[wualta]

This has been a marvelous thread in many ways, but thanks to the original poster's willingness to take the large view, we have a good picture of the entire electronic listening experience, in this case using headphones, and what we see at work, among other things, is the wideranging adaptability of the ear/brain combination, its willingness to let us fool it in a variety of ways, but also its relentless shakedown of all those attempts to dazzle it and seduce it, ever more closely approaching, if we stick with the process and don't run out of money, the neutral, the unspectacular, the honest, the median point, whatever you'd like to call it-- assuming somebody's built it and will sell it to us. Call it Occam's Razor, or, the method of sculpture that says get a block of something and cut away everything that doesn't look like whatever it was you wanted to sculpt; it's otherwise known as the training or sentimental education of the ear/brain. We go left, we go right, we go euphonic, we go dull, but inescapably we get better at discrimination and judgment and zero in on something in between them all. A photographer learns to see as he or she takes more and more photographs and learns not to take the bad ones-- and focuses by going past the point of optimum focus and coming back again in ever-decreasing strokes. A writer learns good writing by writing and writing and rejecting what finally doesn't work. I think the process is the same.

And if all the choices are more or less imperfect, and we have the money, why, we can and should own a menagerie of headphones, and the "seeking oscillation", or is it vacillation, goes on.

As the late Spike Milligan said, "It's all in the mind, you know."

 

[tmarshl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jessica_fae The AKG line up is definitely a curiosity for me and an itch I'd like to scratch. The K1000 (like the Stax Omega II) has always been a headphone that I've wanted to live with for awhile. No money spent yet or headphones ordered. Maybe I'll get lucky and someone will be able to track down a K1000 somewhere in England and I can audition a K601, K701, and K1000 all at the same time. -Jessica

Hi Jessica,
I owned a Stax Omega II and KGSS for quite a while and was satisfied with the combination. Then I read a review of the K1000/FirstWatt F1 in 6Moons

http://6moons.com/audioreviews/first...irstwatt3.html

So I dusted off my K1000s which had been languishing in a closet for five years, and purshased the FirstWatt F1 amplifier. Following a number of recommendations, I upgraded the cabling on the K1000s with the Stefan AudioArt Equinox hardwire cable. The combination is stunning. This amplifier and cabling changed the K1000s totally. I ended up selling my Omega II / KGSS combination forthwith, and am not sorry.

So the bottom line is that the K1000s are incredible "earspeakers" only if they are properly cabled and properly amplified. The K1000s are even more sensitive to proper cabling and amplification than other cans, but if you go to the trouble to make these changes, IMO you will be rewarded with the very best headphone audio possible.

 

[jessica_fae]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmarshl So I dusted off my K1000s which had been languishing in a closet for five years, and purshased the FirstWatt F1 amplifier. The combination is stunning. This amplifier and cabling changed the K1000s totally.

Well that does it. Thank you!! Between your comments here, the 6 moons review, robm321 comments and this review I found also on 6moons http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/stax/stax.html I'm convinced that the K1000 is the right next addition to my collection. Like I said before I'm not in this to find the perfect headphone because I don't believe it exists. I'm searching for my way in all this, and so far the best way I've found is by experiencing as many different angles on this as possible to find the middle that lies between (thanks wulata for seeing what I was getting at).

My main system is a single-end tube amplifer driving 8 foot tall Acoustat electrostatic loudspeakers. I completely fell in love with single-ended amplifiers about 7 years ago. There aren't many speakers that can capture that single-ended magic properly and finding out now that the K1000 has amazing synergy with the First Watt (an evolution of the Nelson Pass Aleph lineage - also a favorite of mine) brings a huge smile to my face

and pretty much settles this debate for me.

Ok now I quest for a new-old-stock or used K1000. I've made some phone calls and no luck so far, but I suspect something will turn up.

Jessica
- team K1000 here I come....

