[bigro]

There has been some very good buzz about the Elac Debut Series by Andrew Jones.  I First Read about the Re Entry of Elac and Mr Jones heading up their new  US speaker division here on Head fi Just after the Newport show. After a lot of reading . I pre ordered a Pair Of B6 Bookshelves to Replace My Mackie Mr5 MKII Powered Monitors.
 
First Fedex said they would be here monday they showed up yesterday. Perfect Timing for the weekend. 
here are My initial Impressions I will not get into super specifics as they are still settling in and my ears are different than yours.Oh yeah and of course speaker placement is key here. Just because they are called bookshelves does not mean that's where they go.
 
I will list my setup up way at the bottom for those interested.
 
The Finish is very good.its a vinyl over MDF. The Screw less facia is very nice, Everything seems very well built and pieced together. The Wife likes the looks better than the Mackies. so that is a plus, the Grills are sturdy and the Aramid fiber cones looks pretty slick. Impressive finish for a sub $300 pair.
 
What I learned. They Need break in at least a few hours of solid play back to start to open up, I have placed them Placed about 1.5 Feet from the wall to keep the bass from being exaggerated. I spent some time moving them around to get a good placement It does have a nice low end punch and in a small room you may be able to get by with out a sub and not even notice you are missing one.Once they Finally start to settle in and open up, Wow DO they open up. I made sure to sleep on it and revisit to make sure my ears were fresh. The sound stage opens up nice and wide and its has very balanced sound. I don't get the sense of anything being exaggerated. The highs and Lows are handled well with out any detectable strain and the mid's are full but not overpowering. I have only gotten to a semi moderate volume,  in a couple days ill work my way up a little wall shaking.There is very good detail and separation, there is no sense of instruments getting lost. I can place the instruments very well throughout the sound stage which I found myself doing subconsciously.   
 
I think the Elacs will need more time to settle in I have them playing this morning and they are getting consistently better with each track that plays. The Mackies are on Their way back to their box for safe keeping or to be given to a buddy. These speakers definitely deliver in bang for buck performance. They are as balanced as most studio monitors I have heard. I agree with the Audiophiliac, they can definitely give the Bowers and Wilkins bookshelves a run for their money These should be a major consideration for anyone looking at a new set of speakers. Mr Jones has really built a pair of speakers that performs way above their price point and league. All The rave at Newport and RMAF was well placed and deserved.
 
 
 
 
 
 
The Setup 
Foobar 2k on a windows Laptop--> Schiit Wyrd--> Schiit Bifrost Multibit --> Schiit Valhalla (Used as a preamp w/NOS Gold Grid Tubes)--> NAD 2200 PE Power Amplifier(using the lab inputs, this bypasses the filters in the amp) -- ELAC B6 .and PSB subwoofer Blue Jeans Interconnects . Pangea and Straightwire USB cables, Belden 10 Gauge Speaker cable.

 

[HeyWaj10]

Can't wait to get a pair of these in the winter! These are sounding just about perfect from all the impressions I've read so far. Thank you for your review, and keep the updates coming!

 

[danielhowk]

  There has been some very good buzz about the Elac Debut Series by Andrew Jones.  I First Read about the Re Entry of Elac and Mr Jones heading up their new  US speaker division here on Head fi Just after the Newport show. After a lot of reading . I pre ordered a Pair Of B6 Bookshelves to Replace My Mackie Mr5 MKII Powered Monitors.
 
First Fedex said they would be here monday they showed up yesterday. Perfect Timing for the weekend. 
here are My initial Impressions I will not get into super specifics as they are still settling in and my ears are different than yours.Oh yeah and of course speaker placement is key here. Just because they are called bookshelves does not mean that's where they go.
 
I will list my setup up way at the bottom for those interested.
 
The Finish is very good.its a vinyl over MDF. The Screw less facia is very nice, Everything seems very well built and pieced together. The Wife likes the looks better than the Mackies. so that is a plus, the Grills are sturdy and the Aramid fiber cones looks pretty slick. Impressive finish for a sub $300 pair.
 
