[JUGA]

why is wrong colors when we watch YOUTUBE?))  blue coloured fases) and etc..
when we watch movies - everything is OK. FW-1.5

 

[Joe Bloggs]

Honestly, I don't think FiiO would care that its MUSIC PLAYER gives you blue faces when watching YOUTUBE at the moment...

 

[Peridot]

 
It is a KitKat issue alright, some developers have found workarounds probably tweaking the permissions to access external SD (Spotify, Deezer apparently have worked around it but it's there for all apps and was a big issue. Why Tidal is not implementing it is beyond me, I had the same issue with ZX2).
 
Right now it seems like aside from rooting the X7 or waiting till Tidal does something about it, I would be stuck with much too small 32GB offline storage... At this point although I love the X7 I am thinking about returning it and wait till the issues and Lollipop ships with the X7.

 
I've been happily using SD card storage for Tidal on my S3 phone with KitKat but it is rooted so maybe that's why it's working.
 
Could FiiO not supply the X7s rooted to overcome this issue, or does that infringe Android licensing? 

 

[davidmolliere]

I've been happily using SD card storage for Tidal on my S3 phone with KitKat but it is rooted so maybe that's why it's working. Could FiiO not supply the X7s rooted to overcome this issue, or does that infringe Android licensing? 

 
Yes that's definitely why it's working.
I don't think it would infringe android but would allow un-savvy users to wreck their android software

 

[Sonic Defender]

All of this shows just how extremely difficult it can be to really nail a design as complex as the X7 requires. It is a shame that testing didn't catch the noise issue. I am glad I waited as it seems like the X7 units that ship in 2016 will be greatly improved. I am going back and forth between the DP-X1, an LG V10 or the X7. I think FiiO can get the X7 to where it needs to be, and this will be a great learning experience for them. It is unlikely that they could have avoided these issues given that they were moving into engineering realms that as an organization they had never ventured in before. By the time the X7 is truly finished I'll bet it will be a magnificent DAP. Keep up the great work FiiO, it will be worth it.

 

[rzvnz]

mmm, I think you may have nailed the problem .Maybe, class D amp could be more immune to this by design.

I have just tried again with my sensitive intra on the line out jack, when i pause the tracks and put in on (I don't want to damage my ear !!) I hear nothing at all. When I do the same in the headphone amp jack, I hear the noises when the song is bufferizing.

So it could be the amp, of the circuitry just before the amp that is prone to EM noise from the wifi. If so, it could be easy (though costly to send modded amp modules to replace them, or to offer a discount on the next amp module.

But I think it's only part of the problem, because wifi output can increase when the signal is weak and wifi management is also something to be taken care of in the next firmware. But cancelling wifi power management have to have an impact on the spec, especially the battery life. So if the specs change, it could lead to legal action if no statement is done and/or nothing is done.

A possible hypothesis would be that not everything can be solved by changing the amp module, and that  maintenance is needed on each X7 main body. This maintenance could be to insert a better battery to tackle the higher power consumption caused by the cancelling of wifi management, change setup of the wifi module, and change the amp module if this can help.

While I am sure now that the amped jack output is touched by the wifi noise problem, and not the line out (on my unit though), we can't say for sure that the amp is faulty, or is simply exposed to an an unusual level of EM due to a poor internal layout of wifi module. The "tape mod" seem to validate the second hypothesis, but it will be very difficult for FiiO to organize a massive product return operation. Sending and upgraded and better shielded headphone amp module (with a second MicroSD slot BTW !) would be much more feasible, along with a FW mod that implement new wifi management scenario.

To draw a conclusion, the wifi noise seems to be the result of a concept flaw, in fact incorporating a class A amp module in a wifi DAP, bacause that amp is the most exposed part to wifi interference. Shielding the antena is not really an option because the level of the wifi signal decreases to much. The real "cure" would be a better protected A class amp. module or using a different design amp. module. Or, as a last resort, using an external amp., completely encapsulated. We know that option already works.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

It is a KitKat issue alright, some developers have found workarounds probably tweaking the permissions to access external SD (Spotify, Deezer apparently have worked around it but it's there for all apps and was a big issue. Why Tidal is not implementing it is beyond me, I had the same issue with ZX2).

Right now it seems like aside from rooting the X7 or waiting till Tidal does something about it, I would be stuck with much too small 32GB offline storage... At this point although I love the X7 I am thinking about returning it and wait till the issues and Lollipop ships with the X7.

I've been happily using SD card storage for Tidal on my S3 phone with KitKat but it is rooted so maybe that's why it's working.

Could FiiO not supply the X7s rooted to overcome this issue, or does that infringe Android licensing? 

I've been happily using SD card storage for Tidal on my S3 phone with KitKat but it is rooted so maybe that's why it's working. Could FiiO not supply the X7s rooted to overcome this issue, or does that infringe Android licensing? 

Yes that's definitely why it's working.
I don't think it would infringe android but would allow un-savvy users to wreck their android software

My X7 is rooted and I don't see options for storing things in SD card magically appearing in my music apps. OTOH, my smartphone on kitkat allows it, probably because its internal memory appears only as one drive, unlike the X7 where it appears as two.

