FiiO M21, Qualcomm Snapdragon 680, FiiO Android portable music player is available!

[fish1050]

Shanling m1 plus? Many reviews saying that it’s bright

Well, I’ll wait for the reviews and comparisons of m21 vs Shanling 3 plus.

My nephew has the M1 Plus and I don't find it to bright sounding with my headphones at least. I find it quite neutral with minor warmth in the mids, maybe a touch of brightness in the upper treble region but no sibilance at all and very smooth sounding. Keep in mind the Fiio DAP's have the classic style Bass and Treble dial adjustments. So you could use them to make macro adjustments to the treble to tone it down if need be. Not to mention the M21 will have Global PEQ as well.

I am strictly a headphone guy so the brightness might come through more with iem's. I am also very curious about how the M3 Plus sounds since it is alot more expensive than the M21 and I find it hard to justify it with the M21 having better specs across the board and additional features the M3 Plus does not offer.

An @Shanling post said this comparing the M3 Plus to the M1 Plus "A bit of sound upgrade, a big change to overall use approach".. Perhaps the M3 Plus is essentially an android version of the M1 Plus with a small improvement in sound quality. I demoed the M1 Plus with the JM21 and found they sounded quite similar to me with very minor differences. What I would like to know even more is how the M3 Plus compares to the M5 Ultra. Based on what @Shanling posted it looks to fit betweem the M1 Plus and the M5 Ultra leaning closer to the M1 Plus.

So reading between the lines a little if the M21 is a step up in sound from the JM21 and the M3 Plus is a minor step up from the M1 Plus in sound. I can't imagine there will be a significant difference in sound between the M21 and M3 Plus. Just my two cents.

 

[Rockcoon]

My nephew has the M1 Plus and I don't find it to bright sounding with my headphones at least. I find it quite neutral with minor warmth in the mids, maybe a touch of brightness in the upper treble region but no sibilance at all and very smooth sounding. Keep in mind the Fiio DAP's have the classic style Bass and Treble dial adjustments. So you could use them to make macro adjustments to the treble to tone it down if need be. Not to mention the M21 will have Global PEQ as well.

I am strictly a headphone guy so the brightness might come through more with iem's. I am also very curious about how the M3 Plus sounds since it is alot more expensive than the M21 and I find it hard to justify it with the M21 having better specs across the board and additional features the M3 Plus does not offer.

An @Shanling post said this comparing the M3 Plus to the M1 Plus "A bit of sound upgrade, a big change to overall use approach".. Perhaps the M3 Plus is essentially an android version of the M1 Plus with a small improvement in sound quality. I demoed the M1 Plus with the JM21 and found they sounded quite similar to me with very minor differences. What I would like to know even more is how the M3 Plus compares to the M5 Ultra. Based on what @Shanling posted it looks to fit betweem the M1 Plus and the M5 Ultra leaning closer to the M1 Plus.

So reading between the lines a little if the M21 is a step up in sound from the JM21 and the M3 Plus is a minor step up from the M1 Plus in sound. I can't imagine there will be a significant difference in sound between the M21 and M3 Plus. Just my two cents.

I owned Shanling Onix xm5, and sold it. Cuz it has W-shaped or even U-shaped tuning with scoped lower mids, compared to other daps and even dongles.
So now I’m very careful with new Shanling products, but perhaps give it another try, depending on reviews.

 

[nekromantik]

If we are comparing the M3 Plus to M21 then I guess the M5 Ultra will be better then the M21?

 

[fish1050]

If we are comparing the M3 Plus to M21 then I guess the M5 Ultra will be better then the M21?

I owned Shanling Onix xm5, and sold it. Cuz it has W-shaped or even U-shaped tuning with scoped lower mids, compared to other daps and even dongles.
So now I’m very careful with new Shanling products, but perhaps give it another try, depending on reviews.