What I learned. They Need break in at least a few hours of solid play back to start to open up, I have placed them Placed about 1.5 Feet from the wall to keep the bass from being exaggerated. I spent some time moving them around to get a good placement It does have a nice low end punch and in a small room you may be able to get by with out a sub and not even notice you are missing one.Once they Finally start to settle in and open up, Wow DO they open up. I made sure to sleep on it and revisit to make sure my ears were fresh. The sound stage opens up nice and wide and its has very balanced sound. I don't get the sense of anything being exaggerated. The highs and Lows are handled well with out any detectable strain and the mid's are full but not overpowering. I have only gotten to a semi moderate volume,  in a couple days ill work my way up a little wall shaking.There is very good detail and separation, there is no sense of instruments getting lost. I can place the instruments very well throughout the sound stage which I found myself doing subconsciously.   
 
I think the Elacs will need more time to settle in I have them playing this morning and they are getting consistently better with each track that plays. The Mackies are on Their way back to their box for safe keeping or to be given to a buddy. These speakers definitely deliver in bang for buck performance. They are as balanced as most studio monitors I have heard. I agree with the Audiophiliac, they can definitely give the Bowers and Wilkins bookshelves a run for their money These should be a major consideration for anyone looking at a new set of speakers. Mr Jones has really built a pair of speakers that performs way above their price point and league. All The rave at Newport and RMAF was well placed and deserved.
 
 
 
 
 
 
The Setup 
Foobar 2k on a windows Laptop--> Schiit Wyrd--> Schiit Bifrost Multibit --> Schiit Valhalla (Used as a preamp w/NOS Gold Grid Tubes)--> NAD 2200 PE Power Amplifier(using the lab inputs, this bypasses the filters in the amp) -- ELAC B6 .and PSB subwoofer Blue Jeans Interconnects . Pangea and Straightwire USB cables, Belden 10 Gauge Speaker cable.

 
 

Can't wait to get a pair of these in the winter! These are sounding just about perfect from all the impressions I've read so far. Thank you for your review, and keep the updates coming!

i wonder how Elac B6 goes against JBL LSR305 , i was planning to buy JBL LSR305 till i stumble into Elac B6, they are both roughly the same price JBL is $280 a pair in amazon . any idea which is better?

 

[bigro]

   
 
i wonder how Elac B6 goes against JBL LSR305 , i was planning to buy JBL LSR305 till i stumble into Elac B6, they are both roughly the same price JBL is $280 a pair in amazon . any idea which is better?

The JBL LSR305 Are powered Monitors. So you do not need an amplifier. The Elacs are not powered so you do need an Amplifier.
the biggest consideration is do you want to have a separate amplifier or do you want powered monitors? Powered Monitors are perfect for Audiophiles on a Budget in my opinion. As Far as sound quality I listened to the 30's at Guitar center in the non optimal setup they have. They are no slouch. Just keep In mind the 305's are 5.25 Inch drivers so the bass response may not be as good as the larger drivers. Andres Jones said he has brought hey sensitivity down in the Debut series to give better bass response. Do they have better bass response? I sometimes don't realize I have not turned my sub on. so I would say yes.
 
Which Is better? I cannot tell you whats better for you but I liked the sound of the Mackie Monitors over the JBL's. And after a few days with the Elac's I have prepared the Mackies for Temporary Storage. 
 
side note I have not heard the Emotiva Monitors but they have the Airmotiv 5s for $279 a Pair down from $400 on the emotiva website

 

[danielhowk]

  The JBL LSR305 Are powered Monitors. So you do not need an amplifier. The Elacs are not powered so you do need an Amplifier.
the biggest consideration is do you want to have a separate amplifier or do you want powered monitors? Powered Monitors are perfect for Audiophiles on a Budget in my opinion. As Far as sound quality I listened to the 30's at Guitar center in the non optimal setup they have. They are no slouch. Just keep In mind the 305's are 5.25 Inch drivers so the bass response may not be as good as the larger drivers. Andres Jones said he has brought hey sensitivity down in the Debut series to give better bass response. Do they have better bass response? I sometimes don't realize I have not turned my sub on. so I would say yes.
 
