[MD1032]

Quote:

Originally Posted by djgustashaw Speak for yourself. I've already gotten one and I love it.

OK, now my question to you is: why have you done so? There are part superior players in that price range. I my opinion the ipod shuffle falls way short of the competition. The N200 is only one example, and a fine one at that.

 

[daphox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD1032 OK, now my question to you is: why have you done so? blablablablablablabla...

Does the N200 support the totally superior AAC?

 

[crimsonadam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD1032 OK, now my question to you is: why have you done so? There are far superior players in that price range. I my opinion the ipod shuffle falls way short of the competition. The N200 is only one example, and a fine one at that.

Though perhaps phrased a bit awkwardly, it is in fact a valid question. What sets the "shuffle" apart and above the other flash players out there?

 

[daphox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by crimsonadam Though perhaps phrased a bit awkwardly, it is in fact a valid question. What sets the "shuffle" apart and above the other flash players out there?

1. AAC-support

2. iTunes support

3. design

 

[PodMan]

I think what other DAP manufacturers do not understand is that to steal market share away from Apple, they don't need to cram as much features as they can into a player. They just need to support AAC and integrate well with itunes. The former is especially important as I think most ipod users would have at least a significant portion of their music in AAC (either from the itunes store or ripped themselves since itunes by default rips to AAC and also because the mp3 encoder in itunes is bad). The itunes music store is basically designed to sell iPods, as Apple makes a comparatively slim profit on each song. For me at least, 90%+ of my music is encoded with AAC. Reason being primarily because itunes rips and titles music in many different languages easily and flawlessly. I play them using foobar on my pc but rip with itunes because it is so simple.

As the ipod and the itunes music store become more and more successful, this will basically become a similar scenario to Sony not supporting mp3s. Users just don't want to spend the time to re-encode their entire music collection just for a new player. I have read from posts here that many shuffle buyers buy the thing primarily because it supports itunes and AAC. Until at least AAC support is met by other manufacturers, this will be a major hurdle to getting ipod users to switch.

 

[IstariAsuka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by daphox 1. AAC-support 2. iTunes support 3. design

1. SQ is not going to be your primary concern with a flash player. To fit many songs on it you're already going to be using a low bitrate. Oh, and what's this you say--some other flash players have OGG support?

2. The Forge has iTunes support as well, just not as integrated. Besides, how hard is it to change the music occasionally without iTunes? OMG, I can't stick 100 songs on it w/o iTunes!!!
3. What's so nice about the design? I know that it wouldn't fit my hand very well. It's a rectangular prism. With somewhat rounded edges. Ooooh, aaaah, very innovative and awesome.

 

[waylman]

Quote:

3. design

LOL, nothing better than carrying something that looks like a tampon around in your pocket.

 

[daphox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka 1. SQ is not going to be your primary concern with a flash player.

Mine is, maybe not yours.
Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka To fit many songs on it you're already going to be using a low bitrate.

Who said I'm fitting many songs?
Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka Oh, and what's this you say--some other flash players have OGG support?

?
Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka 2. The Forge has iTunes support as well, just not as integrated.

My congrat's to "The Forge"(?)
Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka Besides, how hard is it to change the music occasionally without iTunes?

Not very.
Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka 3. What's so nice about the design? I know that it wouldn't fit my hand very well.

That's because you're holding on to your ****. Let it go.
Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka It's a rectangular prism. With somewhat rounded edges. Ooooh, aaaah, very innovative and awesome.

Isn't it?

 

[crimsonadam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by PodMan As the ipod and the itunes music store become more and more successful.

Why shouldn't it be expected that Apple will (practically) "market" itself out of business like it did with computers. They've kept an artificially high price point, which is a huge opening for competitors, while they're holding onto a less common compression format (akin to the business practices that guided the old selling strategy of the old Mac OS).