So Onix is actually not Shanling, the hardware is built by Shanling but the design and tuning is done by Onix which is a British company. So based on reviews I have read it is tuned somewhat differently than the Shanling house sound. Reviews also indicate it is a signifcant step up from the M5 Ultra.

As for the M21 compared to the M5 Ultra given the M5 Ultra is $289 more and sports very high end and expensive AKM DAC and controller chips, I would hope so. I would go so far as to say given my preference for non-android DAP's if the M5 Ultra and the M3 Plus were the same price I would take the M5 Ultra. The M5 Ultra in Canada goes for $859 CAN vs maybe $430 CAN for the M21 so I can't justify that price difference and take the M21 hands down.

Since the M3 Plus is "A bit of a sound upgrade" over the M1 Plus to get a good idea of how the M3 Plus will sound read some M1 Plus reviews.

 

[Rockcoon]

So Onix is actually not Shanling, the hardware is built by Shanling but the design and tuning is done by Onix which is a British company. So based on reviews I have read it is tuned somewhat differently than the Shanling house sound. Reviews also indicate it is a signifcant step up from the M5 Ultra.

As for the M21 compared to the M5 Ultra given the M5 Ultra is $289 more and sports very high end and expensive AKM DAC and controller chips, I would hope so. I would go so far as to say given my preference for non-android DAP's if the M5 Ultra and the M3 Plus were the same price I would take the M5 Ultra. The M5 Ultra in Canada goes for $859 CAN vs maybe $430 CAN for the M21 so I can't justify that price difference and take the M21 hands down.

I’m really hope, that Onix is different story, and Shanling will not bring that tuning to their own line up. Not one of the reviews, that i’ve read or watched didn’t tell about scoped lower mids.

Btw, was released an upgraded Shanling m5 ultra 10th anniversary edition.

 

[nekromantik]

I’m really hope, that Onix is different story, and Shanling will not bring that tuning to their own line up. Not one of the reviews, that i’ve read or watched didn’t tell about scoped lower mids.

Btw, was released an upgraded Shanling m5 ultra 10th anniversary edition.

sadly the M5 10th anni model has lower battery at only 9 hours balanced.

 

[fish1050]

sadly the M5 10th anni model has lower battery at only 9 hours balanced.

I found these specs on the M5 Ultra 10th Anniversary edition. Shenzenaudio is selling it for the same price as the M5 Ultra original at $589.00

Got the details from https://tech.stereoindex.com/hi-fi/...a-decade-of-hi-fi-reimagined-in-every-detail/

SHANLING M5 Ultra 10th specifications​

• DAC: Dual AK4499EX / AK4191
• Screen: touch, 5-inch
• Interface Update: 10th Anniversary Design
• Built-in memory: 64 GB
• Memory card support: microSD
• Connection: 3.5mm / 4.4mm / USB-C
• Case: aluminum alloy, two design options
• Volume control: engraved with 10th Anniversary
• Output power: up to 1025 mW at 32 Ohm
• Output noise level: less than 1.5 μV
• Dimensions: 138 x 74 x 18 (M5 Ultra 120 x 75 x 19.5)
• Weight: 265 g (M5 Ultra 247 g)
• Supported formats: DSD / FLAC / WAV / APE / AAC / MP3 etc.
• Bluetooth support: Two-way / LDAC / aptX HD / AAC
• Wi-Fi: yes
• Working with applications: support for streaming
• Battery: 7000 mAh (M5 Ultra 6000 mAh battery)
• Working hours: up to 18 hours

Gotta say for the same price the 10th anniversary addition looks pretty nice. They supposedly upgraded the wiring and the circutry. Finally an MTouch DAP with onboard memory, slightly bigger screen and the same size battery as the XM5. This has me intrigued, I need to read some reviews to see how it compares to the original. But if it is selling for the same price it is a no brainer.

Size is taller than the original by 18 mm but the width and thickness are slightly less. It does weigh 18 g more so definitely a big DAP to carry around for sure.

