GUSTARD DAC-R26 Balanced Decoder R2R+1Bit Dual Native Decoding Music Bridge

[camrector]

I don't have any noise with Direct DSD on.

Hmm. What could my issue be then. It volume dependent but it’s quite loud at low volume levels. Roon doesn’t even need to be on. Just as soon as I switch it DSD direct on.
Are you using a different filter from HQ?

PCM is dead silent. Blackest I’ve ever heard.

 

[camrector]

What ?
Noooo....

With DSD direct off the R26 converts DSD to pcm.

I do not have the A26 schematic. I’ll ask my contact at Gustard.

 

[Davidv100]

As a wise man stated earlier:
“Listen to both, and choose the one that sounds better in your system.”

I don't know Labeleen,

What the scheme of Camrector is showing, is that some people are actually completely by-passing R26 ( = "R26 sounds best when I do not use it", but without knowing it ).
At least it can be useful to know that in this case, some space can be made free on the audio rack for a painting, or some art piece.

 

[Davidv100]

With DSD direct off the R26 converts DSD to pcm.

I do not have the A26 schematic. I’ll ask my contact at Gustard.

Thanks a lot Camrector.
Super appreciated !

 

[sajunky]

I am not sure that is correct but I am waiting for some conformation. I would also be interested to know if the A26 has a nos pcm mode? I am a loyal HQPlayer user and I am looking for the version of this dac that works with both as well or better than the Denafrips line. I don't want to get into an argument about how Denafrips handles both I know this is an open discussion, but the Denafrips dacs do both well with HQPlayer. The A26 or R26 would be an interesting upgrade because of the built in streamer and other features. I do generally prefer R2R dacs as most of my listening is with classical music. I am just waiting patiently for the answer . I'm in no hurry to rush into this until I know.

There is only Audio GD in this price range that sounds better than Denafrips. If you are loyal to HQPlayer, not a good news, as there is no many HQPlayer users in the Audio GD camp. A DAC can play well in a native format, it applies to DSD too. Streaming feature is nice, but is limited. It is better to get a full featured streamer if you use streaming. You will need to replace streamer in two years time anyway, as it is fast changing market. Also from protecting from ground loops perspective.

 

[Dandoudou]

Hmm. What could my issue be then. It volume dependent but it’s quite loud at low volume levels. Roon doesn’t even need to be on. Just as soon as I switch it DSD direct on.
Are you using a different filter from HQ?

PCM is dead silent. Blackest I’ve ever heard.

I don't think that your issue is related to a given filter or a player.
I use the DAC with "Direct DSD on" and "NOS on" all the time, with all my players, and I never heard any noise.
There's no noise when I stream to its LAN input, nor when I use my streaming setup + the DI-20HE.

The only noises were pops with DSD that disappeared with the upgrade to 1v4.

 

[Dandoudou]

I don't know Labeleen,

What the scheme of Camrector is showing, is that some people are actually completely by-passing R26 ( = "R26 sounds best when I do not use it" ).
At least it can be useful to know that in this case, some space can be made free on the audio rack for a painting, or some art piece.

In any case, you are planning to use your DAC with Apple Music by connecting your iPad to it or with AirPlay.
None of the user cases above can help you forecast which DAC will be better for you.

 

[labeelen]

Thank you.
I was just writing that I bet HQ player has better setting that can help the issues I experience with the the R26 dsd. Are there filters to help lower the noise floor? Do any other of you guys hear alot of hiss even at low levels?
As soon as I switch DSD direct On my system sounds like a 1985 stereo with the volume cranked! Lol.

One of my first posts here was because I experienced the ‘hiss’ you mention with ‘DirectDSD=on’.
I like the R26 best with either pcm or dsd (with DirectDSD=off) so both are processed as pcm by r26’s R-2R ladder.
But that’s just how I like it.
Jussi (author of HQPlayer explained to me that the DSD noise is inherent to the way Gustard designed it’s DirectDSD 1 bit ladder in R26, I tried some of his suggestions on changing filters and/or #DAC bits setting but this only gives very minor improvements)

Don’t get me wrong, I am happy with R26 and don’t regret my purchase, only I will not use it for playing DSD natively.

 

[Odezra]

Thank you.
I was just writing that I bet HQ player has better setting that can help the issues I experience with the the R26 dsd. Are there filters to help lower the noise floor? Do any other of you guys hear alot of hiss even at low levels?
As soon as I switch DSD direct On my system sounds like a 1985 stereo with the volume cranked! Lol.

I have no noise on DSD direct Cam. Faulty unit?