As it becomes more common, more cheaply done, i would expect that iTunes will lose a significant amount of its business. For a long time the only name in the game was the iPod, now you'll have Sony entering the DAP market (who though that they'd be able to destroy Nintendo as the game console leader), not to mention the other cheaper varieties (Dell) that will be able to absorb the market demo that simply can't afford the ipod.

512 Mb for $100 (ipod)
or
20 GB for (about) $200 (dell)

 

[sno1man]

Quote:

Originally Posted by daphox 2. iTunes support 3. design

Those two reasons nail it.

2. People like itunes and many have an ipod already so this fits in well and is a no brainer

3. It is extremely simple to use. A few buttons to activate (turn it on, press play) load, just plug it in and it will grab some music from your library. And tampon jokes aside it s nice looking IMHO. It actually most resembles a remote control from another much despised company on this board, Bose.

Everyone here needs to remember that they are not the target market and that even within Apple's offerings there are other choices if this is not what you want.

My GF loves hers. She is the exact market; she can use a computer, but is not an expert, likes her music but does not need to have 400 hours with her at all times, likes the shuffle mode a lot since that was always the way she left my mini when she borrowed it, and like the small size and weight.

She doesn't need to communicate with the Russians with it, or watch movies on it....... She has tried out most of my DAPS and always said too much trouble with the exception of the ipod.

I swear, many are just jealous of the attention Apple gets and I cant fathom why. It's just a product. I like the two that I have and when something better comes along from any company I will be first in line

 

[crimsonadam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sno1man I swear, many are just jealous of the attention Apple gets and I cant fathom why. It's just a product. I like the two that I have and when something better comes along from any company I will be first in line

I wouldn't term it jealousy, but the apple ipod line risks becoming bose. Selling an overpriced product and using marketing to give the public the very false impression that there are no better alternatives/options, thereby keeping the market's standards low.

The perception is that if the ipod doesn't have it, then it doesn't exist. If the iPod doesn't have a custom EQ, or FM Radio or the ability to record, or FLAC, OGG format capibility or a built-in dedicated line-out or a user replaceable, then it must not exist and isn't even possible.

That's why the audiophile community has such qualms with the product line. Does it sell based on it's own merits, or is there significant tweaking of the public perception.

 

[sno1man]

I do think that Apple is far and away the best marketed. Every where I go I see ipod. I only see other stuff in California and even then it is small in comparison.

The one thing that ipod has is the cool factor. It's just one of those things that every company wants and few ever get. People respond to that and though other here may scoff at it, it's a lot of why many buy a product be it Apple, Bose, Chevy or Harley Davidson

That being said, in total i think the ipod is by far the best of the lot. There are some players that have more features (iriver) or sound better (my karma edges out the ipod) but in aggregate to total experience for a portable high capacity music player it wins the overall gold.

BTW: If the absolute best sound is what you want, no one on this board should be expecting that from a DAP. they should be with their home gear, in my case my beloved Rotel DC player

 

[bahamaman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by crimsonadam using marketing to deceive the public into thinking that there are no better alternatives/options

And so, just how is Apple deceiving the public? If by "deceive" you mean that Apple advertises its products so as to promote sales and that it fails to mention that there are perfectly acceptable/well-priced alternatives on the market, how different is Apple from any other company?

Would you expect Ford to suggest in its advertising that customers check out the new Chevys?

 

[Mr Iriver]

After trying my girlfriends shuffle, the sound I found to be very good considering it's price, and size. For a small stylish white mp3 player, however I prefer MPIO FY200 in every way over the shuffle. The only problem is the amp which is weak in the Fy200, and the direct encoding which at highest settings is only 89Kbps. FM reception and sound quality is very good. http://mpio.com/

Fy 200 in my opinion is one of the best looking flash players there is.

 

[yyoo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by daphox 1. AAC-support 2. iTunes support 3. design

Not to mention....

4. Price

5. Capacity

6. Rechargeable Li-ion

7. Weighs under an ounce (lighter than just about anything using a AA or AAA battery)