Desktop amps...confused
May 18, 2009 at 9:14 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 18
thechungster

thechungster

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So I'm looking at the HD650, but people recommend desktop amps instead of porta amps etc. The only reason I have been looking at porta amps is that they're cheap (I have a small budget) Then people recommend amps like the Gilmore Lite and that's like $300.. which is just still way out of my budget. Are there any good $150 offerings out there?
I searched a bit, and found that the Little Dot MKIII and MKII are good? I am completely lost and confused about what makes all these tube amps so good.

Edit: If it's possible to recommend some that have good synergy with the HD650 as well, then that's a real plus as well. (Saves me searching and getting even more confused) My desk size isn't really that big, and so the size of the MKIII would do for me, I think.
 
May 18, 2009 at 11:53 PM Post #2 of 18
Desktop Amps have more power. A lot of it has to do with the power source. A portable amp has to be powered by a small battery which is inadaquate to power a desktop amplifier.

This is also the arguement used against soundcards, even though the Asus STX which is made for 2-Channel headphone listening still nothing in comparison to a good desktop amplifier. The PCI-Express slot doesn't provide the same power that many of hte desktop amps require.

That and what you are looking at tube amps. I doubt you can find a proper tube amp in a portable or soundcard solution.

And for many others like myself, if you need something portable, don't even bother getting a portable amp. It defeats the purpose of having something portable considering the difference would be minimal as you would be using a headphone that is portable, which rarely need amplification.

Also many of us like Class A amplifiers. Which just increase the signal exactly. Class A amps require a lot of power and they also produce a lot of heat. You can't fit a true Class Amp into a portable solution and definitely not onto a soundcard. Probably would cause your computer to overheat from all the heat a Class A amp would produce on a soundcard. Nor have the room for all the heat sinks needed. Even with heatsinks, my Compass runs pretty warm, luckily the entire casing is a heatsink.

Good luck!
 
May 19, 2009 at 12:19 AM Post #3 of 18
Yep, it boils down to how much power you can get into the power supply. The Asus STX, according to a review I found, peaks at 140mW. There's only so much power you can draw off a 3.3V or 5V PCI slot. In comparison, the Gilmore Lite will give you 1W (or 1,000mW). You don't need golden ears to hear the difference.

This isn't a class warfare issue, either. You'll see people claim that people are justifying their large expenditures on amps. However, you can get enough power from a vintage receiver. Ask your family members if they have an old two channel receiver you can have. Those don't usually run class A, but they can still provide enough power and sound good. Side benefits to a receiver are getting a radio tuner (the most overlooked source), a phono stage for vinyl and the ability to power speakers. There are some excellent, inexpensive, speakers out there. If you have a receiver to power them, you can get good speakers for $300-$600. Less if you build your own.

Anyhow, a free receiver sitting in a basement somewhere is a great way to go. If you can't find one, go to thrift stores, junk shops, garage sales, Craigslist, anywhere you can find used stuff. You should be able to find several for $50 or less. A good resource for tuners is Tuner Information Center - Vintage Stereo Tuners.

An often overlooked affordable amp is the PreSonus HP4. They sell for about $100, and I understand that it has the same amp circuit as their Central Station - you'll be able to find reviews and comments on the Central Station here. I owned one for awhile and it has a good amp section. It even drove the K-1000 reasonably well. One perceived drawback is that PreSonus makes studio gear, and studio gear is usually looked down upon here. Unfairly, in my opinion.

Finally, you can build your own amp affordably. Before you say that you're not good at that and don't know how, remember that everyone here started without knowing anything. If you decide you can do it, you can. There's plenty of help in the DIY Forum, too. Start a thread there if you want to learn more or get help choosing a first project.
 
May 19, 2009 at 1:52 AM Post #5 of 18
Quote:

Originally Posted by thechungster /img/forum/go_quote.gif
So I'm looking at the HD650, but people recommend desktop amps instead of porta amps etc. The only reason I have been looking at porta amps is that they're cheap (I have a small budget) Then people recommend amps like the Gilmore Lite and that's like $300.. which is just still way out of my budget. Are there any good $150 offerings out there?
I searched a bit, and found that the Little Dot MKIII and MKII are good? I am completely lost and confused about what makes all these tube amps so good.


For $150, you can get a nice amp. When choosing an amp, buy from a dealer that gets good reviews. Little Dot is good overall. You can choose other companies too.
 