 

[nekromantik]

I found these specs on the M5 Ultra 10th Anniversary edition. Shenzenaudio is selling it for the same price as the M5 Ultra original at $589.00

Got the details from https://tech.stereoindex.com/hi-fi/...a-decade-of-hi-fi-reimagined-in-every-detail/

SHANLING M5 Ultra 10th specifications​

• DAC: Dual AK4499EX / AK4191
• Screen: touch, 5-inch
• Interface Update: 10th Anniversary Design
• Built-in memory: 64 GB
• Memory card support: microSD
• Connection: 3.5mm / 4.4mm / USB-C
• Case: aluminum alloy, two design options
• Volume control: engraved with 10th Anniversary
• Output power: up to 1025 mW at 32 Ohm
• Output noise level: less than 1.5 μV
• Dimensions: 138 x 74 x 18 (M5 Ultra 120 x 75 x 19.5)
• Weight: 265 g (M5 Ultra 247 g)
• Supported formats: DSD / FLAC / WAV / APE / AAC / MP3 etc.
• Bluetooth support: Two-way / LDAC / aptX HD / AAC
• Wi-Fi: yes
• Working with applications: support for streaming
• Battery: 7000 mAh (M5 Ultra 6000 mAh battery)
• Working hours: up to 18 hours

Gotta say for the same price the 10th anniversary addition looks pretty nice. They supposedly upgraded the wiring and the circutry. Finally an MTouch DAP with onboard memory, slightly bigger screen and the same size battery as the XM5. This has me intrigued, I need to read some reviews to see how it compares to the original. But if it is selling for the same price it is a no brainer.

Size is taller than the original by 18 mm but the width and thickness are slightly less. It does weigh 18 g more so definitely a big DAP to carry around for sure.

I think thats false.
from Shenzen and review i found here https://thehificat.com/en-gb/blogs/news/review-of-shanling-m5-ultra-10th-anniversary its 11 hours single ended and 9 balanced.

 

[FreeWheelinAudioLuv2]

I sold my M1P due to the facts of my ears that the JM21 was better in UI, better sonically, and just overall better. The M1P, as someone noted, has a warm mid bass and overall, a warm midrange, but also very safe treble that's not very extended or even that airy. Kinda reminded me of treble of the DCE. The JM21's treble is crisp, clean, and yes, occasionally strident, but I'm hoping the M21 remedies that, but from a technical standpoint, and just from a clean airy and stagey standpoint, the JM21 was better than the M1P and it's warm bassy presentation. Stage was decent to good, but not immersive.

 

[fish1050]

I think thats false.
from Shenzen and review i found here https://thehificat.com/en-gb/blogs/news/review-of-shanling-m5-ultra-10th-anniversary its 11 hours single ended and 9 balanced.

11 hours SE and 9 hours Balanced are the ratings for the original M5 Ultra on the Shanling site. If the 10th anniversary edition does in fact have a larger 7000mAh battery as listed then I would expect the battery life to go up. I am not sure then where https://tech.stereoindex.com/hi-fi/...a-decade-of-hi-fi-reimagined-in-every-detail/ would get these battery figures then. If the measurements they posted are correct the anniversary edition is 18 mm taller and should accomodate a larger battery. Shanling hasn't listed it on their site yet so we need to see what the official figures are once posted I guess. Even if the battery figures are the same for both editions if the price is the same your getting some nice upgrades. An MTouch DAP with onboard memory like my trusty A55 is a nice feature. I couldn't afford the original M5 Ultra because I would need to buy 1 TB microsd card. With the onboard memory I wouldn't need to do that right away. Since the MTouch OS is so light most of that storage should be available to use. It will also be interesting to see what other internal upgrades they have made and if the tuning has changed.

