[up late]

Wrong! For example, soungstage on Stax is amazing Vs Utopia. If that is personal taste, then I think the person is in the wrong hobby

i think that's what he meant, and there is no right or wrong when we're posting about our subjective impressions

 

[ubs28]

So is your SR-009 with your magical unicorn colourbox + distortion box (that is actually what an amplifier is for headphones) closer to the Focal Utopia speakers than the Focal Utopia headphones?

And I use speakers as a reference because they are the standard in audio reproduction. The Focal Utopia speakers are one of the better speakers according to my ears, so it is one of the references of mine.

 

[Whitigir]

i think that's what he meant, and there is no right or wrong when we're posting about our subjective impressions

Soundstage is subjective ? Ok

So is your SR-009 with your magical unicorn colourbox + distortion box (that is actually what an amplifier is for headphones) closer to the Focal Utopia speakers than the Focal Utopia headphones?

And I use speakers as a reference because they are the standard in audio reproduction. The Focal Utopia speakers are one of the better speakers according to my ears, so it is one of the references of mine.

I have not heard the Utopia grande Speakers. I have no say in it matter. But I have never heard any one from 009+BHSE/Carbon level to say 009 is a Downgrade from Utopia Headphones....! Just such a bold claim, makes me wonder what system did you hear from 009 to say so, and I got my answer. Let’s move on

 

[up late]

E-stat is not easy to get to the performances, and to keep on saying that E-stats like Stax, lacking of Dynamic, or Bass is a total fault. When properly driven, the Stax 007 and 009 both pump out hell lot of bass and dynamic. There are plenty of Amplifiers said to be able to drive, or correctly driving the E-stats, but marketing aside, Stax can be driven “ways better”. Stax already prove it back in the day when they released Omega I , Stax T2. Yes, they don’t make it anymore, and many people guess is that it does not fit into the criteria’s of financial interests to cost-performances. Stax was awesome enough to allow people to copy, and improve the “legendary design”.

In the end, it is not justified to keep on spreading the myth about E-stats and Bass/dynamic capability when a person don’t have a proper setup.

Again, the best headphones systems, or being named so, called so, priced so....whatever....Orpheus I, Omega I &T2, Orpheus II, they are all E-stats. Possibly the new kid (sangrila) ?

The Utopia have done what no others Dynamic or Orthodynamic had done....the efficiency to scale with big gears, or to be driven nicely to performances by Portable devices/players.

For that alone, Utopia is the best Dynamic Headphones so far. IMO

the problem is that these amps that you're referring to which supposedly take the staxen's performance to another level are not readily available to try with them. whenever i've auditioned stax they have been paired with the manufacturer's own energisers. there were no other alternatives available. given those circumstances, it's unreasonable to suggest that folks are perpetuating myths about their performance.

 

[up late]

Soundstage is subjective ? Ok

you do know that it's an illusion right?

 

[Whitigir]

the problem is that these amps that you're referring to which supposedly take the staxen's performance to another level are not readily available to try with them. whenever i've auditioned stax they have been paired with the manufacturer's own energisers. there were no other alternatives available. given those circumstances, it's unreasonable to suggest that folks are perpetuating myths about their performance.

This, I agree. It is a sad thing for Stax to give up on the production of good amplifier/energizers to do their own headphones some justices, such as the T2, the only legendary energizers and never again. People put a lot of hope into the T8000, but....got turned down.

you do know that it's an illusion right?

Pretty much so, because it comes from 2 drivers that cover the ears. However, the coridination, the illusions come from the processing of the brain which materializes by experiencing real things in real life. Therefore, soundstage even illusions by Headphones is just as subjective as any thing that makes sound in a 3 dimensional world or real life.

 

[ubs28]

Soundstage is subjective ? Ok



I have not heard the Utopia grande Speakers. I have no say in it matter. But I have never heard any one from 009+BHSE/Carbon level to say 009 is a Downgrade from Utopia Headphones....! Just such a bold claim, makes me wonder what system did you hear from 009 to say so, and I got my answer. Let’s move on

If the SR-009 + BHSE/Carbon is less close to the Focal speakers, I still consider it as a downgrade.