May 19, 2009 at 2:12 AM Post #7 of 18
Its amazing how many people still keep saying the STX is powered by the PCI-E bus. Its not! Its dac+output are fed directly from the 12V molex.

Come on now. Keep up with the time people!
biggrin.gif
 
May 19, 2009 at 2:18 AM Post #8 of 18
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bojamijams /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Its amazing how many people still keep saying the STX is powered by the PCI-E bus. Its not! Its dac+output are fed directly from the 12V molex.

Come on now. Keep up with the time people!
biggrin.gif



Still, output is only 140mW. Most desktop amps are several times that.
 
May 19, 2009 at 2:43 AM Post #9 of 18
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bojamijams /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Its amazing how many people still keep saying the STX is powered by the PCI-E bus. Its not! Its dac+output are fed directly from the 12V molex.


Uncle Erik's right, even thought it get its power from the 12V molex, its max HP output is 140mW. LINK
 
May 19, 2009 at 2:52 AM Post #10 of 18
Thats fair, and I absolutely agree. I just wanted to stop spreading of the rumor re: PCI-E bus. As a $200 DAC alone the card is great, the headphone amp is just gravy. If you got nothing, its good enough.
 
May 19, 2009 at 3:14 AM Post #11 of 18
Quote:

Originally Posted by thechungster /img/forum/go_quote.gif
So I'm looking at the HD650,


Maybe we also need to ask why you're looking at HD-650s. Have you thought about other cans? What kind of music do you listen to?

What I'm thinking is, if you went for the HD-600s instead, there's a $100 saving right there. If you go for second hand, there's possibly another $50 saved. Then your amp (or amp/dac) budget can be bigger.
 
May 19, 2009 at 6:19 AM Post #12 of 18
Quote:

Originally Posted by Currawong /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Maybe we also need to ask why you're looking at HD-650s. Have you thought about other cans? What kind of music do you listen to?

What I'm thinking is, if you went for the HD-600s instead, there's a $100 saving right there. If you go for second hand, there's possibly another $50 saved. Then your amp (or amp/dac) budget can be bigger.


I definitely wanted to try something open, and not closed. Closed never seem right to me for some reason, like as some people says that the back resonates the sound causing impurities... Anyway HD650 can be had cheap in the UK (£200 on Play.com atm) Also I have the IE8s and actually love the Sennheiser sound sig. And HD600's are more or less the same price on the Internet (That I can currently find)
I listen to usually pop, electronic and rock. I just want a headphone that does stuff good for more or less every genre, and people have said that for the HD650. Due to the fact I can't audition headphones (Since I don't own a car, nor do I know anywhere I live that can audition headphones), I have to trust other people's reviews. Yes it's a gamble, but it's the only way unfortunately for me.
 
May 19, 2009 at 6:47 AM Post #13 of 18
Quote:

Originally Posted by thechungster /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I definitely wanted to try something open, and not closed. Closed never seem right to me for some reason, like as some people says that the back resonates the sound causing impurities... Anyway HD650 can be had cheap in the UK (£200 on Play.com atm) Also I have the IE8s and actually love the Sennheiser sound sig. And HD600's are more or less the same price on the Internet (That I can currently find)
I listen to usually pop, electronic and rock. I just want a headphone that does stuff good for more or less every genre, and people have said that for the HD650. Due to the fact I can't audition headphones (Since I don't own a car, nor do I know anywhere I live that can audition headphones), I have to trust other people's reviews. Yes it's a gamble, but it's the only way unfortunately for me.


Of course this is my opinion, but I thought HD600 was more of a all-around player that is better at pop, electronic and rock than HD650. One thing you could do is to look for used HD580 (very similar to HD600) that has HD600 grill and HD650 cable (which runs around $150-$170). But if you are absolutely sure on HD650, then go ahead, I think you won't be disappointed.
 
May 19, 2009 at 6:48 AM Post #14 of 18
Agreed with Curra about saving some $$ here and there to buy a better amp. But if your budget stays around 150 then I'd suggest little at what Little Dot has to offer. They have excellent customer service and have had wonderful feedback from this forum. They have amps in the 150 range and being an owner of the LD MKIVse, I must say they are a great company do to business with... plus their amp sounds great! Another plus... Tubes + 650 = golden, from what I've read.
 
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