[Rowethren]

   
I don't want to ruffle any feathers or anything, but as an owner of the 400i and having also heard the Elear, I would temper my expectations as to how much better the latter headphone is.

 
Thanks for the input. To be honest I am not set on an Elear or anything I just want to have a listen, it will be by no means the only headphone I listen to when deciding my upgrade 

.

 

[chowmein83]

  Could you please elaborate on your comparison? Thanks!

 
Ok, first I have to admit that I did not hear my 400i and the Elear side by side. Also, sound signature preference probably played somewhat of a role as to why I'm saying this.
 
That being said, IMO the Elear did not jump out to me immediately as being much better than the 400i. For one, I'm not sure if the Elear's soundstage was any bigger than that of the 400i. In fact, I think the Elear may have sounded more "congested" (in that everything is closer together, not necessarily that these things aren't separated apart) than the 400i, though don't quote me on this because I didn't listen to them both at the same event.
 
Also, I'm not quite sure if the Elear is actually more detailed. At least it wasn't very obvious that it was. But again, don't quote me on this because I didn't listen to the 2 headphones side by side.

 

[Stillhart]

   
I don't want to ruffle any feathers or anything, but as an owner of the 400i and having also heard the Elear, I would temper my expectations as to how much better the latter headphone is.

 
 

  Could you please elaborate on your comparison? Thanks!
 
I also fail to understand why it should bother anyone if you post your honest impressions.
 
Are we only allowed to be positive about new launches?

 
We all have different ears and different things we look for in a headphone.  I'd take the Elear of the HE-400i any day of the week, but I find the HE-400i to be extremely muddy.  It's not bad at its price point, but it's in a different league from the Elear IMHO.  I think the Elear is much better technically.  Tonally they're different, though, so you may find that you prefer the HE-400i just from that perspective.

 

[rthomas]

Ok, but I've not read a single review that states that the HE-400i sounds ''muddy''.
 
I've heard them as well and have to disagree with your conclusion.

 

[Stillhart]

  Ok, but I've not read a single review that states that the HE-400i sounds ''muddy''.
 
I've heard them as well and have to disagree with your conclusion.

 
To each their own.  Listening to it back to back with the HE-560 made it pretty obvious to me.  YMMV If you're happy with the HE-400i and don't feel the need to spend $1000 on a new headphone, more power to ya!  Save a few bucks!

 

[24grant24]

Listen I am the furthest thing from a fan of the 400i, i really dont like it, but I would NEVER describe it as muddy, yes different people hear different things, and prioritze different strengths in a headphone, and use different words to describe things , but i dont think anybody would call the he400i muddy, not as resolving as other cans sure, but never muddy. There is a point where "we all hear different things" has gone overboard and this is one of those times. I know you are really in here trying to sell the new focals to people but step it back a bit stillhart, you are embarassing yourself.

 

[pkcpga]

I have not heard the focals yet but the 400 and 400i were both a let down to me. The 400 original while lacking detail at least had bass for bassheads. But the updated 400i didn't seem to add any detail to the bass but lost most of its punch. Both lacked any real detail for a $500 headphone and had not great sound stages. Not sure I'd say either were muddy but definitely lacked detail at their price point not sure why they should be compared to a $1000 headphone. More interested in seeing how the elear compares to the hd800. Anyone compare them yet?

 

[Hansotek]

Listen I am the furthest thing from a fan of the 400i, i really dont like it, but I would NEVER describe it as muddy, yes different people hear different things, and prioritze different strengths in a headphone, and use different words to describe things , but i dont think anybody would call the he400i muddy, not as resolving as other cans sure, but never muddy. There is a point where "we all hear different things" has gone overboard and this is one of those times. I know you are really in here trying to sell the new focals to people but step it back a bit stillhart, you are embarassing yourself.

He has nothing to gain from people buying the Focals. The guy likes the headphone, he talks about it a little bit and then people jump on him for it? What the heck is so wrong with liking something on Head-fi these days? This place has gotten so unnecessarily hostile.

We're all here because we love audio aren't we? Let's try and be nice to each other for a change instead of being so cynical and snippy. It's hard to even read this thread because people are just downright rude in here. Anybody who says anything positive about any of these headphones is pretty much under attack instantly... it doesn't even matter what they say in subsequent posts. I appreciate healthy cynicism, but this is just plain ridiculous.

 

[warrenpchi]

 

Listen I am the furthest thing from a fan of the 400i, i really dont like it, but I would NEVER describe it as muddy, yes different people hear different things, and prioritze different strengths in a headphone, and use different words to describe things , but i dont think anybody would call the he400i muddy, not as resolving as other cans sure, but never muddy. There is a point where "we all hear different things" has gone overboard and this is one of those times. I know you are really in here trying to sell the new focals to people but step it back a bit stillhart, you are embarassing yourself.

He has nothing to gain from people buying the Focals. The guy likes the headphone, he talks about it a little bit and then people jump on him for it? What the heck is so wrong with liking something on Head-fi these days? This place has gotten so unnecessarily hostile.

