[VicAjax]

I like Zoot Allures (a lot), but I wouldn't rank it among my Top Five Zappa Albums. It's a really fun album to rock out to, and there's one particularly killer tune, "The Torture Never Stops," but compositionally it's not quite as strong as most of his other albums from the same period.

 

[BloodSugar00]

After about 8 or 9 listens to that album I'm starting to funnel out at, pretty much, your feelings and sentiments on Zoot Allures there VicAjax.

 

[scompton]

I agree. I also find Wind Up Working at a Gas Station annoying. Not as annoying as a couple of other songs though from the same era like Let Me Take You to the Beach and A Little Green Rosetta. A Little Green Rosetta on Joe's Garage is the ultimate filler and a horrible way to end that album. I like what he did with it on Lather. About a minute in, it just stops and he says "Where upon the door slams violently" and it goes to the next song.

 

[VicAjax]

Quote:

Originally Posted by scompton /img/forum/go_quote.gif I agree. I also find Wind Up Working at a Gas Station annoying. Not as annoying as a couple of other songs though from the same era like Let Me Take You to the Beach and A Little Green Rosetta. A Little Green Rosetta on Joe's Garage is the ultimate filler and a horrible way to end that album. I like what he did with it on Lather. About a minute in, it just stops and he says "Where upon the door slams violently" and it goes to the next song.

QFT

 

[BloodSugar00]

I've not yet bought or heard 'Joe's Garage' but it's certainly one, along with 'Lather', I've been heavily considering as my next venture into his catelogue. Still got plaenty to digest, however

. How do ppl feel about '200 Motels', out of interest?

 

[Caribou679]

Quote:

Originally Posted by BloodSugar00 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I've not yet bought or heard 'Joe's Garage' but it's certainly one, along with 'Lather', I've been heavily considering as my next venture into his catelogue. Still got plaenty to digest, however . How do ppl feel about '200 Motels', out of interest?

200 Motels is in a league all by itself. I had the chance to see the movie in 1976 and it was very weird. A story relating to the adventures of his musicians while touring the USA.
At the same time the London Philharmonic Orchestra musicians are in an internment camp, style WW2 prisoner's camp and are forced to play.

A lot of contemporary music by the classical guys and some Mothers's music.

The movie should be around somewhere...

regards,

 

[scompton]

It's been a long time since I've seen the movie or listened to the album. I have it on LP and I've just recently had a turntable restored. I'm slowly going thought my LPs. I don't really remember he album well because it's been 20 years or so since I listened to it, but that probably tells you something in itself.

Joe's Garage has some great music, including what some consider his best guitar solo, Watermelon In Easter Hay. It's also got lyrics that will easily offend those easily offended, on almost every song. There's probably only a few safe for work tracks on it. And as I said in a previous post, the last track is 10 minutes plus of filler.

I prefer Lather because it has such a variety of music, from orchestral music to bluesy rock. It has my favorite guitar solo, Duck Duck Goose, which wasn't released on any other album. One of the few tracks that that's true for. It has a few songs, and some long ones, that are as offensive as those on Joe's Garage, and it also has my absolutely least favorite song, Let Me Take You to the Beach. It always makes me hit the skip track button and when I listened to the LP, I started that side on the second track. It's incredibly annoying.

 

[BloodSugar00]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caribou679 /img/forum/go_quote.gif 200 Motels is in a league all by itself. I had the chance to see the movie in 1976 and it was very weird. A story relating to the adventures of his musicians while touring the USA. At the same time the London Philharmonic Orchestra musicians are in an internment camp, style WW2 prisoner's camp and are forced to play. A lot of contemporary music by the classical guys and some Mothers's music. The movie should be around somewhere... regards,

I was referring to the soundtrack album of the same name, but that's my bad as I didn't make it clear