 

[robm321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jessica_fae Well that does it. Thank you!! Between your comments here, the 6 moons review, robm321 comments and this review I found also on 6moons http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/stax/stax.html I'm convinced that the K1000 is the right next addition to my collection. Like I said before I'm not in this to find the perfect headphone because I don't believe it exists. I'm searching for my way in all this, and so far the best way I've found is by experiencing as many different angles on this as possible to find the middle that lies between (thanks wulata for seeing what I was getting at). My main system is a single-end tube amplifer driving 8 foot tall Acoustat electrostatic loudspeakers. I completely fell in love with single-ended amplifiers about 7 years ago. There aren't many speakers that can capture that single-ended magic properly and finding out now that the K1000 has amazing synergy with the First Watt (an evolution of the Nelson Pass Aleph lineage - also a favorite of mine) brings a huge smile to my face and pretty much settles this debate for me. Ok now I quest for a new-old-stock or used K1000. I've made some phone calls and no luck so far, but I suspect something will turn up. Jessica - team K1000 here I come....

Good luck with hunting one down. Let us know your impressions. I have the stock cable and tube amp (using OTL), and I think I can improve things much by the F1/F2 and recabling. I just don't want to give the phones up for a month or more to get it done

 

[tmarshl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by robm321 Good luck with hunting one down. Let us know your impressions. I have the stock cable and tube amp (using OTL), and I think I can improve things much by the F1/F2 and recabling. I just don't want to give the phones up for a month or more to get it done

Rob,

The current wait for the Stefan AudioArt Equinox K1000 hardwire upgrade is 10-11 weeks:

http://stefanaudioart.com/K1000CableHardwired.html

My recommendation is to put in your order for the hardwire cable, and have it sent back to you when it is available. Then send your K1000s and the cable to your installer, who if you time things properly, should only take about a week to turn around your upgraded K1000s.

 

[Nik]

Jessica, can you use the K1000 late in the night with your best setup... ? This cans is TOTALLY open and every one listen what you are listening...

Best!
Nicola

 

[jessica_fae]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nik Jessica, can you use the K1000 late in the night with your best setup... ? This cans is TOTALLY open and every one listen what you are listening... Best! Nicola

Hi Nicola,
I shouldn't have a problem. I live a victorian row house in Cambridge and the neighbors are separated by two layers of bricks - no insulation. This means we can hear each other pretty well, but the bricks muffle the sound alot. It's almost like commune living in a way. I can't believe that a K1000 is loud enough to penetrate a brick wall

My cat loves the music I play and doesn't mind.

Cheers
Jessica

 

[jessica_fae]

Wow talk about synchronicity - cheezyg has a nearly brand new pair of K1000s to sell that are only 3 weeks old, with only 10hours on them, and warranty till 2008. Exactly what I was looking for. We are just finishing up the sale. I've always wanted to visit Australia, but getting some K1000s from there is a pretty good second place.

 

[tmarshl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jessica_fae Wow talk about synchronicity - cheezyg has a nearly brand new pair of K1000s to sell that are only 3 weeks old, with only 10hours on them, and warranty till 2008. Exactly what I was looking for. We are just finishing up the sale. I've always wanted to visit Australia, but getting some K1000s from there is a pretty good second place.

Outstanding! Congratulations!

 

[jessica_fae]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmarshl Outstanding! Congratulations!

Well my K1000 are finally in the house. I've only been listening to them for 3 days so these are very early impressions, but I thought I'd comment while these impressions are fresh. This pair of K1000 was bought new only about a month ago and the first owner only listened to them for 2 weeks before reselling them. I suspect they still need some burn in. Can anyone comment on the burnin time/process for K1000s?

Well my initial impression is really quite good, but they didn't 'blow me away'. There is no doubt that these are world class headphones and deserving of their reputation. And they seem to be getting better each time I tweak them. These are definitely a 'tweakers' headphone. Toe-in angle and volume level dramatically effect the character of these phones. Right now they strike me as improving on the HD580/Gilmore characters in almost every regards, but seem to be a bit of give and take with regards to the Stax.

