[james6333]

I think people undervalue dynamics or maybe have never been infront of a true full range dynamic set of Speakers.

When I go from my speaker rig to my headphone rig which I do pretty much everyday (same room/system) the two things that standout are loss of dynamics and loss of soundstage.

Now I could care less about soundstage because let's be honest. All headphones suck at it. I heard so much about how good the soundstage was on the HD800S but i was far from impressed with the soundstage when I demoed them

If the the soundstage on my speakers were a 10 and my Grados were a 0 I would give the HD800S a 2....

So that leaves dynamics as the next big thing on my value list that separates good headphones. I am looking forward to hearing the Elear. I went ahead a pre-ordered a pair.

 

[TSAVJason]

Both dealers stated they will have them by the middle of August.

Jim Lacky owner at Natural Sound is my friend for many years. I've known Jack Wu owner/partner since we became a Woo Audio dealer a year ago. The last thing in the world I would do is harm any of my business partners or friends. Believe what you like but I've given you the schedule and by all means buy from whomever you like as long as they are an authorized Focal Dealer I'm good with it. I give you the schedule so that you understand what to expect. What Focal doesn't want and what we don't want is for you to have an expectation on delivery that isn't met or realistic. We've already seen 3 unfortunate delays. I think drew from moon audio said it and I'll repeat it, sometimes launch schedules aren't always perfect. I was promised hundreds of these headphones by the 16th of last month. Well that didn't exactly happen. The other dealers were promised demo units by the 10th of August if they have a showroom and sellable product by the 17th of August. Factory full production is expected by the first of October. The Source AV is the launch partner, we are also the only Focal Flagship Store. As the launch partner we receive a 3-4 week period where we are the only place you can get them. So you do the math. FYI, we elected to shorten being the exclusive purchase point today to 2-3 weeks depending on how many and how fast they arrive.

 

[TSAVJason]

I think people undervalue dynamics or maybe have never been infront of a true full range dynamic set of Speakers.

When I go from my speaker rig to my headphone rig which I do pretty much everyday (same room/system) the two things that standout are loss of dynamics and loss of soundstage.

Now I could care less about soundstage because let's be honest. All headphones suck at it. I heard so much about how good the soundstage was on the HD800S but i was far from impressed with the soundstage when I demoed them

If the the soundstage on my speakers were a 10 and my Grados were a 0 I would give the HD800S a 2....

So that leaves dynamics as the next big thing on my value list that separates good headphones. I am looking forward to hearing the Elear. I went ahead a pre-ordered a pair.

Awesome! Hope you love them

 

[up late]

Well, the HD 800 S is going to be gone from the Wall of Fame. Tyll says he prefers the Elear over it and the Elear is cheaper. You do the math.




He must really like that dynamic and punchy sound if he ingores the huge 10khz peak.


 


Too bad he didn't include the Hifiman Edition - X in the comparisons. 

 


Mmm...my guess stands (posted awhile back). The Elear will take the place of the HD 650 and claim the crown of the world's best mid-fi HP in the world (unbeatable price to performannce ratio). Ether Flow over the Ether (Ether Flow C over the Ether C). That leaves the Utopia to challenge the Sennheiser 800 S. What worries me is the huge price difference between the 2. So, it might be the 800 S will retain its WOF crown for a little while longer. We shall see.

Now, I'm actually more excited to pair the Elear with the WA8 than the Utopia (which apparently sound its best only when paired with the TOTL amp/dac). No such issue (none that I've read) with the Elear.

so a $1000 can is categorised as "mid-fi" these days

 

[raypin]

mmm....imo, yes it is,  just as others consider usd 300.00 as  midfi or 100 or 50. What does it matter? It is an arbitrary figure anyway that everyone is free to make. From Focal's POV, the Elear is mid-fi with the Utopia and the Listen as summit-fi  and budget-fi respectively.
 
And, performance and SQ wise, it is the same ranking and not just Focal's products. Senn 800 series as its summit-fi trumps the 700/650/600, 650/600 trumps the Momentums etc. Mr. Speakers Ether and Ether Flow as its summit-fi trumps the Alpha which is mid-fi. Same with Audeze, Grado etc.
 