Which Is better? I cannot tell you whats better for you but I liked the sound of the Mackie Monitors over the JBL's. And after a few days with the Elac's I have prepared the Mackies for Temporary Storage. 
 
side note I have not heard the Emotiva Monitors but they have the Airmotiv 5s for $279 a Pair down from $400 on the emotiva website

Wow thanks for you detailed reply, You prefer the Mackie monitors over JBL ? even though you've heard the JBL . for me to purchase a pair of JBL LSR305 is about $540 not sure if is worthy but for that price point many people have been recommending me the JBL , and i appreciate their replies as well. but never heard of mackie monitors. not sure if i should be considering it. hows the bass of mackie monitors ? because i actually like hivi swan mkIII but it was lacking bass i play games and sometimes listen to EDM and pop .
with the $540 price point i was thinking of maybe buying Elac B6 and a cheap receiver ? cause for the united states in amazon a pair of JBL is only $280. 
does amazon charge more after $280 ? like tax etc ? 

 

[bigro]

  Wow thanks for you detailed reply, You prefer the Mackie monitors over JBL ? even though you've heard the JBL . for me to purchase a pair of JBL LSR305 is about $540 not sure if is worthy but for that price point many people have been recommending me the JBL , and i appreciate their replies as well. but never heard of mackie monitors. not sure if i should be considering it. hows the bass of mackie monitors ? because i actually like hivi swan mkIII but it was lacking bass i play games and sometimes listen to EDM and pop .
with the $540 price point i was thinking of maybe buying Elac B6 and a cheap receiver ? cause for the united states in amazon a pair of JBL is only $280. 
does amazon charge more after $280 ? like tax etc ? 

Mackie Is Well Known in the Pro Audio World. They Do not so much consumer products. Between the JBL and Mackie Its Kind of the preference thing. the JBL's where not bad by any means Actually the decision was Between the JBL's and The Mackie's. The Mackie Monitors seemed to be have little better tonal balance and It seems the higher end was a little more detailed.  I Also  liked the flexibility of being able use Balanced Inputs as well as unbalanced. The JBL's are Balanced Inputs Only. Also The JBL use Class D amplifiers the Mackies are Class A/B. CLass D's are highly efficient but the way they work may compromise High frequency sound quality is this the case with the Jbl? not to my ears. Class A/B is less efficient so they run warmer but supposedly without the possible compromise on the High end. I don't mind a little heat.
 
Keep In Mind My audition was at a Guitar Center definitely not a optimal setup for a proper audition. If Bass is what you are looking for the JBL's seemed to be slightly better in that department, they are 5.25" Drivers so even though the frequency response is 43 hz on the low end there is a steep drop off.
 
Cost wise You will be hard pressed to find a Pair of speakers and Amplifier that will compete with those Mid line Studio Monitors JBL, Mackie, Tannoy Etc.
 
When It comes to the Elacs. The Quality is right up there with monitors. I would say the sound stage is slightly wider than The Mackies and the B6 definitely has a nicer low end Punch. I can pick out some details slightly better and there is very good overall balance I do not care for hyped up bass or loud highs .
 
Now that I have made things more difficult for you my choice to go away from the monitors was because I wanted the ability to step up amplifiers and or speakers as opportunity presented and I do drive my system hard from time to time which is not really the use case for monitors. I am Using an Old NAD amplifier which may or may not be swapped out. I will say one thing I noticed is that when driven hard most of the monitors I have listened to can run out of steam. There just is not enough headroom to be driven hard for long and that's probably because they cant physically fit huge transformers and capacitors in there. In this aspect the Traditional 2 Channel amp or pair of Mono Blocks will probably out perform any of the monitors in that Aspect.  I have been breaking the Elacs in for a week now and worked them up to a considerable level and there was power to spare. Not A hint of giving up. It all depends on your use case. 

 

[HeyWaj10]

Anyone own a pair of Debuts yet?  Impressions?

 

[bigro]

  Anyone own a pair of Debuts yet?  Impressions?

I have a Pair of the B6's as noted above. My Impressions HAve Not change much I still very much like these speakers. The Low end is very good as Mr. Jones has stated was his goal hence the Lower Sensitivity. I had to turn my sub woofer down. I am driving these now with an Emotiva Mini- X  A-100 so the Lower sensitivity is not an Issue as long as your amp has a little Cojones. The Mid's are very smooth have good substance. The Tweeters reproduce details very well.  I have had them for almost a Month now. My Experience is they do open up and get a little Smoother with use as I have found with most speakers. To be Honest at this point I am Extremely Happy with them and think they are an absolute steal at this price. They Produce a Nice Phantom image and really could be used without a sub in a small room for music. The Only thing that I noticed is there is a hint of Sibilance on certain recordings but that could just be the recordings or the fact that I now notice it. I have Driven them Pretty Hard and did not have any issues with distortion or any other anomalies.
 
