them simultaneously to everything.

Realise there's a dedicated thread for grounding etc, but thought a few of you guys might appreciate this.

20230120_124535.jpg
How did you order these with the USB and RCA connectors? AliEx only shows them with the clips. And what is your impression of them so far?
 
Jan 19, 2023 at 10:04 PM Post #1,462 of 1,991
How did you order these with the USB and RCA connectors? AliEx only shows them with the clips. And what is your impression of them so far?
See my most recent post above - haven't tried them yet, and see screenshot of product page - it offered a range of connection options, the last four icons/options are USB and RCA in paper and rosewood options.
 
Jan 20, 2023 at 4:44 AM Post #1,463 of 1,991
Fabulous use of the English language there jgwtriode, love the Giclee copy analogy. You make a compelling case for the AfterDark Black Magic 12S. How could I not get one now.

As a matter of interest, as it seems you've pretty good experience on the USB cable front, can you recommend a good step up from the likes of the Semperfi Outsider, if you're familiar with it, in, say the sub-USD300 bracket? (I'm not quite ready to scale the heights you have with USB cables)

Background is I've been pursuing the Gustard R26 internal render/direct streaming route of late with my U18 patiently waiting on the sidelines to have its potential unlocked with better cables and probably an even better USB source than the Ifi Zen Stream.
Thanks. Used to enjoy writing and poetry quite a bit back a few years ago. Done a few poems again a few years ago, but been in a slump after my last divorce. I sometimes get carried away when an audio product works really well.

Played with a few cheaper USBs and some home made ones using braided zenwave audio neotech 26awg solid silver gold. Those were pretty good. That wire is very hard to get. The normal DIY is stranded in a PTFE jacket. Good but not up to the solid core version which I believe Dave at Zenwave has an exclusive on. Used to buy wire from him. Pretty good stuff, but the Wywires clobbers it! I would possibly say wywires Silver level USB would be a good choice. Quite reasonable, very good but does not have the carbon/graphene insulator used in the Platinum or Diamond. I have heard very good about it. My other choice based on playing with a couple of there other cables would be DH Labs better USB. Its around 200 range and you can get 10% off if you go to their site and use their first time discount. Wywires Silver is $299.00 if your order from their site. They still have theri 40% discount going. Knowing what I do having played with the Platinum series and the Diamond and talking to Alex quite a bit, the Silver should offer most of what the Platinum does! I would recommend the Wywires. But DHlabs cables offer a hell of a lot at the price points.

If you can find one used the Mad Scientist Black Magic, not their Ultra. Its double the price. Black Magic is 400 dollar cable, you could find used for about half if anyone is selling. I really enjoyed that for about 3 years and then started getting into Wywires.

I would have really liked to get the R26. R2R and all. I bought the x26Pro along time ago, back in March. Had a used one that I got for $1200. Which Fedex scumbags lost. They nearly lost my ZMF VC leopardwoods the year before. They are miserable.

So bought a new one from China and had Ric Schultz, not the magnetic cable guy, EVS tweak shop; rebuild it for me. He rebuilt my old Oppo Sonica and so he rebuilt this for me.

Took 6 months to get back because of his health and a lot weird stuff. Anyway he ripped apart the Power Supply, eliminated everything between the tranformer and rectifier. Eliminated 6 layers of contact points all the voltage switching, fuse and power switch. Has a Furutech Rhodium power inlet to the toroids and that goes straight to the diodes. He yanked the bolts out of them that secure them to the frame. So they are basically loose, I put some dampers under them.

Those steel bolts play havoc with the sound of the transformers. I suppose i could put nylon ones in. But they just float now. All of the wiring that he replaced is that new mundorf angelique copper/silver/gold. Mostly jumpers and around a few caps he replaces and did some bypasses. He rebuilt the output stage to his high current class A variant.

The Gustard output stage is not really discrete, their are still opamps in it. There are about 4 stages all in all regardless of what they make a fuss about. It's good but his has two stages and though it uses extremely good custom opamps it is still is much simpler and very close to discrete. He has a unique way of voltage/current conversion that works a good bit better than Gustards. He also has a supper single ended mod where he rewires the outputs of the DAC's to only work single ended. They are not fully utilizing the ESS 9038 single ended in the normal configuration. So he gets a bit lower noise floor, more dynamic range, and more current out of them then how Gustard has them configured. This also requires some wired jumpers using the mundorf wire! My balanced outputs are useless. But not interested in balanced output anyway!

