GUSTARD H10 High-current Discrete Class A output Stage Headphone Amplifier
Feb 23, 2015 at 8:33 AM Post #811 of 5,553
Very early in my experience with the X12, I had identified a little hardness in the treble and a somewhat flattened soundstage. I'm happy to report that break in took care of all of that. Probably a little emi isolation helped too. It now is almost the antithesis of analytical. You hear all the detail and the low level ambient cues, but it is all quite relaxed and natural.

I too was worried about the alleged Sabre glare and had weighed getting a Wolfson DAC to compare to the Aune. My Rega Apollo R provided that comparison, so I was willing to roll the dice with the X12. In my system, the X12 is every bit as relaxed and musical as the Rega Wolfson or the Aune S16, but with better dynamics, greater frequency extension and finer resolution. That's a winner for me.

I'm experiencing the exact same thing, with the X12 opening up as it gets used more.
 
Imaging and soundstage initially sounded flat/congested/smeared relative to how it sounds now. The treble had this unnatural tone/harshness.
 
Becoming more 3D/airy/separated and natural as time progresses. Bass extension sounds like it's improving as well.
 
Feb 23, 2015 at 11:35 AM Post #812 of 5,553
I'm experiencing the exact same thing, with the X12 opening up as it gets used more.

Imaging and soundstage initially sounded flat/congested/smeared relative to how it sounds now. The treble had this unnatural tone/harshness.

Becoming more 3D/airy/separated and natural as time progresses. Bass extension sounds like it's improving as well.


Thanks for sharing your X12 experience. We needed a few more to establish a confident baseline on break in and overall sound. Are you running it with the sharp or slow filter?
 
Feb 23, 2015 at 11:56 AM Post #813 of 5,553
Thanks for sharing your X12 experience. We needed a few more to establish a confident baseline on break in and overall sound. Are you running it with the sharp or slow filter?


Slow right now. I think it makes bass notes have a slightly longer decay, making drum hits sound a little bigger. It doesn't have any negative effect on details to my ears.
 
Loving the synergy the combo has with the Audeze headphones. I haven't even listened to any of my other headphones since I've been using this setup.
 
I haven't heard any other DAC/amp combos (for any extended period) around the $1000 mark , but I'm loving this one a lot
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Feb 23, 2015 at 2:48 PM Post #814 of 5,553
Hey Stuart,
 
Quote:
Let's take another techno-tweakazoid spin off of the good ship Gustard.   ARRR indeed mateys




Yes, that is an armored Guinea Pig, riding a suped-up rocket jet ski and smoking while brandishing his piece. So very apropos, wouldn't you say?!

I was so pleased with the results of the 3M AB5100S on the U12 and X12, that I ordered another sheet for the H10.
 
The order of effects suggested that the greatest benefits would be had with my digital gear, so my progression was planned to be U12>X12>H10.  If I didn't like what I was hearing, or couldn't hear any change at all, I would stop the madness at the earliest stage.  From my last report, you know that I was very happy with the resolution, soundstage and imaging improvements to both the U12 and X12.  I figured taking another shot with the H10 was well worth the $46 expenditure.





Here we have the H10 before and afters.  I covered the IEC power input and completely shrouded the transformers.  Then I gave the capacitors a top hat, enclosed the potentiometer, covered all IC's and shielded the XLR inputs ( I only use XLR).  I even enclosed the headphone jack sleeve with its three metal tabs. I didn't expect this application to be as audible as the digital devices. AB5100S is an "absorber" rather than a true "shield," so it stands to reason that the most effective applications will be on devices and electrical components that create and throw off the most emi and rfi.  I figured that there still would be a benefit from absorbing stray crud that made its way into the H10 through the power cord and XLR cables and also the emi produced by the transformers, voltage regulators and caps. When you already have the lid off and you have a whole sheet of the stuff to use, you end up saying to yourself, "what the heck, lets get crazy!"
The nice thing I have learned about the AB5100S product is that it doesn't seem to have a down side wherever you happen to put it.  It doesn't make the highs dull or suck the life out of the music, so I think you can play around with complete impunity. 

