[Elephas]

Stop it! You're making me want an ESX!

I guess the OP isn't going to change the thread title to regular text from the current "EDSTRELOW SIGNATURE ALL-CAPS THREAD TITLE" monstrosity that is making me feel sick.

Oh, well, I just have to figure out a way to avoid them.

 

[pabbi1]

I, personally, cannot stand the OII constriction, and don't think the he60 as diffuse as the he90. So, I am really happy with he60 / hd800 combo, two sides of the same coin... well, with the right amp(s).

 

[Elephas]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pabbi1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I, personally, cannot stand the OII constriction...

What do you think of the O2's soundstage when driven by a Blue Hawaii versus other amps, such as the Stax amps or the eXStata?

I do think the headstage/soundstage is a bit smallish, but I don't mind it too much when it is so coherent, imaging is so precise, and notes separation is so clear.

Hmm, I thought that the ALL-CAPS THREAD TITLE was the OP's standard operating procedure, but it's not done on every one of his threads. My apologies for calling this the 'EDSTRELOW SIGNATURE ALL-CAPS THREAD TITLE' monstrosity."

I guess it is only the "EDSTRELOW I'LL ALL-CAPS MY THREAD TITLES WHENEVER I DAMN WELL FEEL LIKE IT, SO BUG OFF, SIGNATURE THREAD TITLE."

Oh, how beautiful this looks, if only everyone else would do this too!

 

[green0153]

lol

 

[brat]

Just right now I'm listening to the binaural dummy head recording "Up Close" by Ottmar Liebert. The sound is completely out of my head. I can feel the room and the space between me and the instruments. But they're closer to me than probably they've been to the microphone during the recording process yet still out of the headphones. Before this album I've listened to another binaural album: Iannis Xenakis "Pleiades". The soundstage was much bigger than this of "Up Close", the sounds were all over my room. Very realistic... My conclusion is that even with modest amplification the O2 are capable of recreating enormous soundstage when the record has it.

 

[Clarkmc2]

While it can easily be argued that musicians play/record/position themselves to project the best sound to the position of the audience/ microphones, I still personally prefer the virtual position of being amongst the musicians to the third row seat or wherever recording engineers think we wish we were. Personal experience informs me that I like the sound the musicians hear a lot better. If this seems out of left field, picture this: what is better, the musicians, vocalists, amps, and all facing you or a PA and monitors feeding the sound to you. In other words, do you want the recording to give you the concert experience you remember, or an even better and more immediate/intimate experience? (Not a great analogy, but I have found being among the musicians is a nicer sound than being in the audience.)

The point being that headphones tend to place you there effortlessly but speakers stink at it; and headphones that use spatial engineering - driver placement, etc - to enlarge the soundstage/headstage will never be able to do it well.

The modern recording practice of isolating each musician and close miking most of them, especially the vocalists, yields an altered pattern as compared to musicians on a stage facing an audience. I expect it would be a struggle to flatten the mix back to an audience perspective. What naturally comes out would be a position amongst the musicians.

Given my preference, these modern techniques and the OII are just what my audio doctor ordered.

Obviously, this applies even more to acoustic music than guitar/bass/keyboard amps, but applies to all.

Clark

 

[edstrelow]

Well, this is interesting, quite a few persons, generally owners of the 007 find the soundstage somewhat constricted. Several even think that the humble Lambda has a more open sound although lacking the 007's pinpoint imaging and detail. The question is why? So I thought of a simple experiment to make the 404 more like the 007 by giving it a lip-type projection on the back side of each earcup.

As I noted initially the 007 has this weird construction behind the drivers, a sort of resonating tunnel about 3/8 inch deep. So with the masking tape around the edges of the 404, I have tried to duplicate something like this feature on the 404.

The result? I will let someone else report this first. If no-one rises to the bait with the 404 or some other Lambda, I will give you my take in a few days.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Elephas /img/forum/go_quote.gif I guess it is only the "EDSTRELOW I'LL ALL-CAPS MY THREAD TITLES WHENEVER I DAMN WELL FEEL LIKE IT, SO BUG OFF, SIGNATURE THREAD TITLE." Oh, how beautiful this looks, if only everyone else would do this too!

I guess if I was using all caps in the body of the text that would be odd, but not in a heading. I learned to capitalize headings and the like in legal briefs to make them stand outand on the assumption that the average judge just skims the body of the text.

I recall a story a few months ago in the LA Times about what I recall was a public servant in Australia(?) who was disciplined for using too many caps in her e-mails. However I believe she won an appeal against the disciplne and the point of the story was the weirdness of those who made an issue of capitalization.

