[Duun]

Maybe this is a obvious thing discussed before but the x7 has (or had) known issues with the usb 3.0 connection. Connect it only to usb 2.0 to avoid distortion, pops and crackles.

Yes tried that in multiple ways never helped in my case

 

[ShaggyRS6]

I had hissing with my old sound card. I got the Ebtech Hum eliminator. Never had a pop his or fart since!

 

[Lunatics]

For shooters like pubg honestly the best thing I ever did was start playing that game with simple stereo, direct mode. Seems counterintutive I know but pubg and many fps type games perform best with their own vss built in and adding 5.1 or eax on x7 just messes the audio up.
While Sennheiser 650 is good I am sure, alot of X7 users(including myself) feel the Philip's Fidelio X2 or X2HR is a good matchup as well.

Yeah this is something I was trying to bring some discussion to in this thread because I feel this seems to be the general consensus most places I go or people I talk to about gaming audio (at least at a higher level in CS), yet I feel like people who have or use their positional audio whether it's gaming headphones with its own software or USB soundcard, or if it's a bigger more serious device like this, all seem to stand by it and using and defending the virtual surround sound where as most other places I go or talk to people seem to be completely against it and stand by stereo sound with good quality hardware to back it up. Definitely not trying to start and argument or disagreement but wanted to try and have a serious talk about it because like Duun says, I feel like I notice a lot of audio issues when trying to use it in CS or PUBG and things sounding off or not really too accurate, yet I do have to say that when playing a game like WoW or maybe a more "single player" esque immersive game, the positional audio really does seem to stand out and mostly seems to have issues in games where you really think it would help or make the most sense to have.

Didn't end up testing at all this weekend but I will look into turning the surround down on my X7 and playing some FPS soon as well as disabling it completely.

Edit: Also I know some PCs advertise having "DAC dedicated" USB ports on them. On my newest PC these appear to all be USB 3.0 however I have used these "dedicated" ports on my last 2 desktops and never had any sort of issue with my X7, as well as using my X7 in my laptop over USB 3.0. Don't know if it's possible that your unit itself is the issue?

 

[Evshrug]

@Lunatics,
One of the worst things is “double dipping” in surround processing. Long story short, it’s possible and even easy these days to mess up the effect by processing it twice. I don’t have PUBG for PC, but I do have Battlefield 3 which has it’s own setting for headphone surround, Overwatch with a headphone mode featuring Dolby Atmos Surround for headphones, even StarCraft II has a headphone surround option. I currently play a lot of PUBG Mobile on my iPad, and that has a headphone surround mode that can not be disabled.

A Head Related Transfer Function, or HRTF, is the actual industry term for the algorithm that considers an angle of sound reaching your head, and how your head will interact with it by the time the sound enters your two ears. Take whatever sound direction angles you want (for example the 7 angles of 7.1 surround), apply the HRTF algorithm, and the result is a 2-Channel Binaural sound that sounds like surround in headphones. Creative SBX, Dolby Headphone or Atmos Headphone, Darin Fong’s Out Of Your Head, Sennheiser Binaural Engine, and Smyth Virtual Surround are all brand name examples of applying an HRTF to directional sound angles to create a binaural result.

What happens sometimes, now that games are trying to use their own HRTFs, is that we take the first binaural result and feed it a second time through another HRTF (like SBX in the X7), which assumes the 2-channel audio is like a set of stereo speakers in front of you and applies an HRTF assuming something like a 30° angle for all sounds. This destroys rear imaging and confuses frontal imaging cues.

External processors like the X7 are usually more sophisticated and accurate than the HRTFs used in games, and often the external processors allow some degree of customization. They also are able to be used with every game, where as game developers don’t always spend the money and time integrating a binaural output option. That said, the X7’s HRTF is still based on a generic head shape, and your head may be different enough that even adjusting the strength of the surround effect won’t result in a “3D” effect for you.

 

[raband]

your head may be different enough that even adjusting the strength of the surround effect won’t result in a “3D” effect for you.

That's me.

Rear cues are great on most VSS solutions, but when it comes to the front 180 degrees it ends in a muddy, out of phase mess inside my head.

Senn GSX1000 is by far the best solution I've found so far - probably get to 30-45 degrees from my ears before the mess takes over.

Am crossing my fingers that the head tracking on the Mobius will go a long way towards fooling my brains/ears into hearing the frontal cues even closer to straight ahead, with my entire trust being in the Smyth A16 solving all my issues when it finally turns up (will just give up my search if that one doesn't satisfy)

 

[Lunatics]

@Lunatics,
One of the worst things is “double dipping” in surround processing. Long story short, it’s possible and even easy these days to mess up the effect by processing it twice. I don’t have PUBG for PC, but I do have Battlefield 3 which has it’s own setting for headphone surround, Overwatch with a headphone mode featuring Dolby Atmos Surround for headphones, even StarCraft II has a headphone surround option. I currently play a lot of PUBG Mobile on my iPad, and that has a headphone surround mode that can not be disabled.

A Head Related Transfer Function, or HRTF, is the actual industry term for the algorithm that considers an angle of sound reaching your head, and how your head will interact with it by the time the sound enters your two ears. Take whatever sound direction angles you want (for example the 7 angles of 7.1 surround), apply the HRTF algorithm, and the result is a 2-Channel Binaural sound that sounds like surround in headphones. Creative SBX, Dolby Headphone or Atmos Headphone, Darin Fong’s Out Of Your Head, Sennheiser Binaural Engine, and Smyth Virtual Surround are all brand name examples of applying an HRTF to directional sound angles to create a binaural result.

