Grado GS1000--first impressions not so good
Aug 30, 2007 at 10:05 PM Post #31 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by splawren /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I'm sure people's "disappointment" in their new gear (like the OP and the GS1000) would be tempered if they expected the burn-in and knew it was a valid (and real) expectation that the product would improve with time and use. That information has got to come from the sellers and in much greater frequency, IMO.


That is a VERY good point and is definitely what would be happening if I were to have that info.
 
Aug 30, 2007 at 11:05 PM Post #32 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by robm321 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Either way, 400 hours of burn in is almost necessary before making any critical judgement (btw, the same goes for the Ed.9s.)


If the sound does not improve after burnt in, you might want to check your upstream components. The GS1000 is "high-maintenance". It's very picky with amps and sources. Some CD sources can be a bit bright. I found them as smooth as silk on my vinyl rig, never bright or sibilant.

Welcome to the club.
wink.gif
 
Aug 30, 2007 at 11:23 PM Post #33 of 156
I am a 400 hr believer with the GS1000's. No one can tell me any differant what I heard with my own two ears. OP use them as much as go can before you throw in the towel, I almost gave up on them, glad I didn't, and yes a good amp will help.

Frank
 
Aug 30, 2007 at 11:31 PM Post #34 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by fc911c /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I am a 400 hr believer with the GS1000's. No one can tell me any differant what I heard with my own two ears. OP use them as much as go can before you throw in the towel, I almost gave up on them, glad I didn't, and yes a good amp will help.

Frank



Frank, you meant the new SP Extreme worked it out for you ?
gs1000.gif
 
Aug 30, 2007 at 11:51 PM Post #35 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by 3x331m /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Frank, you meant the new SP Extreme worked it out for you ?
gs1000.gif




Hello Alex

yes it did, I have tried a few differant tubes with it so far, the Bugle Boy 7316 with the Chatham 5998 are my favorite combo, Still looking though.

When I compare the GS1000 to the HD650 I go with the Grado all the time it just sounds so much more realistic, hands down.


Frank
 
Aug 30, 2007 at 11:54 PM Post #36 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by 3x331m /img/forum/go_quote.gif
If the sound does not improve after burnt in, you might want to check your upstream components. The GS1000 is "high-maintenance". It's very picky with amps and sources. Some CD sources can be a bit bright. I found them as smooth as silk on my vinyl rig, never bright or sibilant.

Welcome to the club.
wink.gif



Aaagh! I wish my new vinyl setup were here
frown.gif
. I'm making a VERY substantial upgrade (from a VPI Scout with a Shelter 501 to a SOTA Nova with a Dynavector DV507 MK2 arm and Dynavector XX2 cartridge) so it will be interesting to see if the Grados like it.
 
Aug 30, 2007 at 11:56 PM Post #37 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by fc911c /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Hello Alex

yes it did, I have tried a few differant tubes with it so far, the Bugle Boy 7316 with the Chatham 5998 are my favorite combo, Still looking though.

When I compare the GS1000 to the HD650 I go with the Grado all the time it just sounds so much more realistic, hands down.


Frank



Now, you made me curious of the Bugleboy...
very_evil_smiley.gif


I'm glad the you found the synergy for the GS1000. Anyway, the Extreme is also good for your other cans. You're set for awhile.
biggrin.gif
 
Aug 31, 2007 at 12:18 AM Post #38 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by 3x331m /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Now, you made me curious of the Bugleboy...
very_evil_smiley.gif


I'm glad the you found the synergy for the GS1000. Anyway, the Extreme is also good for your other cans. You're set for awhile.
biggrin.gif



yep right up there with the VT-231 only better, more detail and cleaner.
 
Aug 31, 2007 at 12:33 AM Post #39 of 156
Something to remember:

A lot of "old" drivers were almost always paper coned (ditto for the dustcap) with only a handful of options for surrounds- usually treated paper. There weren't as many available materials back then, and most consumers were driven to buy when said speakers had a quick transient response (JBL's popularity was largely due to this). Paper was (and typically still is) the material of choice when transient speed is a primary design goal.

I suspect a lot of vintage headphones were made of very simple paper drivers that didn't require a lot of break in because there wasn't much going on with the material itself. I can tell you that an all paper coned driver becomes lifeless in time and requires a recone even if it still works and specs properly.

A contemporary speaker or headphone could contain drivers made of a dizzying array of materials- from alloys to pulp composites, to carbon fiber, et al. These materials are popular today because today's audiophile isn't so easily duped by transient snap alone. We want out cake (detail) and we want to eat it (smooth linear response without break-up distorion) too. New materials are complicated and proprietary and I (personally) don't think there is any BS WRT recommended break in times via manufacturer.