We're all here because we love audio aren't we? Let's try and be nice to each other for a change instead of being so cynical and snippy. It's hard to even read this thread because people are just downright rude in here. Anybody who says anything positive about any of these headphones is pretty much under attack instantly... it doesn't even matter what they say in subsequent posts. I appreciate healthy cynicism, but this is just plain ridiculous.

 
+1  Speaking of going overboard, how did things go from disagreeing on a headphone (the HE-400i in this case), to jumping all the way to Stillhart pushing the Elear on people?

 

[bigfatpaulie]

He has nothing to gain from people buying the Focals. The guy likes the headphone, he talks about it a little bit and then people jump on him for it? What the heck is so wrong with liking something on Head-fi these days? This place has gotten so unnecessarily hostile.

We're all here because we love audio aren't we? Let's try and be nice to each other for a change instead of being so cynical and snippy. It's hard to even read this thread because people are just downright rude in here. Anybody who says anything positive about any of these headphones is pretty much under attack instantly... it doesn't even matter what they say in subsequent posts. I appreciate healthy cynicism, but this is just plain ridiculous.

 
I absolutely, 100% agree.  Often I feel as though Head-Fi is filled with people armed with pitchforks and not knowledge or experience.  They are mad because they can't afford or don't understand something.    
 
Frankly, it makes it hard place to be sometimes.  Fortunately, there are still some excellent folks around. 

 

[grizzlybeast]

I have not heard the focals yet but the 400 and 400i were both a let down to me. The 400 original while lacking detail at least had bass for bassheads. But the updated 400i didn't seem to add any detail to the bass but lost most of its punch. Both lacked any real detail for a $500 headphone and had not great sound stages. Not sure I'd say either were muddy but definitely lacked detail at their price point not sure why they should be compared to a $1000 headphone. More interested in seeing how the elear compares to the hd800. Anyone compare them yet?

Not gonna be a good comparison. That makes more sense for the utopia. Also for a 300 hp the 400 is anything but lacking details. Not sure what this lacking detail stuff is all about.

 

[Vigrith]

 
+1  Speaking of going overboard, how did things go from disagreeing on a headphone (the HE-400i in this case), to jumping all the way to Stillhart pushing the Elear on people?

 
Seems people are enjoying bashing certain brands and/or people (reviewers, members of the trade, regular head-fiers) for no reason as soon as something goes south of what they'd want it to be. What exactly does Stillhart stand to gain if people buy the Elear or Focal products in general? The almost same exact conversation is going on in other Focal threads too, be it because people disagree with Jason voicing his (admittedly biased) opinion on the headphones, people raging and calling Focal greedy because 2 (which translates to 2% according to the Focal rep) pairs of Elears were faulty/DoA when they are doing everything to do right by their customers.
 
What's with all the god damn hostility? Jesus christ. Since when is someone's OPINION of something as subjective as music an "embarrassment" to oneself? I dislike the 400i too, and I own them because my wife likes them, I don't find most headphones "muddy" personally so that's not the word I'd use to describe the 400i but I just don't personally like them for reasons unknown (to you). Is that somehow a bad thing?
 
Apparently it's too hard to take people's opinions as you would, everything has to be exacted to the point where it's basically impossible to disagree else someone finds a way or makes one up when there is none to discredit others. Insane.

 

[x RELIC x]

I absolutely, 100% agree.  Often I feel as though Head-Fi is filled with people armed with pitchforks and not knowledge or experience.  They are mad because they can't afford or don't understand something.    

Frankly, it makes it hard place to be sometimes.  Fortunately, there are still some excellent folks around. 

x2.

I really don't understand the hair trigger people have in this thread. There are only a handful of people who have actually heard the headphones and it seems like every time they answer a question, or share their opinion, there are a couple posts of attacks. Not to mention what I feel is simply rude behaviour toward Jason, simply because he is a re-seller. If you don't like someones opinions then respond with courtesy, scroll past it, block that member, or flag it if it's breaking the rules. Otherwise can we please move on from the pages of posts from people questioning other peoples opinion.

Seems every time I look at this thread I just want to do this......

 

[uelover]

I really don't understand the hair trigger people have in this thread. There are only a handful of people who have actually heard the headphones and it seems like every time they answer a question, or share their opinion, there are a couple posts of attacks. Not to mention what I feel is simply rude behaviour toward Jason, simply because he is a re-seller. If you don't like someones opinions then respond with courtesy, scroll past it, block that member, or flag it if it's breaking the rules. Otherwise can we please move on from the pages of posts from people questioning other peoples opinion.
 

 
What we need is a diversity of impressions, not the aggressive reiteration and reinforcement of impressions by a select few.

 

[x RELIC x]

What we need is a diversity of impressions, not the aggressive reiteration and reinforcement of impressions by a select few.

Good grief, that will come in time. Aggressive is really only how the reader interprets the posts. I certainly don't read any aggressive reiteration, just a few people (the ones that have heard it) who like the headphone and are answering questions. Stillhart has been calling the he400i muddy long before the Focal headphones came out. A little perspective....