FiiO X7 | DXD | DSD | 384K/64B | ESS9018+ Android | WiFi | Bluetooth | 4 AMP modules | Balanced Out |

[headwhacker]

  if you want to make one big happy me, plz find a way to reduce cellphone noises(EMI/RFI). if the casing can't do it, maybe some metal plates with little holes in them to protect the most sensitive chipsets, like it's done in cellphones?
anything to reduce the noise from cellphone's signal would be a HUGE upgrade in my book.

 
Same here, there are already plenty of unnecessary features a DAP has as portable music player. This problem which actually aftects playback often is overlooked. It's the elephant in the room and it's being ignored.

 

[spatzi]

I actually like messing with files.  Just as I liked handling vinyl.  I have no plans to stream as long as I can get my hands on quality files.  Also, I listen while I am out and about.  For me, when I buy a "portable" music player, it means I carry it with me.  I have a home theater system with a very powerful amp and a quality source (Oppo 103) to play music from should I wish to play music at home.  

Either way, I don't want files that are "good enough for me."  (No disrespect meant.)  I want the best files in the best player for the best sound.  If I want "ok" sound I'll go ride an elevator.  

That's what I want from the X7.  If you folks can deliver that, I'll certainly purchase it as an upgrade to my X5.  If it is basically just an X5 with bells and whistles, I'll pass.  

But these are quality files. 320 ogg is quality and some services are now streaming flac. I want a small player that can access it. Why bother with hard disc, unless you don't have a player that can stream or have access to 3G. Guys who like messing with files are dinosaurs. I am one, or was one. We are on the way out. I also have a large vinyl collection. It is only a reminder of ancient history, something I can't get rid of due to sentimentality. Very, very small amount of people still using files and getting less every year. And the ones who still do load files, will quickly switch to streaming when it is demonstrated to them how easy it is, how cheap, how it is almost impossible to tell the difference between streaming 320 ogg or hearing that same flac on your sd card. Plus, your selection is now virtually unlimited. I remember how $10 a month in 1978 bought me one or maybe two records. Why should I buy music anymore when I can stream anything for $10 a month? I am set for life. If streaming was only 128, then I wouldn't even be posting as I would be using my x5 all the time.

If I had spotify last year before buying the x5, I doubt I would have bought the x5. My smartest purchase to to upgrade my sound was the beyer t 90's. However, the x5 was a minor improvement, and seems like ancient history, a bit ahead of the IPOD which is now obsolete, but behind the future curve (streaming).

My current collection of 800 gigs is like a fossilized bone. Not only am I stuck with what I "own", it gives me no way to hear new music or discover anything else. I am locked in with my past. Just in one week spotify has opened up my collection in numerous ways, leading me to many paths I would never have found had I only been listening to my very familiar hard disc collection. And I am totally fine hearing most of my "owned" collection on stream as the difference between that and the x5 version is almost non existent. I have very good ears, trained for 40 years a musician, and if I can't hear it, you can bet most people won't hear it.

So, if X7 includes ability to stream spotify and other future flac streaming services, I am in. My ipad is too big to carry around outside.

Music listening for me is mostly at home where I have space, quiet, and time to absorb it properly. Either through a good speaker system but more and more through very good headphones so I don't bother neighbors.

I do consider myself an audiophile and if I can't tell the difference between stream and hard disc, I will go with what is easier to access, and program. It's a no brainer to stream. Once I am on a 3 g network, I can take my player with me anywhere and stream. I just bought the x5 three months ago and it seems I already have a close to outdated piece of equipment. Not 'sound quality' wise but in comparison to what streaming has offered as a replacement. Not a complete replacement, but very close. It feels like when I bought a mini disc player with iPod just around the corner. I should have waited for x7 or a player that can stream.

Sure it's a great player, and I still need it for non streaming recordings and the music I write myself, but for convenience and easy access, I am streaming off an ipad because the sound quality is practically identical except for a few exceptions. I am shocked, believe me. It's almost too good to be true. A bit overwhelming. Feels like I just hit the future. Part of me is sad at seeing all the time spent amassing a huge hard drive of music since 2000 as a big waste of time, much like my previous cassette collection was, and my mini disc collection after that. I am tired of redoing collection formats and I hope streaming will be the last music format change I have to deal with in my lifetime, which is maybe another 25 years.