The suggestion with the 'techno in the basement' is exactly what I was going to say. You have to consider that ears, like eyes, are easily adapted to something new. What may intially appear as a "bright" sound will eventually trick you by virtue of the taming nature of our minds. After a while, it won't sound as bright because you get used to it (compensate for it). We have these litte internal EQ devices that lure us into bad sound. How many times have you heard a "refresher" product that woke you from the spell you were under, and upon returning home to listen to your once "great" sounding rig- was now completely horrible!?

To be more scientific- you gotta play the cans without listening to them until a few hundred hours pass. Then put them on and give them another try. I understand your concern for a return policy, but you could be missing out on an amazing pair of cans because you weren't intially impressed. That would be a shame. A lesser evil is that, after the required break-in, you still don't like them and put them up for sale ion the used marketplace and end up losing only a few bucks.

If you don't want 'em after break-in- shoot me a PM! I am so close to hitting the trigger on a pair. A "used" pair for slightly less than retail is making me salivate!!
lambda.gif
 
Aug 31, 2007 at 4:22 AM Post #40 of 156
Perhaps the OP is just a Senn kind of guy. After listening to the 650s for some time anything Grado may sound bright.

I actually found the GS1k to be anything but bright, most likely due to the fact that Ive been weened on SR-80, RS-2 etc.

Be patient with them,theres alot to love.
gs1000.gif
 
Aug 31, 2007 at 4:43 AM Post #41 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by splawren /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I'm sorry for going with the OT thread and ranting again . .. The car analogy has already been explained and distinguished, but I'll add that they "tell" you about the burn-in. With documentation like that for the speakers listed above, break-in is a known factor in the purchase and performance of the product (and is really well explained in that manual, I might add). For numerous headphones and amps on this site and others, no such explicit "burn-in" requirement is listed or described, except what is reported by users. When users claim that 100-200 to 500 or more (yup, saw 1000) hours of burn in is required for these products, there's an information problem or a performance problem. I'll totally admit I'm impatient, but I'm willing to let my monitor audio speakers "burn-in" because the dealer and mfgr say its the thing to do and explain why (like above) - I expect it and know how long it takes. When I buy a pair of HD650s, I've heard so many varying "burn-in" times for those phones that I have no idea if I've ever given them a chance to reach "peak", even with several hundred hours on them (and now, having tried them with an Opera, DAC1, HR Desktop, some selling decisions are apparent). If the HD650s are still not burned in by now, then the product is not useful to me, since I don't want to wait several more weeks/months to get them to sound "right," and I would never have bought them in the first place. A day, sure. A week, maybe. 50 hours or more - only if you tell me about it first. I'm sure people's "disappointment" in their new gear (like the OP and the GS1000) would be tempered if they expected the burn-in and knew it was a valid (and real) expectation that the product would improve with time and use. That information has got to come from the sellers and in much greater frequency, IMO.


I agree. I have yet to hear any change in my headphones minus upgrades of course..
 
Aug 31, 2007 at 12:17 PM Post #42 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by vcoheda /img/forum/go_quote.gif
that's really interesting. that's probably one of the best pieces of literature i've read on the topic. my only question is how comparable is burn in (break in) of speakers to headphones.


As far as I'm concerned, cans are simply small speakers, and react to burn-in the same way.
My personal experience has proven that burn-in improves *most* cans -- some more than others.
 
Aug 31, 2007 at 12:21 PM Post #43 of 156
Sorry to hear that these phones aren't measuring up to expectations.

These phones have recieved so much acclaim and rave reviews.

I'd think they would be nothing else but exceptional, simply out the world
 
Aug 31, 2007 at 12:27 PM Post #44 of 156
The headphone break-in

The perception theory seems most likely to me. Just doesn't seem likely a small headphone driver needs 400 hours to loosen up.

Also I believe most of the high fi headphone makers claim their headphones are awsome right out of the box. Be interesting to find a headphone company that actually suggests burn-in in their manuals. I'll bet it will be hard to find.

Edit: Maybe ultrasones recommend them. From these forums, people suggest ridiculous amount of burn-in time. Maybe ultrasone picked up on that.
 
Aug 31, 2007 at 12:44 PM Post #45 of 156
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mortalcoil /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Perhaps the OP is just a Senn kind of guy. After listening to the 650s for some time anything Grado may sound bright.

I actually found the GS1k to be anything but bright, most likely due to the fact that Ive been weened on SR-80, RS-2 etc.

Be patient with them,theres alot to love.
gs1000.gif




Yes I agree, britter than the 650's but no where near any of the other Grado's. At this point with my setup I find them just right.

Thanks
Frank
 

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