I have the B6's Placed on Metal Stands Filled with Sand about 2 feet from the wall.  They are About 6 feet apart and I had a very slight "toe in" to get the Image I want.
 
a Few Notes.
The Ports are rear facing so If you need to put them up against a wall the Lows may be overpowering. Mr Jones has Suggested literally" putting a sock in it" if you need to get them close to a wall.
The Metal Grills on the tweeter which I do not care for come off pretty easily because they are not glued in or screwed in. There is a felt material which keeps it from vibrating and also seems to provide the friction needed to keep the grill from vibrating or falling out. The tweeters look a little weird as they are transparent but that does not bother me. You can use a paper clip with a 90 degrees bend and with minimal pressure and voila  they pop right right off pay. Please attention and please don't poke the tweeter, leave them on if you think you may mess up the tweeter and blame me. The Finish and fit of everything was better than expected for this Price Range. The Vinyl has a brushed metal look which is far nicer than the standard matte black finish of other speakers in this price range which makes speakers look kind of cheap. The Binding Posts are extremely well Built as well. Not cheap flimsy plastic knobs.
 
I think you would have to look at a Price range at least double the cost of these to get similar sound. These will be around for a While
 
 
For those Curious
Win7 Laptop - Schiit Wyrd--> Schiit BIFrost MultiBit --> Schhit Valhalla2 --> Emotiva Mini- x A 100--> Elac B6's
Cables- Blue Jeans Cables and Schiit (straight wire). Speaker Wires are Belden 10 Gauge. 

 

[crenca]

  I have a Pair of the B6's as noted above. My Impressions HAve Not change much I still very much like these speakers. The Low end is very good as Mr. Jones has stated was his goal hence the Lower Sensitivity. I had to turn my sub woofer down. I am driving these now with an Emotiva Mini- X  A-100 so the Lower sensitivity is not an Issue as long as your amp has a little Cojones. The Mid's are very smooth have good substance. ......
 
I think you would have to look at a Price range at least double the cost of these to get similar sound. These will be around for a While
 
 
For those Curious
Win7 Laptop - Schiit Wyrd--> Schiit BIFrost MultiBit --> Schhit Valhalla2 --> Emotiva Mini- x A 100--> Elac B6's
Cables- Blue Jeans Cables and Schiit (straight wire). Speaker Wires are Belden 10 Gauge. 

 
bigro,
 
I had to sign up and post when I read this thread because I placed an order about an hour ago for the Elac B6's and the Emotiva Mini x A 100.  I will be feeding them with digital with an IFI iDSD nano, and this will be my office system (really, a glorified computer speaker system, though I plan to put a little space between myself and the speakers).  My only worry is the "sibilance" you have noticed (as have other reviewers).  I wonder if these speakers are bringing out the character of the amp, as some complain that Emotiva amplification has a bright, "sibilant" character.  Have you tried the Elac B6's with other amplification?  Also, have you tried EQ to bring this under control?
 
I like my sound to be accurate (I am mostly into Jazz and classical) which means I like what is often described as a "warm" sound with accurate low end (though I am in no way a "bass head"), clear and detailed mids, and highs that are accurate but not overly forward or sibilant (as so many speakers are these days).
 
Just wondering if you had done anything in response to the treble character you are hearing...

 

[bigro]

Crenca.
 