If fiio is to survive they need to be aware of what is coming, and what is taking over, unless they are only concerned in having a fringe audience of dinosaurs who still think their cd collection is cool. usb sticks and SD cards for storing music are on the way out. I say good riddance.

 

[originalsnuffy]

Feature creep is an issue. That is for sure. Watching other people makes me think that more users want features associated with bit reduced files than lossless or hi res. which makes me wonder why they are not looking at mass market devices like iPod touch etc

 

[olddude]

Feature creep is an issue. That is for sure. Watching other people makes me think that more users want features associated with bit reduced files than lossless or hi res. which makes me wonder why they are not looking at mass market devices like iPod touch etc

Exactly- Fiio is figuring out who its users are.  Are they audiophiles who want the best quality possible as they travel or are they people who are ok with giant libraries of lossy who also want to stream music while in their houses.  Is there a happy medium, or must it make hard choices in one direction or the other?
 
I think the bigger picture is what Fiio is going to need to do to satisfy people in China.  I assume the needs and options are quite different there.  What we in the "West" want may not be possible or feasible in China.  
 
From my point of view, I want the X7 to be as good as an A&K240 sound-wise (which the X5 is close to being).  With a decent UI.  Other than that, whatever.  I don't want a smartphone (I have one already, and I don't use it to play music), and I don't want a device for my house.  I want a portable unit that I can easily carry around and use on-the-go.  This dinosaur doesn't want to stream 320 anything, or FLAC.  Portable means out-and-about.  Me and my iems, walking around enjoying my music.  
 
Since Fiio has basically been about high-quality portable equipment, I personally hope it continues in that direction.  If not, those of us that want that type of equipment will gravitate to other brands that offer it.  Think Alien, for example.  It does one thing, with two types of music files (FLAC and WAV) with not even a UI.  A bit basic from my point of view but something I would consider if Fiio decides to make devices that are glorified smartphones to please non-dinosaurs.  
 
Personally, if all I wanted was to listen to lots of MP3s and stream stuff and have a great UI, I'd be looking at big market companies like Apple and Sony for my equipment.  They make things that please everybody (to a point) and do everything.  Fiio is not going to catch up to them, due to money and time.   It is a niche company, and I guess we will have to wait and see what direction the niche chooses.  

 

[Retrias]

But these are quality files. 320 ogg is quality and some services are now streaming flac. I want a small player that can access it. Why bother with hard disc, unless you don't have a player that can stream or have access to 3G. Guys who like messing with files are dinosaurs. I am one, or was one. We are on the way out. I also have a large vinyl collection. It is only a reminder of ancient history, something I can't get rid of due to sentimentality. Very, very small amount of people still using files and getting less every year. And the ones who still do load files, will quickly switch to streaming when it is demonstrated to them how easy it is, how cheap, how it is almost impossible to tell the difference between streaming 320 ogg or hearing that same flac on your sd card. Plus, your selection is now virtually unlimited. I remember how $10 a month in 1978 bought me one or maybe two records. Why should I buy music anymore when I can stream anything for $10 a month? I am set for life. If streaming was only 128, then I wouldn't even be posting as I would be using my x5 all the time.

If I had spotify last year before buying the x5, I doubt I would have bought the x5. My smartest purchase to to upgrade my sound was the beyer t 90's. However, the x5 was a minor improvement, and seems like ancient history, a bit ahead of the IPOD which is now obsolete, but behind the future curve (streaming).

My current collection of 800 gigs is like a fossilized bone. Not only am I stuck with what I "own", it gives me no way to hear new music or discover anything else. I am locked in with my past. Just in one week spotify has opened up my collection in numerous ways, leading me to many paths I would never have found had I only been listening to my very familiar hard disc collection. And I am totally fine hearing most of my "owned" collection on stream as the difference between that and the x5 version is almost non existent. I have very good ears, trained for 40 years a musician, and if I can't hear it, you can bet most people won't hear it.

So, if X7 includes ability to stream spotify and other future flac streaming services, I am in. My ipad is too big to carry around outside.

Music listening for me is mostly at home where I have space, quiet, and time to absorb it properly. Either through a good speaker system but more and more through very good headphones so I don't bother neighbors.