I'm not saying anything new here. It is just common knowledge.

 

[up late]

yes, it's an arbitrary figure but i very much doubt that it's common knowledge to consider a pair of cans costing $1000 as "mid-fi". that's why i queried it.

 

[lovethatsound]

Why did Focal make the stock cables so long? 13 ft seems a bit much especially if a shorter can't is not include too.. I guess they really want us to dance around the room.

13 ft is just about right for me.Its about time headphone manufacturers started giving us decent lengths of cable,anywhere from 10 ft.

 

[koven]

i thought mid-fi is a reference to price point, not where it stands in the company's product lineup. ~$500 is more mid-fi range in my mind. elear is high end.

 

[up late]

x2

 

[raypin]

mmm.....again, everyone is free to set their own personal standard (based on SQ, performance, materials used, design, price, value, driver technology (example: planars costs more than dynamics and e-stats costs much more than both since you need a dedicated amp for it to even work.............or any combination thereof). If you consider the Elear as summit-fi, where would you consider the Utopia at? Ultra-summit-fi?................................there is no right or wrong answer here. To each his own......

 

[up late]

well, i actually consider the elear's price point places it in the "high-end" category and the utopia's qualifies it as "uber/ultra high-end" or "summit-fi". to call a $1000 can "mid-fi", is a few hundred dollars over what is generally understood by this community to be the price bracket for that category of headphone ime.

 

[ubs28]

I think people undervalue dynamics or maybe have never been infront of a true full range dynamic set of Speakers.

When I go from my speaker rig to my headphone rig which I do pretty much everyday (same room/system) the two things that standout are loss of dynamics and loss of soundstage.

Now I could care less about soundstage because let's be honest. All headphones suck at it. I heard so much about how good the soundstage was on the HD800S but i was far from impressed with the soundstage when I demoed them

If the the soundstage on my speakers were a 10 and my Grados were a 0 I would give the HD800S a 2....

So that leaves dynamics as the next big thing on my value list that separates good headphones. I am looking forward to hearing the Elear. I went ahead a pre-ordered a pair.

I disagree. Speakers generally don't seem to be that good with imaging as if all the sounds are coming from the front. A sound coming 90 degree from the right will still come from right front while the HD 800 S will place it there at 90 degrees right.

However what I find $100k speaker system good at is presenting a live performance in front of the room, as if the band is playing right in front of you.

 

[conquerator2]

For me, the "fi" grading is mostly determined by cost first. Many times, cost seems to come out as the more important deciding factor, in this case making both the Elear and Utopia summit headphones. Performance wise, I'd also like to think that 1000$ gets you to summit-fi territory but because there is a pricier headphone form them, the Utopia, which seems to technically outperform them, the Elear slides to mid-fi for some.
I usually categorize mid-fi as <500$ and entry-fi [lol] as <100$. But IMO this grading should not be interchangeable with price/performance as it really would appear that the 'fi' grading is more presented as pricing first, everything else second.
We should create the Hyper-fi category for 2000$+ offerings. 

 
Then everyone would be happy with their summit-fi Elear and hyper-fi Utopia 

 

 

[up late]

tyll's certainly given the elear a big thumbs up

 

[pkcpga]

I disagree. Speakers generally don't seem to be that good with imaging as if all the sounds are coming from the front. A sound coming 90 degree from the right will still come from right front while the HD 800 S will place it there at 90 degrees right.

However what I find $100k speaker system good at is presenting a live performance in front of the room, as if the band is playing right in front of you.

If you buy the right speakers and properly power and set them up, I find sound staging on speakers to be much better also. My nautilus speakers with naim preamp, amp and Dave give a great presentation. As well as even my much cheaper Kef ls50's. Not sure it's quit as drastic but I'd say more like hd800 at 4, ls50 at 7 and nautilus at 10. But its true your talking about spending 50k instead of 5k, except for the ls50's they'd fall on a more even price point.