[korzena]

Quote:

 
Without the box, cables, accessories etc. sure that's about as much as they're worth. Maybe $100 more for each. i.e. if you buy the headphones without packaging or anything else.
 
D600 has been as low as as $330, I think that's a good price. Those like you who judge headphones based on sound only will not be able to appreciate what the new line has to offer, considering that sound might not have been the main focus when they were designed. I do agree that as far as sound goes the 7100 is most certainly NOT an upgrade to the 7000 in any possible way.

That would be quite a terrible goal for Denon - building a new line of headphones focusing mostly on creating more modern design (which as far as I can see isn't to everybody's liking in comparison to the old line). If the company wouldn't care about the sound, they should stop calling their headphones "high-end" and should significantly reduce the prices in order to compete in their new market.

 

[elwappo99]

Quote:

That would be quite a terrible goal for Denon - building a new line of headphones focusing mostly on creating more modern design (which as far as I can see isn't to everybody's liking in comparison to the old line). If the company wouldn't care about the sound, they should stop calling their headphones "high-end" and should significantly reduce the prices in order to compete in their new market.

I think Denon sees a new market that has recently appeared which is the mainstream consumer. Their headphones target that range which focuses on looks and presentation more than anything. More than that, they lost their headphone supplier so they needed to basically move onto into their own space and make their own headphones. Double whammy to sound quality.

 

[Ahzari]

Quote:

I think Denon sees a new market that has recently appeared which is the mainstream consumer. Their headphones target that range which focuses on looks and presentation more than anything. More than that, they lost their headphone supplier so they needed to basically move onto into their own space and make their own headphones. Double whammy to sound quality.

While its obvious Denon was trying to market itself to the new Beats revolution crowd.. none of those masses would be willing to be the $1200 retail for "cool looking" headphones (that would likely be obvious if we saw sales #s for the 7100s). The problem with their marketing strategy (if that is their strategy) is that extremely expensive goes against the concept behind Beats which are relatively affordable and cool looking headphones with lots of bass.
 
So to me that just doesn't make sense. The 7100 is a flagship model, regardless of trying to gain mass appeal it was expected to perform as a flagship. The arena is full of excellent headphones that have a unique appealing look (Senns, Beyers, LCDs, HifiMan, Audio Technica, Stax, and now Fostex). So I feel like the 7100s failed on both fronts - choosing the right market considering the price point and producing a flagship level headphone.

 

[extrabigmehdi]

Quote:

While its obvious Denon was trying to market itself to the new Beats revolution crowd.. none of those masses would be willing to be the $1200 retail for "cool looking" headphones (that would likely be obvious if we saw sales #s for the 7100s). The problem with their marketing strategy (if that is their strategy) is that extremely expensive goes against the concept behind Beats which are relatively affordable and cool looking headphones with lots of bass.

 
Well, ultrasone does also cool looking portable headphone, and from what I've understood they are not strictly speaking high "fidelity" . There was a time , ultrasone headphones were  praised here (and then it was not cool anymore, perhaps since Tyll review on the edition 10).
 
Ok all the new denon line need is some good marketing, and the pill would pass. But they suffer from comparison with previous line, that are still missed. Instead of dropping previous models, they should have suggested "more portable" one , and let people choose between previous and new ones.

 

[korzena]

Quote:

 
Well, ultrasone does also cool looking portable headphone, and from what I've understood they are not strictly speaking high "fidelity" . There was a time , ultrasone headphones were  praised here (and then it was not cool anymore, perhaps since Tyll review on the edition 10).
 
Ok all the new denon line need is some good marketing, and the pill would pass. But they suffer from comparison with previous line, that are still missed. Instead of dropping previous models, they should have suggested "more portable" one , and let people choose between previous and new ones.

If anybody from Denon is reading this, please feel free to make a donation to us for the professional advice. Thank you.

 

[HiFiGuy528]

Rise your hand if you actually own the D7100 or have owned it. Heard it doesn't count. I like to hear from owners.

I own one.