With only a small stack of CDs listened to for comparison here is my initial impression. The K1000 has amazing tonal balance. Instruments and voices sound very right. The K1000 also seem to take this tonal balance a bit lower than the Stax. The Stax also excell in tonal balance, but there are a few instruments of the viola character that on the Stax would be quieter and a bit more recessed, where the K1000 will bring them a bit more prominant. The Stax is also more expressive of 'air' around instruments and decay of notes. Overall the Stax Lamdba and K1000 are very comparable in terms of tonal balance and both definitely sound 'right' to my ears.

But there was something that has been off about the K1000s that I've been trying to put my finger on. They have detail, they have excellent instrumental separation, they have great tone quality, they have amazing left-right soundstaging, but they have been striking me as having very little soundstage depth and lacking in subtle expression compared to the Stax. I initially had the K1000s really quite flared open, and I've been slowly moving the driver angles more and more in. With the speakers flared out (almost pointing straight back) they give an amazing open and wide experience, but completely sacrifice soundstage depth and seems to spread performers out a bit (less pin-point). I think I've found a good angle now which seems to give me a really good compromise between soundstage width and depth and pin-point accuracy. They still strike me as having a rather 'flat' soundstage compared to my Stax and my floorstanding electrostatics though.

On Loreena McKennitt's "Full Circle" from the CD "the mask and the mirror", the song starts off with a esraj (a sitar-like intrument that is played with a bow like the viola) that is performed in a large room (probably a cathedral) and placed rather far from the microphone. On the Stax and my floorstanding Acoustats, this instrument hangs in space that feels like 10 feet back with a sense of the room as the instrument fills the space. It has this magical quality that always makes me catch my breath. On the K1000s this essence is lost. On the K1000 the instrument is absolutely beautiful and the song is still breath taking, but it doesn't quite transport me to that recording place like the Stax can. On the Stax the passion of the performer also seems to come through better than the K1000 - microdynamics. On the K1000, the performance dynamics feel a bit flatter and not quite as emotional. I've found the same pattern on choral and chamber CDs and on several other world music CDs. Compared to the HD580s and all my other headphones, I'd call the K1000 soundstage deep and performers expressive, so realize that my comments are relative to my experience with the Stax Lamdba and not meant to be taken as any absolutes. The K1000 have amazing soundstaging, but it seems to sacrifice depth cues to give that amazingly wide stage with pin point performers placed in it. I thought the Stax had a wide soundstage for a headphone, but the K1000 is ultra-wide. The Stax are just as pin-point precise, but the soundstage is a different shape. I miss the 3D quality that the Stax can capture though.

I am definitely finding that the K1000s sound better if I turn down the volume and let my ears approach them, just like I've found with the Stax. Right now I have my preamp turned down to -26db. My floorstanders need the preamp at -18db. As I've been turning down the amplification, the K1000s seem to be getting much better at expressing the subtle dynamics of performances, but they still don't quite approach what the Stax can do. This really seems to go against a lot of the impressions I've read here which say that the K1000 needs to 'be turned up to wake up'. I suspect that with a headphone amplifier (<1watt) that might be the case, but with a speaker amplfier (40watts) it really needs to be turned down. I suspect that the K1000 driver will compress dynamics when it starts to reach it limits rather than distorting. This could be really deceptive since so much 'rock' and 'radio' music is run through 'compressors' to simulate what happens when we listen to loud music. For small ensembl music and soloists playing acoustic instruments where one wants to feel the microdynamic emotional expressions that a musician can express, the K1000 really needs to be turned down and one's ears need to approach the slightly softer peformance.