. Having said that, thanks for the little overview of the film of '200 Motels' you shared there; I knew nothing about the corresponding film so it's appreciated! Zappa's three films (and that he also produced a musical soundtrack for of the same name) were '200 Motels', 'Uncle Meat' and 'Baby Snakes', is that right? They're the only 3 I've picked up on anyway. I havn't conducted a thorough or focused search, by any means, but the films are hard to come by, in passing, and I havn't come across copies of them in DVD, only VHS- anyone know if (any of) these are obtainable (in DVD format) anywhere, as I would be interested to check em out, if possible?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scompton It's been a long time since I've seen the movie or listened to the album. I have it on LP and I've just recently had a turntable restored. I'm slowly going thought my LPs. I don't really remember he album well because it's been 20 years or so since I listened to it, but that probably tells you something in itself. Joe's Garage has some great music, including what some consider his best guitar solo, Watermelon In Easter Hay. It's also got lyrics that will easily offend those easily offended, on almost every song. There's probably only a few safe for work tracks on it. And as I said in a previous post, the last track is 10 minutes plus of filler. I prefer Lather because it has such a variety of music, from orchestral music to bluesy rock. It has my favorite guitar solo, Duck Duck Goose, which wasn't released on any other album. One of the few tracks that that's true for. It has a few songs, and some long ones, that are as offensive as those on Joe's Garage, and it also has my absolutely least favorite song, Let Me Take You to the Beach. It always makes me hit the skip track button and when I listened to the LP, I started that side on the second track. It's incredibly annoying. Today 02:45 AM

I appreciate that you havn't seen ad/or heard '200 Motels' in anytime recently to be able to comment on them, that's fair play. Can you comment on 'Uncle Meat' and/or 'Baby Snakes', the films and/or accompanying soundtracks (I do own the 'Uncle Meat' soundtrack- the 2CD version that's been remixed and re-editied, aswell as remastered, to include voice-over clips from the movie in and amoungst the music/original record tracks (apparently, many fans consider these penalty content, as opposed to bonus, and this version of the 'Uncle Meat' soundtrack is criticised in comparison to the original LP mix)?

Joe's Garage has had my curiosity piqued for some time now! A combination of the cover, the description of it being a 'Rock Opera', the 3 Acts/size and weight of this body of work/release/project, the fact that it's one of his first forays into using his 'Muffin Kitchen' and/or the synclavia to replace musicians, and, finally but certainly not least, that it is, like the previous point, one of his first records to bear heavy xenochrony application (whilst this isn't creative from a playing an instrument perspective, it is from a production/engineering/record and songwriting and composing perspective, and I'd be interested to see how tastefully he manages to apply such old solos and/or pieces of music to new works!). Thanks for sharing some of your thoughts and feelings on it!

The endorsement 'Lather' has recieved on here and elsewhere has had me interested in it in for a while, but It hasn't been the right time for me to check it out yet- felt it more natural and prudent and right to explore his early material first (solo and/or with the Mothers)- and then I wasn't sure whether to check out the individual albums that, across them, dispersed, contain the bulk of the material (compiled in one place) on Lather, first (ie Zappa in New York, which I already own, Studio Tan, Sleep Dirt and Orchestral Favourites, being the main ones containing the work on Lather, Shut Up and Play Your Guitar also containing some fragments). Any advice to offer there? Would the respective albums be better to check out first, before Lather, and/or to give me a better perspective on the arrangment of Lather, when I eventually listen to it, or is going straight to Lather the best bet (or is it 6's and two 3's?)

EDIT: I probably shouldn't- spent a lot of doe recently!- but I just thought ''***** it!'' and have put an order in for Studio Tan, Sleep Dirt (will be the CD pressing with the overdubbed vocals and drums on 'Flambay', 'Spider of Destiny' and 'Time is Money' by Thana Harris and Chad Wackerman, respectively), Orchestral Favourites, Lather (''Leather'') and Joe's Garage: Acts I, II & III! I know I've ordered much Zappa and/or the Mother's work since Christmas- and still havn't listened much-extensively to a fair bit of it- but I wanted more serious and fresh Zappa (predominantly; Zappa does integrate live and studio works into a release very frequently) studio material; most of the new material I have to listen to is live and/or Mother's projects.

 

[scompton]

I'm in the same situation with Baby Snakes as 200 Motels. I have the picture disk but haven't listened to it in years. I've never seen the movie.

I don't think Uncle Meat was ever made into a movie. I'm one of those who consider the bonus tracks on Uncle Meat more as a penalty than a bonus.