 

[LinkPro]

*raises hand*
 
I have it, used to have the D600 for 3 months, then went full retard and sold it. Don't plan on making the same mistake this time.

 

[Croozer]

Rise your hand if you actually own the D7100 or have owned it. Heard it doesn't count. I like to hear from owners.

I own one.

Owner here.

And I really enjoy mine.

 

[elwappo99]

Quote:

While its obvious Denon was trying to market itself to the new Beats revolution crowd.. none of those masses would be willing to be the $1200 retail for "cool looking" headphones (that would likely be obvious if we saw sales #s for the 7100s). The problem with their marketing strategy (if that is their strategy) is that extremely expensive goes against the concept behind Beats which are relatively affordable and cool looking headphones with lots of bass.
 
So to me that just doesn't make sense. The 7100 is a flagship model, regardless of trying to gain mass appeal it was expected to perform as a flagship. The arena is full of excellent headphones that have a unique appealing look (Senns, Beyers, LCDs, HifiMan, Audio Technica, Stax, and now Fostex). So I feel like the 7100s failed on both fronts - choosing the right market considering the price point and producing a flagship level headphone.

 
It may appear that way, but the D600 is still like $500, which is incredible from an audiophile perspective. I think the Denon line is in perspective with the beats line. Build a mediocre headphone, make it look good, toss a ton of marketing at it, and hope it sticks. 
 
 
Quote:

 
Well, ultrasone does also cool looking portable headphone, and from what I've understood they are not strictly speaking high "fidelity" . There was a time , ultrasone headphones were  praised here (and then it was not cool anymore, perhaps since Tyll review on the edition 10).
 
Ok all the new denon line need is some good marketing, and the pill would pass. But they suffer from comparison with previous line, that are still missed. Instead of dropping previous models, they should have suggested "more portable" one , and let people choose between previous and new ones.

 
Since I was around for the edition 10, I remember that thread clearly. It started with a few inexperienced members tossing a wad of money at them. When more experienced members got them, they started getting picked apart. There were a few excuses that the original people made up, and ultrasone said it was the pads. Guess what? Pads didn't fix it. Then, Tyll posted his review and ... ahem video. This has clearly become the trend on head-fi, which has unfortunately in the last few year become about consumerism and getting new toys more than the original pursuits that were here. Maybe I belong in retirement though. 
 
The reason for this whole line was that Fostex dropped supplying to Denon. The previous line Denon didn't make at all. So this line is really Denon's first attempt at making their own headphones. If you want the successor to the old line, you need to follow the blood line to the new Fostex releases. Price should hit about the $900 mark in the US. 
 
 
 

 

[moodyrn]

I'm really surprised you haven't been called out for being a troll when it comes to any of the new line denon threads. You've made it painfully obvious more times than I can think of that you hate the new line. And that's fine, but you troll all the new denon threads just to crap on how bad they are. We get it, but I don't understand it. There are a slew of headphones that I truly don't like, and I will make it known I don't like them. Then I leave it alone. You don't see me in many hd-800s, or othere headphone threads that I don't care for because it's not worth my time. You post on these denon threads more than anyone else, including people  who actually love them. So I'm wondering what's the point of continually beating a dead horse. You hate them, we have known that for several months. Why devote so much energy trolling these threads just to keep bashing them to death? I'm just trying to understand.

 

[warrenpchi]

LOL, it's just a difference of opinion really.  elwappo99's been around so I don't think he's so much trolling as trying to tell what he feels is a cautionary tale.  BTW elwappo, innocent question here.  But if the following conditions still existed:
 

1. Denon named them the D700 instead of the D7100
2. Denon still offered the old line (D2K, D5K, D7K)
    

Then would you still be as upset about the D7100?

 

[korzena]

Quote:

LOL, it's just a difference of opinion really.  elwappo99's been around so I don't think he's so much trolling as trying to tell what he feels is a cautionary tale.  BTW elwappo, innocent question here.  But if the following conditions still existed:
 

1. Denon named them the D700 instead of the D7100
2. Denon still offered the old line (D2K, D5K, D7K)
    

Then would you still be as upset about the D7100?