I have to admit, now that I've turned down the volume and angled the K1000s in a bit more to move the performance a bit more into my head, they are starting to grow on me. Even with the moderate toe-in angle, they are still more 'out of head' than the Stax. The Stax still has the edge on transporting me to another place and making reality disolve, but the K1000 is close. I do like the feeling of having the speakers hanging in space rather than the feeling of earpads surrounding my ears. The K1000s are beautiful sounding and there is no doubt in my mind that these phones are definitely worth their hype. I'm hoping with a bit more break-in and a little more tweaking that the K1000 will shine through with some unique qualities of their own. But right now they strike me as very similar in character to my Stax, with a bit more bottom end, a wider soundstage, but not quite the magical 3D transporters that the Stax are.

I definitely like the K1000 and I'm really enjoying listening to music on them. They produce absolutely beautiful music with amazing detail, excellent left-right soundstaging, and every now and then surprise me with something. I'm not sure if my HD580/Gilmore will get used much from this point forward. But if I was forced to choose one headphone to live with today, I'd still pick my Stax Lamdba. But since I don't have to choose, I'm very happy that I've got both. Let's see what happens after a couple months with the K1000s

Jessica

 

[smeggy]

Thanks for the impressions Jessica, I'm sure you'll have lots of fun experimenting the K1000s.

 

[wualta]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jessica_fae I am definitely finding that the K1000s sound better if I turn down the volume and let my ears approach them, just like I've found with the Stax.

Rem acu tetigisti. I've never heard this subjective phenomenon expressed better. If anyone ever needed a demonstration of the fundamental flexibility (not to say nonlinearity) of the ear/brain, this is one.

 

[jessica_fae]

So this is a follow up on living with the AKG K1000 after owning them for around 8 months.

I have to admit to have had a bit of a love/hate relationship with the K1000 this last year. To my ears the K1000s are very well balanced and remind me a lot of my floor standing electrostatic speakers (ESL). But the speakers portray better soundstage depth, are more 3D, have much better bass (well defined and textured bass), and generally transport me into the recording better than the K1000. I could say the same thing about the Stax Lamdba compared to the K1000. So there weren't many times when I plugged the K1000 in. These are all amazing music makers, but I basically ranked them Acoustat 1+1 ESL > Stax Lambda > K1000 >> HD580. But every time I did plug the K1000 in I thought, wow these are really good, why don't I listen to them more. But then I'd notice missing things, and I'd unplug them and most nights I'd just listen to my Acoustat ESL.

Well over the last 3 months I started looking at jobs in Japan and realized that I could really make this happen with a little patience. I've always wanted to live in Japan but always thought it a bit of a dream. So I started looking at my life and realized that 8' tall ESL speakers really are a bit much to transport again or to fit into a Japanese home. The walls are very thin in most buildings and rooms are just a bit smaller than in the UK. So I may have to let go of my speakers and speaker listening in general. Every time I plug the Lamdba/SRM1 into my better sources I'm in awe. They aren't as good overall as the ESL, but 99.9% of the magic is there with the better front ends. There are only a small handful of recordings where certain deep bass instruments disappear on the stax where the ESL allowed them to be expressed. For the record I have the original Lamdba not the high bias Lamdba Pro. The original Lamdba has a warmer sound and less high frequency emphasis than the Pro.

So I thought at this point that I could live with just my Stax Lambda + nice front ends if needed, and maybe upgrade to Omega IIs with the money from selling the rest of my kit. But then I started listening to my K1000 again on a regular basis out of curiosity.

I've come to realized that there is something the K1000 do that the Stax can't capture and I'm not sure the Omega IIs will capture either. There is a not-headphone quality about the K1000 that are just so different from any other headphone I've ever listened to, even earspeakers like the Stax.

I realize this isn't a typical headphone impression post. I'm not talking about aspects of sound, or giving detailed comparisons of quality, or being enthused about an amazing discovery. I just realized that right now my headphone bliss is split between my Stax Lamdba and my K1000. If I had to pick just one, I'd pick the Stax Lambda in a heart beat. To put it in perspective, If I just had the Stax I'd have 99.9% of what I experience of music from my ELS system. If I just had the K1000 I'd have 98% of my ESL system (but a different subset of the experience). But if I had both, I'd have 99.999% of what I get from my ESL system and would pick a different headphone depending on my mood or recording.