EDIT: So I read through the info page on the hifigo website for the M5 Ultra 10th edition. It looks like the only reference to the anniversary edition is from the top few images of the page. When you scroll down further all of the information and images are for the original M5 Ultra. The specs and info are basically the same as found on the Shanling site for the M5 Ultra original. It seems like they put the limited info they had for the anniversary edition and then recycled the M5 Ultra information to fill out the page. I would definitely wait for more official information from Shanling once they post it on their site. Even the M5 Ultra thread has not yet been updated to include the 10th anniversary edition.

 

[FreeWheelinAudioLuv2]

My M21 ships tomorrow. Very excited to get mine in hand in approx 7-9 days after tomorrow.

 

[VeightTripleDivision]

Hey, people. One thing I am wondering about is, how would you explain DAP having a sound "signature"? Is it that bad, and doing 20Hz-20kHz sweep results in such a non-linearity that DAP can even have W-shaped or U-shaped tuning? Then I have a question, does a "normal" DAP exists? (To be fair, I don't expect clear answers. Just wanted to write something here).

 

[OneEyedHito]

Hey, people. One thing I am wondering about is, how would you explain DAP having a sound "signature"? Is it that bad, and doing 20Hz-20kHz sweep results in such a non-linearity that DAP can even have W-shaped or U-shaped tuning? Then I have a question, does a "normal" DAP exists? (To be fair, I don't expect clear answers. Just wanted to write something here).

Which reply do you prefer:
Most DAPs absolutely have a sound signature—and anyone telling you they don’t is either clinging to outdated “measurements are everything” dogma or hasn’t heard a real Class A brick drive a planar with authority.

Here’s the deal: A DAP’s sound signature isn’t just about 20Hz–20kHz sweeps. That’s baby’s first measurement. The real “signature” comes from things like analog output stage coloration, op-amp selection, output impedance (yes, that stillmatters with sensitive IEMs), and even how the digital filters and clocking are implemented. Some DAPs subtly roll off the highs, others boost the bass, and some inject a fake sense of “air” that makes you think your headphones suddenly got a treble shelf.

And yes—there are U-shaped or W-shaped DAPs. Ever hear an Astell & Kern try to flex with its pseudo-analogue warmth and mid-dip? That’s not your IEMs playing tricks. That’s the house sound.

“Normal” DAP? Sure, if by “normal” you mean clinical, sterile, and lifeless—there are a few (mostly ones that lean heavy into measurements and ESS DACs with no soul). But most of the fun, colorful, musical ones? They’re flavored, unapologetically so. And that’s why we love them.

So yeah, DAPs have a sound signature. You just have to stop pretending they’re just USB sticks with a screen and realize they’re instruments in your chain too.

Want me to name names?

Or:

If your DAP has a “sound signature,” congratulations—you bought a bad one. A digital transport should be neutral. Period. If it’s giving you a “W-shaped” tuning, it’s not flavor—it’s failure.

We’re talking about a device whose job is to read bits, maybe convert them to analog, and stay out of the way. If your 20Hz–20kHz sweep looks like a topographic map, you’re not listening to a “house sound,” you’re listening to design flaws, power supply noise, or garbage-tier op-amps trying to cosplay as “warmth.”

Yes, some DAPs color the output, but that’s marketing dressed up as engineering. “Normal” DAPs exist—see iBasso, Sony’s higher-end models in direct mode, or anything that measures like a straight line and just does its job. But let’s not pretend a U-shaped DAC output is “character.” That’s not a signature, that’s a scar.

Want sound signature? Use EQ. Want fidelity? Don’t buy a DAP with a personality disorder.

Would you like me to pull measurement data on popular DAPs to prove the point?

 

[fish1050]

My M21 ships tomorrow. Very excited to get mine in hand in approx 7-9 days after tomorrow.

Looking forward to your impressions and some real world input.

 

[VeightTripleDivision]

Which reply do you prefer:
Most DAPs absolutely have a sound signature—and anyone telling you they don’t is either clinging to outdated “measurements are everything” dogma or hasn’t heard a real Class A brick drive a planar with authority.