 

[camrector]

I don't think that your issue is related to a given filter or a player.
I use the DAC with "Direct DSD on" and "NOS on" all the time, with all my players, and I never heard any noise.
There's no noise when I stream to its LAN input, nor when I use my streaming setup + the DI-20HE.

The only noises were pops with DSD that disappeared with the upgrade to 1v4.

So burn in? My only input used on the R26 is LAN streaming Roon. As soon as I switch DSD direct on its hizzy distortion.
No pops or anything like that. Also on 1v4.

 

[Davidv100]

In any case, you are planning to use your DAC with Apple Music by connecting your iPad to it or with AirPlay.
None of the user cases above can help you forecast which DAC will be better for you.

Not Airplay obviously (limited to PCM 24/48).
I would use Apple Music hi-res (24/192 PCM native) with a wired iPad -> Lighting to USB -> R26 (PCM, NOS)

PS :
Through this forum, I have learned about the high value of HQPlayer (I did not know this software).
And I understand my setup would be even better with HQPlayer integration. Everybody seems to praise HQP (here and everywhere else, this is new for me).
But for my own convenience reasons (ease of casual use), I prefer to keep it simpler (knowing that I am not going the extra mile without HQP).
But If I were transcoding to DSD512 with HQPlayer, I would NOT buy a R26, which becomes almost a pure pass-though when fed by DSD512.

 

[Dandoudou]

So burn in? My only input used on the R26 is LAN streaming Roon. As soon as I switch DSD direct on its hizzy distortion.
No pops or anything like that. Also on 1v4.

I don't know if it's related to burn in, because I did not have anything similar even when the DAC was just out-of-the-box.
Ask Gustard about it. Maybe your DAC is defective.

 

[Dandoudou]

Not Airplay obviously (limited to PCM 24/48).
I would use Apple Music hi-res (24/192 PCM native) with a wired iPad -> Lighting to USB -> R26 (PCM, NOS)

It will be a bit-perfect playback of PCM, not in optimal conditions, since the sound will be streamed through the mixer of iOS.

 

[Odezra]

I don't know Labeleen,

What the scheme of Camrector is showing, is that some people are actually completely by-passing R26 ( = "R26 sounds best when I do not use it", but without knowing it ).
At least it can be useful to know that in this case, some space can be made free on the audio rack for a painting, or some art piece.

Most users on this thread would know that dsd direct completely bypasses the ladder. This thread if you go back has evolved from testing and experimentation with some great digging from the people here to understand what’s going on technically.

To be clear though -

- a good chain with pcm native (going through R2R ladder) sounds great
- for many of us dsd direct (at 512 upsampling) is slightly better. Not all agree
- pcm upsampling when dsd is not available is excellent

Now - if I didnt upsample - i would pick R2R over the DS DACs i have tried to date - no question it’s a nicer sound for my tastes.

If you upsample - the world gets a lot muddier and harder to pull apart. I oscillate back and forth between pcm to 32/768 and dsd 512 and both are excellent. I slightly prefer dsd as I perceive no veil and it’s like the artist is in the room with me (not necessarily as the artist intended btw but that’s another discussion).

If I were upsampling to dsd exclusively, I wouldn’t necessarily recommend the Gustard r26 at this price point. I’d keep an eye on that a26 and there are other dacs (I like chord DACs upsampled to dsd) that would be in the mix. At this price point - for most other things, and where pcm matters, the r26 is excellent.

The r26 is an excellent device - it doesn’t matter whether the R2R or 1 bit dac is used so long as the sound is great. It’s amazing that both are on offer. The a26 needs more reviews now as to its native performance and upsampled performance to know where it lands relative to r26.

The best answer for you might be to get both and return the one you don’t like. Would be keen to hear how you get on. Unless you upsample to dsd exclusively, I doubt you’ll get a clear definitive answer for a few weeks yet.

 

[sajunky]

But if you choose DSD direct off, the same will happen with R26. 6 bit PCM.

If you say 6-bit PCM, It is not. It is 6-bit DSD...
Still DSD. Most of Delta-Sigma chipDACs does the same internally.

Denafrips call it FIR-32 filter. It is DSP implemented in hardware using set of unary resistors (separate ladder from the main PCM R2R ladder). R26 has the same set of resistors.

It looks like it is the biggest confusion among Gustard users. I can be wrong, but it is likely that Gustard use wrong terminology. So don't worry, if you set Direct DSD OFF, it is still a native DSD, but multibit (or multistream). Like in many other devices. If you set Direct DSD ON, it is decoding bitstream on a single resistor, like in the first Sony Bitstream players.

Troll? NOT. A qualified guess. Just collecting information and processing it internally in my brain, you pointed me in the right direction.