My Chain at this Point Looks Like this,
 
Win7 Laptop --> Schiit Wyrd --->Schiit Bifrost Multibit---> Schiit Valhalla 2  (Used as a Preamp. Rolled to late 70's Russian Gold Grid input tubes and early 80's Gold Grid Output tubes). Emotiva Mini X --- > Elac B6's
 
The Siblance shows in some recordings far more than others, in Some I don't hear it at all. I used the B6's with an old NAD 2200 Power Envelope Amplifier and I picked up on it there to. I have not tried to Equalize because it's not all the time and once you dial in the placement the I find the B6's to have an exceptional balance of Mid,Low and High Range. If your Room is Small Enough you will not really miss a subwoofer which is one of the common issue I find with bookshelves. The Recordings I find Sibilant is probably not mastered to the standards that most Jazz and Classical recordings are. As I said It may just be the recordings. I do not listen to classical much, if it all. I do listen to Jazz from time to time so I will give a few tracks a try and see what I come up with.
 
The Emotiva Mini X has More than Enough Power to Drive these speakers. After a Few weeks I gave them a good run at higher volumes no clipping or other anomalies. It's Power Rating is almost a Perfect match for the Elac's. You do not need a Preamp with the Mini X However I think using the Valhalla as a Tube Pre amp adds Just a bit of warmth and depth to the music but does not soften it up to the point where it seems sloppy. I do not find the Mini X to be bright,  it actually brought out some details I found Lacking with the NAD. I think that is subjective to amplifier and speaker combinations. I think the Elacs are a far better match with the Emotiva than the Old NAD which had a ton of power but seemed to mask some of the finer details. That NAD Amp sounds better with Speakers that are naturally more forward. Emotiva has a Big Sale now $149 for the Mini X with free shipping.
 
There is one thing I feel I should mention since you are considering the Emotiva. I am working with Emotiva's Customer Service on a annoying issue when power the amp on there is a loud thud after a few seconds which seems to be when a relay gets triggered and the woofers have a very visible, almost to max excursion. I'll spare the details of my testing, but I have just been turning the Volume control all the way down and just powering off the Preamp.  Emotiva has sent a new Mini X which I received yesterday. I will try it out for a few days and report back.
They have a great Customer Service team. They sent me the replacement before I send the old one back so I was not sitting without an amp for a week and even covered shipping for the new amplifier. I have had amplifiers do this in the past but i don't like it. They are Making every effort to work with me at this point. I will update on this .

 

[crenca]

Thanks for the note bigro. It might be character of the recordings that the speaker/amp combo is bringing out (and not the character of the speaker/amp themselves). I will of course figure all this out myself in the next couple of weeks, and I look forward to do so.
 
It is interesting what you say about NAD amplification, as I recently auditioned some speakers that are known to have forward (but otherwise accurate/clear) treble and mids, and the NAD (a 375 interad) really "masked the details" with them.  In fact, I would go so far as to say they changed the mids fundamentally.  Perhaps you need to get into NAD's "master" series before they become "audiophile" quality.  On the other hand, I have nothing but good things to say about NAD's HP 50 headphones - I rank them simply the best out there in the sub $600 range.
 
I also have nothing but positive experiences with Emotiva service, especially given their price point.  I do think they have their share of quality issues however, but again that is no doubt due to their China sourcing (probably with no direct supervision that some of the big boys are able to do) -  given their price point and their service it is nothing to complain about IMO.  I am sure they will make it right you...

 

[bigro]

The NAD The 2200 is an older amplifier but I did not expect such a difference as the Emotiva and NAD 2200 are both Class A/B. The Mid range Of the Elacs really Started to shine when I switched to the Emotiva amp.
 
I have the Cousin to the NAD HP 50's. The PSB M4U1. Both were Designed By Paul Barton and from what I have read have an almost Identical sound. The NAD's do look nicer thought. I like a Balanced Sound and while I like bass I don't like when it drowns out everything else. And I find the PSB headphones offer a Balanced sound while keeping the lows in check and the mid's and high nice and detailed. I would suspect that if you like the way the NAD HP 50's sound you will like the Elac's Pair with the Emotiva Mini X.
 
 
The B6's are rear ported so I had to get them about 2 ft away from the wall to keep the Lows from being crazy. Some people don't like this because they need to keep them away from walls but Mr. Jones said it was to keep the sound of the air leaving the port (what he described as "choofing") from being audible from a normal listening position. On the ELAC Global Site I Found these which are basically foam Plugs to help tune the lows if needed. Just an Idea for your office if you cant get the far from the walls. There is also a what looks to be a rubber plug for some of their EU Models to entirely seal the Enclosure. 

http://www.elac.com/en/products/Loudspeaker_tuning/Vario_Bass_Control/index.php
 
They really have an impressive reach in the low frequencies for their size. My Sub is now turned down to less than 1/4 of the gain down from almost 1/2 with the previous speakers and it really only helps with the tracks that hit below the 45- 50 HZ Range. With Jazz and Classical  I do not think there are many instruments that get far below that.