I wish I could put my finger on it. Everything that I can put words on, 3D soundstage, illusion of musicians in a space, microdynamics of soloist expression, realism of bass and drums, refined detail of expression, or emotion of vocalists the Stax are better than the K1000 in my opinion. But despite all this the K1000 does something different, more speaker-like that I don't find in any other headphone. It's almost the difference between turning the lights off and completely falling into the music (stax lamdba) and having most of that experience without needing to give it one's full attention (k1000). The Stax almost demand your full attention to appreciate them and wow do they deliver when you do. The K1000 is easier to approach, a bit less immersing, and yet most of the magic is there even if it isn't as deep as the Stax. It's almost that the K1000 are an amazing compromise between the best that speakers can give and the best that headphones can give, which makes them a great daily music maker while one does other things. There is no doubt that both the Stax Lamdba and K1000 can easily express the greatness that better front ends and amplifiers can bring to a system.

So I wish I could sell my VK20 preamp, my SE40 tube amplifier, and my Acoustat 1+1 speakers and just live with my nice turntable and CD with my Stax Lamdba /SRM1mk2, but I can't. The K1000 still has a place and needs a really good amplifier/preamp to sound good. So sometime soon, my Acoustats will be sold and thanks to the K1000, that is ok. And that is saying a lot.

Jessica

 

[tmarshl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jessica_fae /img/forum/go_quote.gif So this is a follow up on living with the AKG K1000 after owning them for around 8 months. .............. So I thought at this point that I could live with just my Stax Lambda + nice front ends if needed, and maybe upgrade to Omega IIs with the money from selling the rest of my kit. Jessica

I used to have a pair of Stax Omega IIs driven by a KGSS amplifier, and I sold them once I perfected my K1000 setup, because the K1000s were much better. If you have the determination to get it right, IMHO the K1000s can deliver the best possible sound.

For me it was doing a hardwire recabling with the Stefan AudioArts Equinox cable (which is not a DIY installation project) and the First Watt F1 current source amplifier by Nelson Pass, running fully balanced.

Once I got the K1000 setup perfected, my other headphones sat in their boxes unused: Omega IIs with KGSS; HD650s; K701s. So I found homes for all of them and am delighted with my K1000 setup.

 

[fmplautus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmarshl /img/forum/go_quote.gif is that the K1000s are incredible "earspeakers" only if they are properly cabled and properly amplified. :

I agree that the K1000 is the most remarkable headphone (earspeakers) in the world, but I strongly disagree that the K1000 is "incredible...only if they are properly cabled and amplified."

I guess we can argue about what is "proper," but in my opinion
if you can't hear what is remarkable about the K-1000 with the stock cable, and driven through any properly operating intergrated amplifier or receiver capable of producing 10 clean watts, then don't bother. You will be better off with conventional phones.

The K1000 is the most amazing audio transducer I have ever encountered, but it shouldn't be reserved for the audiophile priesthood, or only for those with deep pockets. You can get in on the fun with a pair of the K1000, an iPod and the little digital T-amp, and radio shack wire. In fact you can have a great time shaking your ass off, dancing and giggling at those who've dropped thousands on esoteric systems and don't get nearly so close as lucky you and your humble 'pod shuffle hooked up to grandma's Sansui and the red bird cage.

The AKG K-1000 is a miracle of engineering and market defiance. It don't need no gee-haw, diamond studed Elvis buckles, lizard skin cowboy boots, pure silver baubles and bangles or even audiophile priesthood piercings or back floggings to do its stuff. Just clean out the ear wax, and kick off the shoes and don't worry about all the laughing going on about that ridiculous thing on your head.