My output is direct to WBT nexgen copper RCA with chassis isolated grounds using that mundorf wire. And then I have his copper ground enhancers atached to the RCA grounds internally. So I am sure mine is likely to at least hold it's own or better the R26. He no longer is doing any mods. I also have the internal core components of his speaker RF filters in my ZMF VC's. They made a noticeable improvement. A little bit of a pain to solder them in. But got it done.

Love my U18. Considering MartinWT's recommendation of sending it off to England for upgrade. Sounds like it would be around $500. Have to wait till tax return.

If you haven't done it yet upgrade the fuses in the R26 and the u18. I am running a synergistic orange. It makes a pretty significant difference over stock. And do some good isolation under them. MartinWT likes Black Ravioli Pads. I like Mad Scientist blackpods which are no longer available. Looking at Terrastone/Bearing footers from Eden Sound now for my Amp. And definetly upgrade the power cord. That make a pretty significant difference as well.

Happy listening.

jgwtriode
 
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Jan 20, 2023 at 5:49 AM Post #1,464 of 1,991
Thanks. Used to enjoy writing and poetry quite a bit back a few years ago. Done a few poems again a few years ago, but been in a slump after my last divorce. I sometimes get carried away when an audio product works really well.

Played with a few cheaper USBs and some home made ones using braided zenwave audio neotech 26awg solid silver gold. Those were pretty good. That wire is very hard to get. The normal DIY is stranded in a PTFE jacket. Good but not up to the solid core version which I believe Dave at Zenwave has an exclusive on. Used to buy wire from him. Pretty good stuff, but the Wywires clobbers it! I would possibly say wywires Silver level USB would be a good choice. Quite reasonable, very good but does not have the carbon/graphene insulator used in the Platinum or Diamond. I have heard very good about it. My other choice based on playing with a couple of there other cables would be DH Labs better USB. Its around 200 range and you can get 10% off if you go to their site and use their first time discount. Wywires Silver is $299.00 if your order from their site. They still have theri 40% discount going. Knowing what I do having played with the Platinum series and the Diamond and talking to Alex quite a bit, the Silver should offer most of what the Platinum does! I would recommend the Wywires. But DHlabs cables offer a hell of a lot at the price points.

If you can find one used the Mad Scientist Black Magic, not their Ultra. Its double the price. Black Magic is 400 dollar cable, you could find used for about half if anyone is selling. I really enjoyed that for about 3 years and then started getting into Wywires.

I would have really liked to get the R26. R2R and all. I bought the x26Pro along time ago, back in March. Had a used one that I got for $1200. Which Fedex scumbags lost. They nearly lost my ZMF VC leopardwoods the year before. They are miserable.

So bought a new one from China and had Ric Schultz, not the magnetic cable guy, EVS tweak shop; rebuild it for me. He rebuilt my old Oppo Sonica and so he rebuilt this for me.

Took 6 months to get back because of his health and a lot weird stuff. Anyway he ripped apart the Power Supply, eliminated everything between the tranformer and rectifier. Eliminated 6 layers of contact points all the voltage switching, fuse and power switch. Has a Furutech Rhodium power inlet to the toroids and that goes straight to the diodes. He yanked the bolts out of them that secure them to the frame. So they are basically loose, I put some dampers under them.

Those steel bolts play havoc with the sound of the transformers. I suppose i could put nylon ones in. But they just float now. All of the wiring that he replaced is that new mundorf angelique copper/silver/gold. Mostly jumpers and around a few caps he replaces and did some bypasses. He rebuilt the output stage to his high current class A variant.

The Gustard output stage is not really discrete, their are still opamps in it. There are about 4 stages all in all regardless of what they make a fuss about. It's good but his has two stages and though it uses extremely good custom opamps it is still is much simpler and very close to discrete. He has a unique way of voltage/current conversion that works a good bit better than Gustards. He also has a supper single ended mod where he rewires the outputs of the DAC's to only work single ended. They are not fully utilizing the ESS 9038 single ended in the normal configuration. So he gets a bit lower noise floor, more dynamic range, and more current out of them then how Gustard has them configured. This also requires some wired jumpers using the mundorf wire! My balanced outputs are useless. But not interested in balanced output anyway!

My output is direct to WBT nexgen copper RCA with chassis isolated grounds using that mundorf wire. And then I have his copper ground enhancers atached to the RCA grounds internally. So I am sure mine is likely to at least hold it's own or better the R26. He no longer is doing any mods. I also have the internal core components of his speaker RF filters in my ZMF VC's. They made a noticeable improvement. A little bit of a pain to solder them in. But got it done.