 

[bigro]

crenca .
  I gave it a go With a few Jazz and classical tracks. These were streamed via Tidal so the choices on Jazz and classical are based on what tidal had in the genre categories, not my choices.Tidal was set on the the HI fi setting.  Many of the Classical and Jazz albums I tried seemed to be void of vocals for the most part.I listened to more than whats listed but I tried to find some albums with vocals because it's the S and F's that I find to be a bit sibilant. I turned off the Sub woofer So i could get a better Idea of what Just the B6's Sounded like with the Tracks. I do not know if these would fall under the Traditional Jazz and Classical albums and I do not know any of these tracks well but here is my unprofessional unscientific findings..
 
Diana Krall - Wallflower.  Sounds Pretty Natural. I did not find there to be sibilance.
First 5 tracks
 
Hiromi, Anthony Jackson, Simon Phillips - Alive
First three Tracks
No Vocals but This album requires another listen I stumbled across this and liked what I heard so far
 
 
Andrea Bocelli - Passions . I did not find this to be sibilant either
First 2 tracks
 
Jackie Evancho - Songs from the Silver Screen.  There was some tracks I found somewhat Sibilant
First 5 Tracks- 
 
Now Here is Where Curiosity kicked in, I Had taken the Tweeter grills off and was wondering if they served more than just preventing unscrupulous little fingers from squishing the tweeter in. Andrew Jones Had mentioned he had redesigned the grills because the original design had screws and the screws negatively impacted specific frequencies. The grills are pressure fitted and will go back on or be removed pretty easily.  I spent some time here on the Jackie Evancho album since I found it sibilant on some tracks.I tried the tweeter grills on and off a few times and found that that the tweeter grills actually helped bring the sibilance under control. What ever was there was not apparent unless you really listened for it.
 
With The Sub turned off I did not get the feeling of missing anything.The Room is about 12'x12' to give you some point of reference. The songs were very balanced and the lows were not lacking or overpowering. But as we discussed amplifiers do have characteristics that can affect the sound of speakers.
 
I am of the opinion that if the track has sibilant characteristics it seems to present more with these speakers.The Tweeter Grills will more than likely stay on.

 

[crenca]

Thanks for the update bigro.  Those plugs might prove very useful because I would LIKE to put these speakers only about a foot from my back wall (and about 2 feet from corner).  This might not be feasible SQ wise however I realize.
 
I recall watching some youtube video where Andrew Jones was discussing the tweeter grills and how they had "almost no impact" - I wonder if they actually have a positive impact, or as you say without them the "wave guide" is not sounding as he intended.  Very interesting - I think I will be leaving them on.  I get the speakers today but the Emotiva is not due to arrive till tomorrow.
 
I love threads like this because you discover new music - I had no idea of Jackie Evancho.  I am listening now to that album via Tidal and while my NAD HP 50/IFI iDSD playback chain is the opposite of "sibilant", I can really hear those "f"'s and "s"'s from her - she seems to spit them out at times, so I can see how with even a slightly more forward setup I could hear her as sibilant.
 
By the way, if Hiromi has peaked your interest in the Jazz piano trio, check out this thread over at Computer Audiophile:
 
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f15-music-general/are-we-living-golden-age-jazz-piano-trio-18603/
 
Tidal will get you 60% plus.  I recommend starting with perhaps Shai Maestro and/or Triosence.  Many of those European players have a more "melodic" sound that many modern/non Jazz folks can more readily get into...

 

[crenca]

Bigro,
 
I posted a reply but it went into moderation because I put an external link in it.
 
Hey "moderators", why not give the opportunity to the person posting to remove links, or at a minimum edit, instead of your post disappearing into to "moderator" land??
 
frustrating.
 
To sum up, thanks for the info (plugs, heads up on music, tweeter grill behavior, etc.)
 
edit:  that was quick, apparently our "moderators" are bots....efficent ones too...