I do consider myself an audiophile and if I can't tell the difference between stream and hard disc, I will go with what is easier to access, and program. It's a no brainer to stream. Once I am on a 3 g network, I can take my player with me anywhere and stream. I just bought the x5 three months ago and it seems I already have a close to outdated piece of equipment. Not 'sound quality' wise but in comparison to what streaming has offered as a replacement. Not a complete replacement, but very close. It feels like when I bought a mini disc player with iPod just around the corner. I should have waited for x7 or a player that can stream.

Sure it's a great player, and I still need it for non streaming recordings and the music I write myself, but for convenience and easy access, I am streaming off an ipad because the sound quality is practically identical except for a few exceptions. I am shocked, believe me. It's almost too good to be true. A bit overwhelming. Feels like I just hit the future. Part of me is sad at seeing all the time spent amassing a huge hard drive of music since 2000 as a big waste of time, much like my previous cassette collection was, and my mini disc collection after that. I am tired of redoing collection formats and I hope streaming will be the last music format change I have to deal with in my lifetime, which is maybe another 25 years.

If fiio is to survive they need to be aware of what is coming, and what is taking over, unless they are only concerned in having a fringe audience of dinosaurs who still think their cd collection is cool. usb sticks and SD cards for storing music are on the way out. I say good riddance.

For one , not everyone have internet connection all the time that is capable of streaming from spotify , what if we are crossing an area with bad reception, what if we are on a plane with no wifi , what if I dont want to connect to the internet just to listen to my collection? What if my music is not the kind that most people actually provide on streaming service that is globally accesible?

there is the why on "dinosaurs" still want to keep their files

no thanks , I still want to keep my files and listen to them , you can keep your version of the so called future to yourself

 

[spatzi]

For one , not everyone have internet connection all the time that is capable of streaming from spotify , what if we are crossing an area with bad reception, what if we are on a plane with no wifi , what if I dont want to connect to the internet just to listen to my collection? What if my music is not the kind that most people actually provide on streaming service that is globally accesible?

there is the why on "dinosaurs" still want to keep their files

no thanks , I still want to keep my files and listen to them , you can keep your version of the so called future to yourself

Whether, we like or not, i can't keep this future to myself. It's here. Carrying files around on hard drives, sd cards, usb sticks, will soon be a thing of the past. wifi is available almost everywhere, and getting easier to access all the time. We won't be owning music anymore, only renting it, just like netflix. Not saying I still can't use a portable flash player, only that it wil be used less and less than other options that are far easier to deal with, like high quality streaming. Perfect example. I am home now. I am streaming all day. I am not listening to my x5. So much easier to stream than use the x5, which takes time to boot, is harder to browse, constantly has to be restarted once it goes into sleep mode, has a battery life considerable shorter than my iPad, and most of all, should I desire to listen to something spontaneous I don't currently have on the sd card, I have instant access with spotify; I don't have to turn on my computer, hook up the x5, transfer the files, etc. So tired of that process.

 

[quimbo]

Does spotify have recordings of live music.  I have over 6000 shows, one as early as 1937 and one as recent as 2 days ago, in all genres.  For example I have over 350 Miles Davis concerts dating back to 1946.  Unless spotify can provide this, consider me a dinosaur.  Different strokes for different folks.

 

[olddude]

Your view is predicated on a few things that you surmise but that are not rooted in fact.  Just because you say that we will be moving to a rental model doesn't mean we will.  Just as CDs didn't end the use by some people of vinyl, so streaming won't end hard files.  Dinosaurs are still here on earth, we call them birds.
 
What happens if spotify raises its rates?  Or if our using 3G to access them becomes more expensive?  Or we are somewhere that there IS no WiFi or BT or 3G?  Or, as above, what if what we listen to is not ON spotify?  Or spotify goes down?
 
As to time to boot an X5 or wake it from sleep, we are talking about less than ten seconds for the booting and maybe one second for the waking.  I have that much time.  I can browse my files quickly in folder view. My battery doesn't wear out quickly enough for me to worry about it going dead in a listening session.  And I can control what is happening, and when it will do so.  
 
Maybe I AM a dinosaur.  Doesn't feel like it.  Giving over control of how I listen to music to a company does not seem, to me, to be something I want to do.  I don't think the cloud is our friend.  I don't think streaming services are inherently better than owning and using files.  And I don't think that the future of music is only one model, the one you suggest.  
 