Very good points!

 

[moodyrn]

Quote:

LOL, it's just a difference of opinion really.  elwappo99's been around so I don't think he's so much trolling as trying to tell what he feels is a cautionary tale.  BTW elwappo, innocent question here.  But if the following conditions still existed:
 

1. Denon named them the D700 instead of the D7100
2. Denon still offered the old line (D2K, D5K, D7K)
    

Then would you still be as upset about the D7100?

I didn't mean it as an insult, just as question as to why he cares so much about a headphone line that he obviously dislike...a lot. I fine with people who hates them, there's plenty of headphones I don't like. But I don't wear it on my sleeve because I don't care enough about them to be that bothered. If you search the forum about threads having anything to do with d7100/d600 then you will not only see just a few, but numerous negative posts by him. So I'm really just curious more than anything.

 

[warrenpchi]

Quote:

I didn't mean it as an insult, just as question as to why he cares so much about a headphone line that he obviously dislike...a lot.

 
Oh I know. 

  Just saying that for him, it might honestly be a case of wanting to warn people about something he considers less than worthy.
 
I've been known to rail against Beats myself, nearly every chance I get.  I just happen to disagree with him this time around concerning the D7100 is all.

 

[elwappo99]

Quote:

I'm really surprised you haven't been called out for being a troll when it comes to any of the new line denon threads. You've made it painfully obvious more times than I can think of that you hate the new line. And that's fine, but you troll all the new denon threads just to crap on how bad they are. We get it, but I don't understand it. There are a slew of headphones that I truly don't like, and I will make it known I don't like them. Then I leave it alone. You don't see me in many hd-800s, or othere headphone threads that I don't care for because it's not worth my time. You post on these denon threads more than anyone else, including people  who actually love them. So I'm wondering what's the point of continually beating a dead horse. You hate them, we have known that for several months. Why devote so much energy trolling these threads just to keep bashing them to death? I'm just trying to understand.

 
If you had read through the thread you would notice that a few pages back someone asked a question. By your logic, why would anyone post in a headphone thread that they like the headphone more than once? Well, they did, and I felt it important to help a consumer make a good decision on headphones and not toss money out. There is a difference between disliking a headphone for personal taste, and a disliking it because it is a technically lacking headphone. I don't post in HD800 threads, LCD-2 threads,  etc. discussing why I dislike them for their sound sig. 
 
Also, I don't think you know what a troll is.
 
Quote:

LOL, it's just a difference of opinion really.  elwappo99's been around so I don't think he's so much trolling as trying to tell what he feels is a cautionary tale.  BTW elwappo, innocent question here.  But if the following conditions still existed:
 

1. Denon named them the D700 instead of the D7100
2. Denon still offered the old line (D2K, D5K, D7K)
    

Then would you still be as upset about the D7100?

 
It's a fair question to ask.
 
I'm not upset about the D7100 as a type of 'pride' for Denon. The above want to make this out as a bunch of Dx000 fanboys hating on the next thing, which isn't the case. I have a pair of D7000 that I purchased for a very low price. I like them, but you won't see me raving about them anywhere. As an audiophile headphone, they are quite capable, and we could have a discussion about the sound and whether it fits your personal taste over in a D7000 thread. I didn't see the Denon label on the old line as anything more than a major brand endorsing headphones. The same headphone line continues in the Fostex line, and I have no attachments to the Denon brand. 
 
If Denon had named these D700 and/or still offered their own line, my opinions would not change. I'm not "upset" or "disappointed" that these were positioned as a D7000 successor. In fact, I'm not "upset" at all. I am only trying to inform people before a very expensive purchase.
 
When I first joined head-fi these critiques of headphones and other audio equipment were common. People would discuss the technical aspects of a headphone in depth and banter back and forth. More and more people get upset and offended when you point out the technical flaws. It seems more people now adays are interested in defending their latest purchase then pursuing audio performance.