From what setups did you listen to the Focal Utopia headphones by the way since you seem to stress the importance of your amplifiers out of curiousity?

 

[up late]

yes @Whitigir, it is a subjective experience and it can be perceived differently depending on who is wearing the headphone and how it is positioned on the wearer's head. the same applies to the positioning of loudspeakers in a room and the listener's position in relation to them. the variations in our perception of the soundstage from loudspeakers is more dramatic than it is with headphones, which is to be expected.

 

[Whitigir]

If the SR-009 + BHSE/Carbon is less close to the Focal speakers, I still consider it as a downgrade.

From what setups did you listen to the Focal Utopia headphones by the way since you seem to stress the importance of your amplifiers out of curiousity?

down grade to real speakers ? Ok, agree

TA-ZH1ES for Utopia. I have no Problem to do Dynalo or Dynahi for it. There is just no need as it could not get to the level of 009+T2, and this was confirmed by a dear friend of mine @purk who is driving Utopia out of all top end amplifiers he could for Utopia Headphones including the newest ECP prototypes. Lately, I am interested in making CFA amplifier for it, but that defeats the purpose of portability and how Easy utopia can be driven from Wm1z

 

[Whitigir]

yes that's right @Whitigir, it is a subjective experience and it can be perceived differently depending on how the headphone is positioned on the wearer's head and who is wearing it. the same applies to the positioning of loudspeakers in a room and the listener's position in relation to them.

Different for each person, sure. However, the senses of projected positioning which is processed by the brain will stays true to the reality. Person A wears headphone X and could hear a drum from 2’ Away on the Left. Then person A wear headphone Y and could hear a drum from 10’ away from the Left. It is very obvious evidence, and so such thing is not subjective. But this is and shall be in science forum. Let’s move on

 

[purk]

My name was mentioned couple of times here so I figure I will confirm that I like the SR009 better than the Utopia. As great as the Utopia is, I still think that the SR009 can reach the higher height. Of course, you do need to have a really good amp behind it. @Whitigir's amazing DIY T2 is the perfect amp for any Stats headphones and it is very much superior to even the KGSSHV Carbon and BHSE in all counts. Don't get me wrong, I love the Utopia as well but Stax can have much better depth and width and that's the Utopia's biggest cons. Of course, the Utopia can sound superb with much less amplification and Stax setup is stationary while the Utopia is much more mobile.

 

[ubs28]

down grade to real speakers ? Ok, agree

TA-ZH1ES for Utopia. I have no Problem to do Dynalo or Dynahi for it. There is just no need as it could not get to the level of 009+T2, and this was confirmed by a dear friend of mine @purk who is driving Utopia out of all top end amplifiers he could for Utopia Headphones including the newest ECP prototypes.

Interesting. I tested that thing out with the Sony Walkman ($3500) and it is not really the highest in fidelity.

But I only listened to it with the Z1R and the IEM’s I had with me.

 

[up late]

Different for each person, sure. However, the senses of projected positioning which is processed by the brain will stays true to the reality. Person A wears headphone X and could hear a drum from 2’ Away on the Left. Then person A wear headphone Y and could hear a drum from 10’ away from the Left. It is very obvious evidence, and so such thing is not subjective. But this is and shall be in science forum. Let’s move on

what you're overlooking is that person B may perceive the "soundstage" from headphones X and Y differently from person A. it is a subjective experience and the illusion of soundstage is not measurable btw. but yeah, take your proposition to the sound science forum and see how you go.

 

[purk]

I think the size of soundstage including depth can be easily perceived. For instance, the Qualia and R10 size of soundstage and image placement are just second to none including the HD800, Orpheus, SR009, SR007, as well as the Utopia. The imaging on the Utopia is great but IMO size and depth could be better.

 

[up late]

yes, we can easily perceive "soundstage" and we can also easily perceive it differently. just as we can easily perceive other aspects of a headphone's performance differently.