I guess we will see which direction Fiio goes in.  I think it will have more to do with what mainland Chinese want, as that will be its largest selling area.  If they want WiFi, and BT, and 3G, and streaming, then Fiio will likely give it to them in order to widen its market share.  

 

[spatzi]

Does spotify have recordings of live music.  I have over 6000 shows, one as early as 1937 and one as recent as 2 days ago, in all genres.  For example I have over 350 Miles Davis concerts dating back to 1946.  Unless spotify can provide this, consider me a dinosaur.  Different strokes for different folks.

You are one in a million, in a very minor subset of music genres. Fiio doesn't care about you. it's like me saying "what about my super rare soundtrack collection? I need a player for it!" We don't matter. So niche it doesn't even register. The majority of music consumers are going to be plenty happy with what they can get on spotify. I consume a lot, and I'm pretty happy with what I can get. It's more than I can consume if I listen 24/7 until I'm dead.

As I said, it doesn't fill all the holes. There are still strange omissions from catalogues and some bands not represented at all. It's also weak on soundtracks so who knows if that will get fixed. So right now, I have been transferring all the things I can't get on spotify to my x5, which isn't very much.

 

[doublea71]

Whether, we like or not, i can't keep this future to myself. It's here. Carrying files around on hard drives, sd cards, usb sticks, will soon be a thing of the past. wifi is available almost everywhere, and getting easier to access all the time. We won't be owning music anymore, only renting it, just like netflix. Not saying I still can't use a portable flash player, only that it wil be used less and less than other options that are far easier to deal with, like high quality streaming. Perfect example. I am home now. I am streaming all day. I am not listening to my x5. So much easier to stream than use the x5, which takes time to boot, is harder to browse, constantly has to be restarted once it goes into sleep mode, has a battery life considerable shorter than my iPad, and most of all, should I desire to listen to something spontaneous I don't currently have on the sd card, I have instant access with spotify; I don't have to turn on my computer, hook up the x5, transfer the files, etc. So tired of that process.

There are options for the home and then their are options for being truly on-the-go that will never involve streaming from the net. Your assumption is that everybody has access to the internet whenever and wherever they like and this is clearly false. There will be demand for storage as long as there are audiophiles who care about the lineage of the music they are listening to, so you may want to reconsider your position. I know for certain that I won't be giving up on any of my fantastic-sounding MFSL rips anytime soon, nor do I find it taxing to do the heavy lifting known as dragging and dropping a file onto a memory card - perhaps we can see it as a way to get our daily exercise since it is so difficult. Besides that, Spotify streaming out of an ipad without an external amp/dac, which would significantly reduce battery life, is hardly anyone's idea of an ideal listening experience. And is the battery life of an ipad that is streaming music much better than the X5? I wouldn't be surprised if it were worse. What is satisfactory for you is just that - for you, and nobody else.  Who in their right mind would spend $700 on a DAP just to stream music of questionable origin, anyways?

 

[headwhacker]

You are one in a million, in a very minor subset of music genres. Fiio doesn't care about you. it's like me saying "what about my super rare soundtrack collection? I need a player for it!" We don't matter. So niche it doesn't even register. The majority of music consumers are going to be plenty happy with what they can get on spotify. I consume a lot, and I'm pretty happy with what I can get. It's more than I can consume if I listen 24/7 until I'm dead.

As I said, it doesn't fill all the holes. There are still strange omissions from catalogues and some bands not represented at all. It's also weak on soundtracks so who knows if that will get fixed. So right now, I have been transferring all the things I can't get on spotify to my x5, which isn't very much.

 
Fiio is catering to a niche audience. Audiophiles will remain as is. The masses you are talking about have long settled for iPod/smartphones who can already do the future you are talking about. Why would you need a dedicated DAP just to do streaming music. There are already loads of option available out there.
 
Sometimes, makes me wonder, are you guys expecting Fiio to compete with smartphones/iPods? I'm afraid if Fiio puts all the features people are asking it will end up to be just another iPod. Can do lot of things but full of compromises.

 

[spatzi]

Your view is predicated on a few things that you surmise but that are not rooted in fact.  Just because you say that we will be moving to a rental model doesn't mean we will.  Just as CDs didn't end the use by some people of vinyl, so streaming won't end hard files.  Dinosaurs are still here on earth, we call them birds.