 

[davidmolliere]

My X7 is rooted and I don't see options for storing things in SD card magically appearing in my music apps. OTOH, my smartphone on kitkat allows it, probably because its internal memory appears only as one drive, unlike the X7 where it appears as two.

 
Root doesn't fix it, but having root allows you to fix this easy : http://technofaq.org/posts/2014/04/fixing-external-sd-card-write-issue-on-android-kitkat/

 

[McCol]

My X7 is rooted and I don't see options for storing things in SD card magically appearing in my music apps. OTOH, my smartphone on kitkat allows it, probably because its internal memory appears only as one drive, unlike the X7 where it appears as two.

 
Hit the nail on the head there Joe.
 
When you clear the cache on Spotify it will store in the next available memory, on a phone the memory is split into 2 so if you have a SD card installed so the downloads will store onto the SD card.  The X7 has 3 memory slots when a SD card is installed, but the spotify downloads move to the internal memory.  I'm sure if Fiio could merge the Nand and internal memory this would solve the problem.

 

[kdub]

My X7 is rooted and I don't see options for storing things in SD card magically appearing in my music apps. OTOH, my smartphone on kitkat allows it, probably because its internal memory appears only as one drive, unlike the X7 where it appears as two.

Don't have my S3 anymore but going by memory I think it also allowed me to save offline files on SD card using Tidal. The theory that it doesn't work on the X7 I would also think is more related to the multiple drives and confusing Tidal software.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

My X7 is rooted and I don't see options for storing things in SD card magically appearing in my music apps. OTOH, my smartphone on kitkat allows it, probably because its internal memory appears only as one drive, unlike the X7 where it appears as two.

Root doesn't fix it, but having root allows you to fix this easy : http://technofaq.org/posts/2014/04/fixing-external-sd-card-write-issue-on-android-kitkat/

If that's all it takes to fix the issue I'm sure it can be incorporated in an update to the stock firmware...

edit: I looked through my phone's permissions and that hack was not enabled. So I don't think it's the key to the issue here.

What have you guys' experience with rooting the X7, if any? I share mine here:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/713735/fiio-x7-dxd-dsd-384k-64b-ess9018-android-amp-module-design-call-for-3rd-party-amp-module-developers/7530#post_12195296
(rooting the X7 voids your warranty, but if you brick your X7 it probably just means me handholding you through hard flashing the stock firmware :tongue_smile: only problem I've come across so far is that bluetooth volume adjustment on my unit is broken at the moment.)

 

[OneL0ve]

Dear Fiio, please make
 
1. A X7 silicone case (like X5). (Plastic scratches.)
2. A X7 and E12 stacking kit. 
3. Maybe absolute low height usb-only module to replace the AMP module (when using an external AMP like E12).
Can the X7 even work without the current AMP module attached?

4. A dual SD SLOT or card reader module!!?? 

 
Also, why no dual SD slot?

(please don't release a dual SD slot X7 later or I will find you.)

 

 

[kdub]

   
sorry this is not what we try to say. we just tell the fact that different headphone has different hiss cause the sensitivity. also the wifi interference is not what we can solve right now depended on our techinical. we know some class-D amp can solve this problem but the SQ can't meet our requirement. 
 

 
 
Quote:

   
True, but it's possible, the ZX2 is a good example but it's a very different architecture with class D amp...

 
 
What's the difference between class-D amp and class A?  From an earlier post by James (see above pasted), it sounds like class-D amp is sub par SQ for their requirements. We want to fix this wifi interference noise issue but not at the expense of degraded SQ 

 

[ChristopherOwen]

Hit the nail on the head there Joe.

When you clear the cache on Spotify it will store in the next available memory, on a phone the memory is split into 2 so if you have a SD card installed so the downloads will store onto the SD card.  The X7 has 3 memory slots when a SD card is installed, but the spotify downloads move to the internal memory.  I'm sure if Fiio could merge the Nand and internal memory this would solve the problem.

Spotify automatically picks the largest storage space available. So on my X7 it's using the external SD card.

However Tidal can't access the external storage on the X7 for some reason. So Spotify and Tidal have implemented accessing storage on Android 4 differently.

I imagine FiiO can only resolve this by implementing Android 5.x or above.

 

[kdub]

  Dear Fiio, please make
 
1. A X7 silicone case (like X5). (Plastic scratches.)
2. A X7 and E12 stacking kit. 
3. Maybe absolute low height usb-only module to replace the AMP module (when using an external AMP like E12).
Can the X7 even work without the current AMP module attached?

4. A dual SD SLOT or card reader module!!?? 

 
Also, why no dual SD slot?

(please don't release a dual SD slot X7 later or I will find you.)

 

 
2. ) Isn't this the whole point of the X7 to have removable amp modules. So don't see a need for a stacking kit if you can install a higher power amp module.  
 
4) +1 Good idea! (the reasoning for no dual SD slot is to have enough room for the wifi and bt feature.  Personally i would have preferred dual slot built in and have removable wifi bt modules as needed.  This would maybe solve the current wifi interference noise issue too?