 

[brat]

I see "edstrelow mod" on the horison: O2 with ventilated sides.

 

[The Monkey]

OT: I could not have imagined a lamer defense of the use of ALL CAPS. Hint for next time: "Didn't realize it bothered so many. I'll stop."

 

[markmaxx]

Quote:

Originally Posted by edstrelow /img/forum/go_quote.gif I guess if I was using all caps in the body of the text that would be odd, but not in a heading. I learned to capitalize headings and the like in legal briefs to make them stand outand on the assumption that the average judge just skims the body of the text. I recall a story a few months ago in the LA Times about what I recall was a public servant in Australia(?) who was disciplined for using too many caps in her e-mails. However I believe she won an appeal against the disciplne and the point of the story was the weirdness of those who made an issue of capitalization.

I can't believe anyone, has objected to the capitalize heading. (for real no scolding, just didn't realize, it was even capitalized).

Same thing with the guys who say things like "I can't even read this post with out punctuation". (These guys must have a hell of a time with personalized license plates.

This is funny in case you might take it wrong.) I have to try out the electrostats.

Great thread!!

I have only heard electrostats at meets but the HE 90, HE 60 being criticized, for being diffuse seems odd. I thought that the larger sound stage would open up the air around the interments, and vocals to allow for more detail.

 

[edstrelow]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brat /img/forum/go_quote.gif I see "edstrelow mod" on the horison: O2 with ventilated sides.

Let's see what people think about the "side issue" but who's going to be the first person to drill holes in their $2,000.00 set of headphones?

 

[edstrelow]

I would have preferred to see someone else publish their impressions of the taping experiment but since no one has risen to the bait, here is my impression of what taping the sides of the 404 does to its sound.

The basic idea here is to mimic the "chamber" that is created behind the 007 driver. As anyone can see from looking at the 007, the backpiece has a solid lip about 3/8 inch and an solid ring extending inwards also about another 3/8 inch before it turns into screen.

First I hear a significant, broad bass boost on my 404. This is not bad per se. I am sure some people might even prefer this sound but I find it, like the sound of the 007 not a completely clean sounding bass.

As regards openness, I think this mod reduces the openness of the soundfield. It's less obvious than the bass boost and not hugely bad. But especially when I ripped the tape off while the phones were on my head I could hear a marked opening up of the soundfield.

These results certainly suggest that the 007's deficiencies can be traced to the chamber at the back of the drivers.

Of course the modded 404 is not an exact parallel of the 007. The 007 has a round transducer, with a solid metal construction. The 404 driver is probably described as oblong and its construction is plastic.

Probably the next test would be to remove the back from the 007 and have a listen without any backing. I don't know if this can be done since the cord is attached to this back piece. Or as brat has noted above, one could perforate the back piece to make it more acoustically transparent.

I don't know if I will try either of these, after all these phones set me back a bundle and I am reluctant to mess with them too much. I did the Spritzer spring mod but that was pretty minor compared to drilling holes in the backpiece.

So that's where it rests for the moment.

I find it interesting that Stax followed such a different design philosophy with these two phones. The Lambdas were designed with an acoustically transparent backing, except for a thin piece of foam, (which I have removed in the 404). The 007 has no foam backing, but has the wall and ring arrangement on the back which seems not to be acoustically transparent but more in the way of a resonating chamber. It makes one wonder what the discussions were among the designers as they made these choces.

BTW: Someone other than myself has changed the title of this thread, putting most letters into lower case. I find this sort of censorship at best weird.

 

[mobbaddict]

I really wanted to try your mod estrelow, but i only did it last evening before reading your post. And i like what i heard

I agree with your findings overall. I find that the soundstage is less diffused with my modded LNS, more focused, with a smaller space (sound doesn't spread everywhere) but a better depth and imaging. I'm feeling it as an improvement actually.
The bass seems more consistant indeed but i can't be sure because i let my amp warm up for an hour, which i never usually do... and it makes a big difference in the lows. Anyway the bass was solid and tight, and the more focused imaging made me enjoy all kinds of music. A very decent allrounder. I need more listening though, i guess the comparison with the unmodded LNS will be interesting.
edit: another interesting point, i really enjoyed low volume listening because the LNS seemed to retain details better while maintaining a good impact.

 

[dreamwhisper]

nope, it's nothing short of stunning imo,

maybe you should try a different DAC?

 

[n3rdling]

Well the way he wears the earpads gives him no seal so I wouldn't be surprised if the O2 isn't that great to him. IME there needs to be a complete seal around the ear with the headpads to get the best sound out of the O2's.