Love my U18. Considering MartinWT's recommendation of sending it off to England for upgrade. Sounds like it would be around $500. Have to wait till tax return.

If you haven't done it yet upgrade the fuses in the R26 and the u18. I am running a synergistic orange. It makes a pretty significant difference over stock. And do some good isolation under them. MartinWT likes Black Ravioli Pads. I like Mad Scientist blackpods which are no longer available. Looking at Terrastone/Bearing footers from Eden Sound now for my Amp. And definetly upgrade the power cord. That make a pretty significant difference as well.

Happy listening.

jgwtriode
Another great write-up thankyou. And thanks for the USB cable advice. Second time now I've had Mad Scientist cables crop up now I think. And he is just up the road from me, relatively speaking. Isolation/vibration damping and likely fuses are also somewhere on the new year list, though I've almost been partly persuaded by SAJunky on another thread (or is it this one, hard to keep track) that the problem is in large part the fuse/cradle contact so one could try soldering in the stock one in the first instance.

I tried grounding boxes for the first time this evening which was an eye-opener. Will post on that separately.

And ah yes I've heard of the famous and now retired Ric Shulz. Glad to hear it worked out very well in the end after your misfortune with your first X26 Pro. It sounds like your X26 Pro is well and truly a custom supercharged unit now. I really wouldn't fancy my chances against in a drag race with my stock R26, much as I enjoy it.

Cheers
 
Jan 20, 2023 at 8:14 AM Post #1,466 of 1,991
Love my U18. Considering MartinWT's recommendation of sending it off to England for upgrade. Sounds like it would be around $500. Have to wait till tax return.


jgwtriode
I had communications with Tony at Coherent about the upgrade back about 2 months ago. I was on the fence due to the cost. Then when I decided to do it I reached out twice and never got a response. If you get a response and if you live in the USA the shipping costs back and forth with either DHL, FedEx or UPS will push the cost to close to $700. So factor that in your decision to upgrade a $500 DDC. In fact, at the time Tony seemed to be more steering me in the direction of waiting until around Christmas time for a new Mutec DDC that was to be released as he said as good as the upgraded U18 is, the new Mutec would blow it out of the water. Of course there was no price available for it nor have I seen any new DDC from Mutec yet.
 
Jan 20, 2023 at 8:21 AM Post #1,467 of 1,991
Would a U18 DDC be worth getting for a R26 DAC and Burson Soloist 3X performance amp ? What improvements should I expect to see, if any ?
A DDC is only good for USB input. It gets rid of any noise from the USB source device (PC, laptop) and allows you to use the I2S input on the R26. If you stream directly to the R26 and don't use USB input into the DAC currently, a DDC will be of no benefit. Use any adjective people use for better SQ is what you can expect. Better than a fuse upgrade IMHO but not as noticeable as the addition of a master clock is how I would describe the difference.
 
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Jan 20, 2023 at 12:35 PM Post #1,468 of 1,991
A DDC is only good for USB input. It gets rid of any noise from the USB source device (PC, laptop) and allows you to use the I2S input on the R26. If you stream directly to the R26 and don't use USB input into the DAC currently, a DDC will be of no benefit. Use any adjective people use for better SQ is what you can expect. Better than a fuse upgrade IMHO but not as noticeable as the addition of a master clock is how I would describe the difference.
I noticed the Audio GD has a regenerative power supply DDC. A few people have mention outperforms the Gustard U18. There is a used for 630 pound on used for sale boards. Probably be gone soon. But new it's $1K. Any thoughts?

jgwtriode
 
Jan 20, 2023 at 2:23 PM Post #1,469 of 1,991
I noticed the Audio GD has a regenerative power supply DDC. A few people have mention outperforms the Gustard U18. There is a used for 630 pound on used for sale boards. Probably be gone soon. But new it's $1K. Any thoughts?

jgwtriode
If it's the Audio-GD DI-20HE, buy it.
 
Jan 21, 2023 at 10:43 AM Post #1,470 of 1,991
I noticed the Audio GD has a regenerative power supply DDC. A few people have mention outperforms the Gustard U18. There is a used for 630 pound on used for sale boards. Probably be gone soon. But new it's $1K. Any thoughts?

jgwtriode
It should outperform a U18 as it costs twice as much. LOL. But the question is, is the difference worth double the cost? IMHO the U18 is a great bang for the buck especially with a Purple fuse.

Does anyone know if the DI-20HE has a user replaceable fuse? It's not apparent like with Gustard products.
 

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