Let me digress for just a moment.  I have read some commentary involving other shielding products (most notably Stillpoints ERS cloth) that warned against the sonic perils of an over-application. They would say things about the sound becoming dull and lifeless, lacking in "air"....yada yada.  I would be willing to bet that these folks have not listened to systems that have very low emi and rfi distortions and are completely unfamiliar with how it sounds.  It can, at first, be a little disconcerting. I think we get so used to the low level "white noise" hanging around the noise floor, that we think that it is natural and ascribe to it certain beneficial attributes like "air" and "liveliness."  Not surprisingly, us older guys who cut our teeth on vinyl front ends often recognized this as the same kind of "air" we heard when playing a  good vinyl pressing on on well appointed VPI or Merrill tuntable.  There was loads of distortion produced from dragging a needle through a groove, but it was consonant distortion.  It was a form of low level white noise that seemed to fill up the space around things and gave a sense of the ambiance of the recording venue.  The first few times you hear music with that white noise absent, it sounds just a little surreal.  This has really come to the forefront in the digital age because other forms of distortion are now so vanishingly low that the effects of emi and rfi "hash" can now be clearly heard on a good system.  I had to come to grips with this phenomenon years ago when I auditioned and reviewed the Bel Canto Evo digital amplifiers with the Talon Khorus loudspeakers. Both of these products had ground breaking technology that produced music with extraordinarily low distortion.  It was really weird at first and I had to re-calibrate my listening  and even have some live music played in my listening room to make sure it wasn't self-delusion, a fluke or some parlor trick.  

So, getting back to the AB5100S applications, yes, you will hear less of the white noise hash and the noise floor will seem to be lowered.  Because there is less of that white noise haze filling up the spaces between things, I hear greater separation between images and the images themselves are more distinct, standing out against a blacker backdrop. There appears to be less smear - a sharper focus, that one could also describe as "greater resolution."   I have not found there to be any change in tonality....virtually all of the improvements wrought by the AB5100S treatment are in the realm of soundstage and imaging.  If you are following my reasoning and analogies, this really does make intuitive sense.  With the H10 treatment, I got more of the same. Perhaps not as great as what I heard with the X12, but still an audible, appreciable improvement in that soundstage/imaging mojo that is like Pignip to your humble Cap'n.

Seriously guys, for $46 a sheet, this is a no-brainer tweak. I can't be the only swabbie with a penchant for trimming the sails, so let's get cracking you scurvy pig-dogs!   

 
Check out this Tyll Hertsens video where Jam Somasundram, an associate of Nelson Pass, is interviewed regarding their new headphone amp, which, in addition to having a low-feedback design (which I'm convinced is a must for the HD800, if not a zero-feedback design, like the Metrum Aurix), and all discrete components, has a custom-wound power transformer that's shielded with MuMetal (for controlling magnetic fields, not EMF).  See:  http://custommagneticshielding.magneticshield.com/category/mumetal-sheet-and-foil
 

 
I also find it interesting that we have another high-end ($3000 ?) headphone amp that has unbalanced output, having abandoned balanced inputs in an earlier prototype.  (Lots of well-equipped head-philes are perfectly content with their expensive unbalanced amps.)
 
Mike
 
Feb 23, 2015 at 3:23 PM Post #815 of 5,553
That is sooo cool Mike!  I think I have mentioned before that I'm a big Nelson Pass fan and I have the Aleph mono blocks running a rig downstairs right now.   I should divulge that as of about two weeks now, I am back on board with positive-feedback.com as an associate editor. I continued to be listed as legal counsel on the masthead for the almost 15 years that I wasn't writing, but the editor in chief and my old friend and mentor, David Robinson, convinced me it was time to return.  Maybe I can get on the review list to give the Pass headphone amp a try.
 
By the way, in my first new article with PF, David wants me to tell the story of my extended hiatus from high-end audio and what has brought me back. I will be sharing about the whacky-wonderful world of personal/headphone audio and the kindred spirits I have met here.  There most definitely WILL BE a mention of my swabbies aboard the SS Gustard, because you guys have done more to restore my joy in music and audio gear than anyone else.
 
Feb 23, 2015 at 7:04 PM Post #816 of 5,553
Hey, congratulations Stuart!  
 
You certainly have an energy and enthusiasm that comes across very contagiously in what you write, so I'm looking forward to your being exposed to a larger audience.  I read Positive Feedback even though I have an extremely modest HiFi system - it was modest when I bought it 30 years ago!  LOL  If I lived by myself, things would be different, but I like things just the way they are - I'll take the wife over the HiFi system any day (as long as I can pursue my Head-Fi gear!)
 