Either way you buy the music that's on Lather is fine. They way you're doing it is probably a little more expensive. Personally, I have done both. I had a bootleg LP version of Lather and bought it on CD as soon as it came out. I like the CD better. There are quite a few CDs that have music on Lather that I still own, like Live in New York. Even if I owned all of the albums that duplicate Lather, I'd still want Lather for the few tracks I love that aren't anywhere else, like Duck Duck Goose. I'd also want the others, like Live in New York for tracks like Sofa which is another of my favorite Zappa songs. This gets expensive because Zappa's are rarely discounted, but I've been buying them for 20 years.

In fact Zappa is the reason I got my first CD player in 87. He had started putting out albums in CD only and I owned 5 of them before I had the time to shop for a CD player.

Once I figure out how to deep clean my LPs, I'll start doing needle drops.

 

[VicAjax]

South Compton is pretty much on target. there's a lot of overlap with Lather, but it's worth getting either way.

as for Uncle Meat, it's a fine, fine album... very worth getting and better than 200 Motels. it's got some spoken word that you'll ultimately want to skip through after a few listens to get to the music, but it's a 3-disc set so there's tons of brilliance... especially the "King Kong" suite at the end.

200 Motels is also worth getting... i prefer it to the likes of Studio Tan, Sleep Dirt or Sheik Yerbouti.

 

[scompton]

I didn't mean to imply that I don't like Uncle Meat. I love it except the bonus tracks. That's really true for a lot of rock albums with bonus tracks.

It's Steve BTW

Edit: Zappa on DVD is available, at least for Region 1 http://barfkoswill.shop.musictoday.c...px?cp=971_4044.

There's an email link at the bottom of that page and they may be able to tell you where to buy DVDs that will work for you.

 

[BloodSugar00]

Thanks for the link to Zappa DVD releases Scompton (or Steve; my name too btw

)! Appreciated. I can't help but see '200 Motels' isn't there though; musn't have been released on DVD to date. I've bookmarked it for a later date when the money's in

Yeah, Zappa's material is, as you say, usually pretty expensive but I've been using Amazon's Marketplace's and/or Play.com's Playtrade's 3rd party dealers for much better deals for quite a while now, so, at those fairer prices, it's not so bad on the wallet

. I decided to go for both options on the material of Lather: Zappa in New York/Studio Tan/Sleep Dirt/Orchestral Favourites, to get the full picture and to appreciate both artistic approaches and presenations of that batch of work and digest it in both it's contexts! I've read that the material split up into the 4 records aforementioned above, meant that, per record, the songs were united in an overall feel and vibe so you got 4 releases with their own distinct musical flavour and/or direction that felt like a cohesive album. Lather, conversely, lost this by mixing up the tracks 'randomly', creating it's own overall feel and atmosphere, collectively, song into song. I wanted to appreciate the music in both these scenarios/presentations. I'm a deep bugger, when I get going! Well that's not true; I am by nature, really.

I've not listened to 'Uncle Meat' yet- though I know you have a soft spot for it VicAjax!- but the edition I've got is 2CD. There's likely numerous editions of it, however! I'm looking forward to giving that one a listen! I'm sitting here listening to Wazoo; a great live recording in SQ exhibiting absolutely brilliant muscianship!

@ Scompton, I look forward to more of your impressions once you've had the opportunity to listen to some of your old Zappa LP's!

 

[VicAjax]

Quote:

Originally Posted by scompton /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's Steve BTW

It's a shame really. not that i have anything against the name Steve; it complements Compton quite sufficiently, in fact. But have you ever given any consideration to legally changing your first name to "South?" The publicity would be through the roof, you know. Perhaps for a daughter? I think "South" for a girl would be very pretty... just a thought.

I may just keep calling you South anyway.

 

[BloodSugar00]

Just thought I'd drop in with a few thoughts and impressions and coments on some of the Zappa material I've been listening to recently....