What happens if spotify raises its rates?  Or if our using 3G to access them becomes more expensive?  Or we are somewhere that there IS no WiFi or BT or 3G?  Or, as above, what if what we listen to is not ON spotify?  Or spotify goes down?

As to time to boot an X5 or wake it from sleep, we are talking about less than ten seconds for the booting and maybe one second for the waking.  I have that much time.  I can browse my files quickly in folder view. My battery doesn't wear out quickly enough for me to worry about it going dead in a listening session.  And I can control what is happening, and when it will do so.  

Maybe I AM a dinosaur.  Doesn't feel like it.  Giving over control of how I listen to music to a company does not seem, to me, to be something I want to do.  I don't think the cloud is our friend.  I don't think streaming services are inherently better than owning and using files.  And I don't think that the future of music is only one model, the one you suggest.  

I guess we will see which direction Fiio goes in.  I think it will have more to do with what mainland Chinese want, as that will be its largest selling area.  If they want WiFi, and BT, and 3G, and streaming, then Fiio will likely give it to them in order to widen its market share.  

People are moving to a rental model. It's a fact. Maybe you aren't, but you are the minority. You only have to look at the increase of revenue from streaming services and membership to see this is where it's going, and has been steamrolling since 2008. Sure, there are always hanger ons who refuse to change, because change is hard. My dad still uses a CD player. He's a dinosaur. He loves music. I can no longer help him get access to music he loves because he can't access spotify. If he had it, i could quickly send him a playlist and he would have instant access. He refused to embrace even the internet. He's beyond dinosaur, more like crustacean.

Vinyl is also very niche. Practically non existent. Who goes to a store and pays $20 for an album? 1 out of 1000? I am talking about where Fiio needs to go if they want to stay alive in the music business, and sticking ONLY to sd cards, usb drives, internal memory, and relying on a consumer base audience of ONE who has 6000 obscure live recordings is not going to help them drive sales.

Why talk about hypothetical spotify price increases? I can also say what happens if your sd card blows, a much more likely scenario. Where is your music then? What if you also lost your backup. Your music is GONE. You spent how much on your fiio player? If we have money to blow on high end products like this who cares about a dollar increase if it happens to occur in 2020? I don't care if spotify raises it's rates. Even if it doubles the price today, it's still a good deal. Everything goes up eventually. You can say the same about the x7. What is that? $700. Everyone is ready to jump on it. That's enough money to stream for almost seven years. Now many places have no internet? For most, lack of wifi or 3G is a non issue. Amd I am not saying the x7 has to do away with sd cards, only make that a slice, an option, not the entire cake.

You are not giving up control to a company, you are gaining control. Instant access to a lot of music. Is it because it's a corporation, and we can't trust a corporation? They don't pick your playlists. You don't get ads. I have easier control now with spotify than with my x5. Ipad music control through the spotify app is easier than using my x5. It also boots quicker and doesn't continuously revert to my root directory once it shuts off. I also streamed to my home stereo today and that is something my x5 cannot do.

Has youtube gone down? Facebook? Once spotify does go down it's because it's been supplanted by something even better. The music isn't going anywhere. What I am saying is fiio becomes even more of a niche product if it doesn't adapt to new technology. Trying to keep dinosaurs happy is not a good business model. We all have little bits and pieces we can't find online but the majority of music is online, and will only expand. If fiio refuses to include streaming, someone else will make a high end player with it and that's the one I buy next.

 

[sfwalcer]

^

 

[waynes world]

I for one just like having the option of streaming in my music player. Right now, I mainly listen ot my music files, but still I often stream to find new music that I might like. So I'm all for the X7 having streaming capabilities.

 

[olddude]

I'm not against it, I just don't use it or want it.  It it appears on the X7 it will just be another gadget I don't use.  But what I don't see is some sort sort of apocryphal moment when the meteor hits and all of us dinosaurs are wiped out.  You are welcome to your streaming, and I'm going to keep on using files and sd cards.  Somehow I don't see the X7 being a streaming--only device.  It will be a two-slot sd card device with, most likely, OTG access and maybe have the ability to stream.   That is the future I foretell for the X7.  Which is, of course, what we are supposedly discussing here.  
 
Anything else is soothsaying.