Meanwhile, I think it's pretty cool that you've been shielding components in your Gustard gear, with Nelson Pass doing the same in his newest commercial amp.  Great minds think alike!  
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Mike
 
Feb 23, 2015 at 9:37 PM Post #817 of 5,553
Gratz Captain. Looking forward to reading your articles.
 
Feb 23, 2015 at 10:40 PM Post #818 of 5,553
  That is sooo cool Mike!  I think I have mentioned before that I'm a big Nelson Pass fan and I have the Aleph mono blocks running a rig downstairs right now.   I should divulge that as of about two weeks now, I am back on board with positive-feedback.com as an associate editor. I continued to be listed as legal counsel on the masthead for the almost 15 years that I wasn't writing, but the editor in chief and my old friend and mentor, David Robinson, convinced me it was time to return.  Maybe I can get on the review list to give the Pass headphone amp a try.
 
By the way, in my first new article with PF, David wants me to tell the story of my extended hiatus from high-end audio and what has brought me back. I will be sharing about the whacky-wonderful world of personal/headphone audio and the kindred spirits I have met here.  There most definitely WILL BE a mention of my swabbies aboard the SS Gustard, because you guys have done more to restore my joy in music and audio gear than anyone else.

David Robinson the Admiral? - But congrats! This is good news for the hobby as a whole because you do solid work. SS Gustard for life! I can't wait to read it!
 
Feb 23, 2015 at 10:47 PM Post #819 of 5,553
Screw DHL Express. In a week my H10 got from Sweden to Germany. (Bought mine used from natra). How long will it take until it gets to Finland.. 2 weeks? Stuff comes from China faster than this..
 
Feb 23, 2015 at 11:42 PM Post #820 of 5,553
@stuartmc
Would you recommend getting the U12 even if I use the USB connection straight from my PC to the X12? Was there an appreciable difference to you?
 
I'm also considering getting the AB5100S sheet - but actually opening up my units and modifying them would take a lot more consideration.
 
Thanks for always keeping us updated with your results
beerchug.gif

  Screw DHL Express. In a week my H10 got from Sweden to Germany. (Bought mine used from natra). How long will it take until it gets to Finland.. 2 weeks? Stuff comes from China faster than this..

It took me about three weeks to receive my X12 from Pollychen - he got the address wrong initially and then didn't contact me about it. Took a while for everything to be sorted. It'll be worth the wait, though!
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 12:04 AM Post #822 of 5,553
  Waiting for X20 to come out and some European head-fier to sell his X12 =)

http://www.shenzhenaudio.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=gustard
 
If you change the currency to Euros, you might actually find that the prices for the products when brand new are pretty good.
 
When I changed the currency from US dollars to Australian dollars, the prices were MUCH cheaper than if I paid in US dollars and got it converted from Australian dollars.
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 12:06 AM Post #823 of 5,553
@stuartmc

Would you recommend getting the U12 even if I use the USB connection straight from my PC to the X12? Was there an appreciable difference to you?

I'm also considering getting the AB5100S sheet - but actually opening up my units and modifying them would take a lot more consideration.

Thanks for always keeping us updated with your results :beerchug:


I can't tell you definitively because I got my X12 without the usb daughter board. I figured I would go with the U12 if I decided to go the computer audio route. Some guys over on the U12 thread say there is a definite improvement with the U12 over the built in. This squares with what Gustard said through polychen about it. If you compare the daughter board to the U12 board, you will see a lot more attention given to the power supply and regulation with the U12.
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 12:09 AM Post #824 of 5,553
  http://www.shenzhenaudio.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=gustard
 
If you change the currency to Euros, you might actually find that the prices for the products when brand new are pretty good.
 
When I changed the currency from US dollars to Australian dollars, the prices were MUCH cheaper than if I paid in US dollars and got it converted from Australian dollars.


Yeah I noticed. But it's still over 400 euros with USB. Then comes the customs. VAT 24% and 5% import tax. You can cheat on that by asking them to forge receipt with lower price and declare lower value to customs but still I rather buy from Europe than do that.
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 12:18 AM Post #825 of 5,553
Opening up the clam shell case and applying the AB5100s is easy peasy, so long as you have the right size/configuration tools for removing the two top screws in both the front and rear of the case. The top half then lifts right off. They are all square socket screws with the rear ones being quite small. I didn't have the right size for the larger front ones, but a hex allen wrench worked anyway because they weren't all that tight.
 

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