Joe's Garage: Acts I, II & III I've listened to once all the way through and select tracks several times now. Not enough to have conclusive sentiments on the album yet, I know, but it's an interesting body of work and I do like the artistic context and backdrop of a play/concept album/'Rock Opera', that links the tracks into a progression and loose story, the 'Central Scutiniser' conveying most of it. I get the impression that this record is meant to be more of a seamless animal and microcosm of Frank's 'conceptual continuity', as opposed to distinctive, separate tracks, which I like. Like any Zappa record, some of the lyrics and anecdotes are hilarious, of course, as much in the delivery and charisma as in the content!

'Watermelon in Easter Hay' is a smashing insturmental track and exhibition of his guitar soloing mastery! As Vai puts it, Zappa was a 'visceral' guitar player, and he really does paint with his guitar, as I see it! This track is a luscious, yet laid back, example of that.

'A Little Green Rosetta' is a bit of a nothing song with little, if any, real substance, and I can see why people object to it (strongly). I find it quite fun, for what it is. Still, it is a strange choice to end such an artistic project on (I'm sure there must of been some artistic contention/intentio behind it as opposed to him just lazily appending such comparative filler on the end of what is otherwise, obviously, a labored over piece of work). I'm gona have to muse on that one a while longer but it's curious.


Other impressions of note:

On 'Weasels Ripped My Flesh', I love 'Orange County Lumber Truck'- the main melody line in that track is so carrying!- and then how that track runs over into that (what serves as a) long punctuation mark for the album of feedback and create-most-noise-as-each-player-can frenzy of the title track! Excellent stuff. The cover of 'Directly From My Heart to You' is also very musical and engaging, with a great swell and movement to it! Interestingly compiled album also; perhaps Zappa's first foray into his later edit-room love for syphoning together studio and live work, composing from product, as it were?

I've also listened several times to 'Freak Out!', 'Absolutely Free' and 'Cruising With Ruben & the Jets' but not really enough to have gotten fuly to grips with em yet. Their content hasn't really grabbed me and shook me yet, as it were. I thought 'Cruising with Ruben...', despite it being a pop/doo wop album of releatively short love songs, had some great music in it, be it riffs, chord movements, clever tempo changes or whatever. These little tastes and flavours that enrichen the tracks some.

'Freak Out!' has quite a bit of doo-wop in it, also. In fact, the middle group of tracks is basically a doo-wop sequence, bookended by the more estranged opening tracks and the far more estranged ending tracks! 'Help I'm a Rock'-'The Return of the Son of Monster Magnet' is very music concrete and avant garde, quite akin to 'Lumpy Gravy' with the wacky dialogue blurbs-little conversations. Interesting to listen to but not leaving long lasting impressions easily, so far. Probably just need more listn to digest them.

'Chunga's Revenge' continues to grow on me and I love the guitar driven rambles of 'Transylvania Boogie' and the title track! 'Sharleena' is nice way to end the album also. Interesting that this was the first Zappa record to feature Flo & Eddie, also.

I have quite a lot more I could add but it's late/early here and I'll leave it a that for now

. Oh, I've ordered in '200 Motels', and, 'Ahead of Their Time' and 'The Dub Room Special'. More goodies to listen to

 

[scompton]

Quote:

Originally Posted by BloodSugar00 /img/forum/go_quote.gif 'A Little Green Rosetta' is a bit of a nothing song with little, if any, real substance, and I can see why people object to it (strongly). I find it quite fun, for what it is. Still, it is a strange choice to end such an artistic project on (I'm sure there must of been some artistic contention/intentio behind it as opposed to him just lazily appending such comparative filler on the end of what is otherwise, obviously, a labored over piece of work). I'm gona have to muse on that one a while longer but it's curious.

Wait until you've heard it 100 times

I don't really object to it strongly, I just don't like it and think it's filler. There's only a few Zappa songs I truly hate, including Let Me Take You to the Beach and maybe most of Man From Utopia.

I say maybe because it's been a very long time since I've listened to it. I bought a cassette copy of it when it came out and I was on extended business travel. I bought a Walkman and 3 tapes and that was it for my music so I listened to it a lot over the next month. There's probably good music on it, but what sticks in my mind is the bad. Just typing this, I've got part of Dangerous Kitchen stuck in my head

Time to put my iPod on, which has some non Zappa dowop up.