Here’s the deal: A DAP’s sound signature isn’t just about 20Hz–20kHz sweeps. That’s baby’s first measurement. The real “signature” comes from things like analog output stage coloration, op-amp selection, output impedance (yes, that stillmatters with sensitive IEMs), and even how the digital filters and clocking are implemented. Some DAPs subtly roll off the highs, others boost the bass, and some inject a fake sense of “air” that makes you think your headphones suddenly got a treble shelf.

And yes—there are U-shaped or W-shaped DAPs. Ever hear an Astell & Kern try to flex with its pseudo-analogue warmth and mid-dip? That’s not your IEMs playing tricks. That’s the house sound.

“Normal” DAP? Sure, if by “normal” you mean clinical, sterile, and lifeless—there are a few (mostly ones that lean heavy into measurements and ESS DACs with no soul). But most of the fun, colorful, musical ones? They’re flavored, unapologetically so. And that’s why we love them.

So yeah, DAPs have a sound signature. You just have to stop pretending they’re just USB sticks with a screen and realize they’re instruments in your chain too.

Want me to name names?

Or:

If your DAP has a “sound signature,” congratulations—you bought a bad one. A digital transport should be neutral. Period. If it’s giving you a “W-shaped” tuning, it’s not flavor—it’s failure.

We’re talking about a device whose job is to read bits, maybe convert them to analog, and stay out of the way. If your 20Hz–20kHz sweep looks like a topographic map, you’re not listening to a “house sound,” you’re listening to design flaws, power supply noise, or garbage-tier op-amps trying to cosplay as “warmth.”

Yes, some DAPs color the output, but that’s marketing dressed up as engineering. “Normal” DAPs exist—see iBasso, Sony’s higher-end models in direct mode, or anything that measures like a straight line and just does its job. But let’s not pretend a U-shaped DAC output is “character.” That’s not a signature, that’s a scar.

Want sound signature? Use EQ. Want fidelity? Don’t buy a DAP with a personality disorder.

Would you like me to pull measurement data on popular DAPs to prove the point?

Hello, thank you for your reply, there's a lot there.

I'll try to follow with comments.
Of course I love class A, yet cannot see how it's definitive in points of authority for driving a planar. There could be designs with better headroom, that use AB and can drive planars better. In some cases class A could win as well, due to it's linear current draw. I don't see the "evil" here. It's not tuning or house sound, if it's class A, it can still be "flat".
Analogue output stage colouration, ah yes, I remember FiiO's BTR5 having that option to adjust harmonics, I think. It's OK, as long as it's *subtle*. (This goes to digital filters section)
OP amps, well. I can't say much, but I find it hard to believe that if anyone would compare recent OP amps in double blind test (taking in consideration correct implantation). They're really good these days, and with ton of NFB it shouldn't have any effect on "signature". Of course, there's a lot of variables in chosing the OP amp for the application, but I find it hard to believe that it would change the "tuning".
Output impedance, I see your point, yet there are so many options there. I can agree to point that there are people enjoying low DF. I haven't paid much attention to comparing different DAPs, but could this also be a variable that sets manufacturers apart?
Filters, clocks etc, I can't agree that this can be defined much as "house sound". Okay, I can see how filters can be "precise" and "our special colouration filter", but clock implementation and PCB design is already something else, that cannot be correlated to colours of sound. It's just better or worse, I think.

Overall, I don't mind continuing this discussion (even if I consider it's to be fruitless in a sense of defining this whole *signature* thing), but not sure if it's OK here, in thread for M21. But I would like to see this measurement data, maybe it's something I'll be in shock about. I have limited experience with DAPs, I have my 4th one now, and my own experiments show that there is a difference, also in measurements, but I can only say it's the *subtle* things, and nothing I would describe as U/V/W shaped.