[n3rdling]

First off, I agree with others about the all cap titles being really annoying Ed. We'll see your topic just fine with regular typing. Your threads are no more urgent/important than anybody else's threads, even if that's not your intention.

I don't think the O2's soundstage is small vs reality, but it is probably a little small vs other headphones. I think the problem here is that people are so used to headphones that throw out huge artificial soundstages. I've said it a few times now, but I don't understand what all the hoopla about "huge soundstage" is on this site. It is extremely overrated to these ears and more of a wow factor than actually adding enjoyment to the listening experience. Give me a killer midrange or absolute driver transparency over a huge soundstage or peaked highs to give an artificial sense of detail any day of the week. If I want to impress a friend I'll let them listen to my K1000; if I want to listen to music, give me my O2. (Not that I don't enjoy the K1000).

As mentioned by a few others, I don't think there's another full sized headphone that can even touch the O2 in imaging. Every voice and instrument has an exact location. It is quite amazing. Other headphones have blurry imaging by comparison. After a certain point, I find the ultra diffuse imaging/huge soundstage combo to be very distracting and quite unpleasant (see: HE 90/Jade). Obviously lots of people love that type of presentation, but I think those presentations make it more about the headphone than the music whereas the O2 is more about the music than the headphone.

 

[The Monkey]

The O2 mk1 is the best. Someone please close the thread.

 

[Hopstretch]

Shut up Staxmonkey.

I just went from the HD800s to the O2s. Does the HD800 have a larger soundstage? Yes. Do I prefer the O2s? Yes.

Nerdling puts it very well in his final analogy above.

Quote:

The O2 is more about the music than the headphone.

 

[mypasswordis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by n3rdling If I want to impress a friend I'll let them listen to my K1000; if I want to listen to music, give me my O2. (Not that I don't enjoy the K1000).

If I want to listen to music, give me my K1000. The choice between underamped O2 (SRM-717 and lower) for me is clear: I'd rather listen to KSC75s.

 

[The Monkey]

Quote:

Originally Posted by n3rdling /img/forum/go_quote.gif the O2 is more about the music than the headphone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hopstretch /img/forum/go_quote.gif Shut up Staxmonkey. I just went from the HD800s to the O2s. Does the HD800 have a larger soundstage? Yes. Do I prefer the O2s? Yes. Nerdling puts it very well in his final analogy above.

Then what's the HD800 about? Chicken?

 

[n3rdling]

Roast beef

 

[The Monkey]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mypasswordis /img/forum/go_quote.gif If I want to listen to music, give me my K1000. The choice between underamped O2 (SRM-717 and lower) for me is clear: I'd rather listen to KSC75s.

I thought the O2 sounded acceptable out of the 007tii, but definitely not at its best. That was when I noticed an odd soundstage. Not necessarily constricted; more of a hollow sound.

Quote:

Originally Posted by n3rdling /img/forum/go_quote.gif Roast beef

mmm...with horseradish.

 

[mypasswordis]

Oh, I don't place too much weight on sound/headstage since I've accepted that most headphones just can't do it, as in placing instruments far enough from the head (the K1000 being a sort of exception). The problem I have with an underamped O2 is the frequency response tilt towards the bass and thus lack of treble and the overall somewhat loose and overly smooth sound.

 

[Currawong]

The OP (whom I agree should go Edit -> Go Advanced with his first post and fix the title without caps) sounds like (ha!) he is missing the treble with the O2s out of the regular Stax amps.

If I switch on the spot from the HD-800s to any Stax, then the result sounds more constricted. Very apparent recently was the contrast between the original Omegas (out of a T1S) and my HD-800s. The Omegas were indeed more about making sweet music and the HD-800s more about sitting in the middle of your own personal precision concert hall.

 

[brat]

It's a useful thread and I don't want to spin out the point. It'll be interesting to find out on what the soundstage is dependent. As I said before it's a frequency issue. Maybe O2 has frequency pecularities that make it more closed than most ot the other headphones. But is this the correct soundstage or it's artificially constricted??[size=xx-small]

I hope the bold font won't bother someone's tender eyes[/size]

 

[green0153]

Yes it's a frequency issue.Stax played a lot with diffuse field equalization and similar stuff
to get out of the head sound and with the 007 they stopped and got a wonderful headphone.

I like a big lambda type headstage but after 10 min of listening it really doesn't matter
because I start to focus on the instruments,voice and that's when the huge 007 soundstage comes into play(depends on the recording of course) and I would't trade the imaging,impact,focus for a bigger headstage.

I've done some Koss ESP/950 modding where I removed the damping from the headphones
and the headstage became bigger but the focus was reduced and the edges of the soundstage were blurred more than usual.

I'm quite certain that the grill on the back of the Omega II is needed and gives the pin point and trasparent imaging
of the whole soundstage.
This the only headphone that does that others that I've tried usually have good focus and layering on the center of the soundstage but lose it on the edges IMO.

 

[Currawong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by green0153 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I've done some Koss ESP/950 modding where I removed the damping from the headphones and the headstage became bigger but the focus was reduced and the boards of the soundstage were blurred more than usual.

This reminds me of the mods some people have been trying with the HD-800 to give better imaging, as what you describe here after your mods is rather like what you have with the stock HD-800. I wonder if they sacrificed imaging for soundstage to some degree. We really need a headphone engineer here or more information as it's an interesting subject to explore I think.

 

[Hopstretch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mypasswordis /img/forum/go_quote.gif If I want to listen to music, give me my K1000. The choice between underamped O2 (SRM-717 and lower) for me is clear: I'd rather listen to KSC75s.

Yeah, because underamped K1000s just sound so tremendous, too!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mypasswordis /img/forum/go_quote.gif The problem I have with an underamped O2 is the frequency response tilt towards the bass and thus lack of treble and the overall somewhat loose and overly smooth sound.

You kids today and your extreem trebelz. We older folk can't even hear that **** anymore, so why worry?

 

[catscratch]

Soundstage (or headstage if you want to separate the concept more) size and soundstage congestion are two different things. If the O2 sounds congested, then that's more a case of associated components not being up to par, and lately I have been finding the 717 not up to par. I think it's a good starting point, but no more, and I wouldn't expect the 727 to do any better. Improve your signal path, and the O2 will not really have a bigger headstage, but it will be much more open, much sharper, and at the same time more coherent.

In terms of it having a small soundstage - well that's recording dependant, but if you prefer something that sounds big with everything, I can see not liking the O2 for that. And yes, its soundstage on close-mic'd studio recordings and the like is small. I don't mind, I would rather trade soundstage size for imaging accuracy any day (up to a point, of course, the ER-4S takes it to an extreme that I can't live with, and maybe you're at that point with the O2).

Also, you want the SR-Omega. But first you want to upgrade that 727, and switch to the Mk1.

 

[spritzer]

While the 717 is indeed good it really should be viewed as the budget amp for the Omegas. One could build an ESX for not much more then the 717 and it will easily better it. I'm actually quite fond of mine even if it lacks all of the modern design twists...