What happens sometimes, now that games are trying to use their own HRTFs, is that we take the first binaural result and feed it a second time through another HRTF (like SBX in the X7), which assumes the 2-channel audio is like a set of stereo speakers in front of you and applies an HRTF assuming something like a 30° angle for all sounds. This destroys rear imaging and confuses frontal imaging cues.

External processors like the X7 are usually more sophisticated and accurate than the HRTFs used in games, and often the external processors allow some degree of customization. They also are able to be used with every game, where as game developers don’t always spend the money and time integrating a binaural output option. That said, the X7’s HRTF is still based on a generic head shape, and your head may be different enough that even adjusting the strength of the surround effect won’t result in a “3D” effect for you.

So I know in CS I would always set my audio in game to "5.1 speakers" and that would typically enable their HRTF surround sound stuff, should I just be leaving my setting at "Stereo Headphones" and letting the X7 handle the rest of everything? PUBG I never set anything specific up but I noticed in the settings they do have a HRTF option for enemy guns which is turned on by default. I think CS was really my biggest gripe and game I had issues with so I have tried setting it to stereo headphones in game, as well as turning the surround in the creative software down to about 65% and will give this a shot and see how things sound, unless you think I should leave CS at 5.1

 

[Evshrug]

So I know in CS I would always set my audio in game to "5.1 speakers" and that would typically enable their HRTF surround sound stuff, should I just be leaving my setting at "Stereo Headphones" and letting the X7 handle the rest of everything? PUBG I never set anything specific up but I noticed in the settings they do have a HRTF option for enemy guns which is turned on by default. I think CS was really my biggest gripe and game I had issues with so I have tried setting it to stereo headphones in game, as well as turning the surround in the creative software down to about 65% and will give this a shot and see how things sound, unless you think I should leave CS at 5.1

I see you having three options:

1.)Windows and CS:Go set to “5.1” (or 7.1 if it was an option) and X7 set to “SBX - On” — this would give you Creative’s binaural result.

2.) CS:GO set to “Stereo Headphones,” X7 set to “SBX - Off” — this would either result in using CS:Go’s HRTF, or more likely plain stereo with no attempt at positioning other than where it would fall between left and right (imagine a 1D line, that runs straight between your ears, positions can only be placed along that line, and that’s traditional stereo).

3.) try a different DSP, either something software based that runs on your PC like Darin Fong’s Out Of Your Head software, or buying an external DSP like Sennheiser GSX 1000, and seeing if these other HRTF algorithms are more to your liking.

I know you said it seems like other people hear positional sounds much better than you, but for all of CS’ eSports popularity, it doesn’t have the best sound design. The convolution and occlusion effects built into the game are very unsophisticated (meaning that telling distance and precise angle even with 5 real speakers wouldn’t be all that realistic), and at its core, 5.1 speaker setups are arranged with the center speaker and two flanking speakers at the front, and then the “surround” speakers are placed directly to your side without being behind you at all. The other people “hearing” positions better, they may heave good ears combined with an intuitive sense of the map, what they see, and where people could be at a certain time, and their brains are being clever to fill in the gaps of available purely audio information.

 

[Evshrug]

That's me.

Rear cues are great on most VSS solutions, but when it comes to the front 180 degrees it ends in a muddy, out of phase mess inside my head.

Senn GSX1000 is by far the best solution I've found so far - probably get to 30-45 degrees from my ears before the mess takes over.

Am crossing my fingers that the head tracking on the Mobius will go a long way towards fooling my brains/ears into hearing the frontal cues even closer to straight ahead, with my entire trust being in the Smyth A16 solving all my issues when it finally turns up (will just give up my search if that one doesn't satisfy)

Head tracking does help to some extent. Someone was trying to argue that we don’t move our heads while we watch TV or play games... but typically, we instinctively do, at least a little bit. You know how people cock their heads to listen better, lean in at intense moments, compensate for our chair spinning a bit between us or our neck getting stiff... we even make little micro adjustments in head position throughout the day. At the very least, when a sound is playing, you can move your head slightly to hear it pan it’s position a bit to help improve the impression of frontal cues.

 

[raband]

At the very least, when a sound is playing, you can move your head slightly to hear it pan it’s position a bit to help improve the impression of frontal cues.

That's what I'm betting the farm on lol

 

[Duun]

Yeah this is something I was trying to bring some discussion to in this thread because I feel this seems to be the general consensus most places I go or people I talk to about gaming audio (at least at a higher level in CS), yet I feel like people who have or use their positional audio whether it's gaming headphones with its own software or USB soundcard, or if it's a bigger more serious device like this, all seem to stand by it and using and defending the virtual surround sound where as most other places I go or talk to people seem to be completely against it and stand by stereo sound with good quality hardware to back it up. Definitely not trying to start and argument or disagreement but wanted to try and have a serious talk about it because like Duun says, I feel like I notice a lot of audio issues when trying to use it in CS or PUBG and things sounding off or not really too accurate, yet I do have to say that when playing a game like WoW or maybe a more "single player" esque immersive game, the positional audio really does seem to stand out and mostly seems to have issues in games where you really think it would help or make the most sense to have.

Didn't end up testing at all this weekend but I will look into turning the surround down on my X7 and playing some FPS soon as well as disabling it completely.

Edit: Also I know some PCs advertise having "DAC dedicated" USB ports on them. On my newest PC these appear to all be USB 3.0 however I have used these "dedicated" ports on my last 2 desktops and never had any sort of issue with my X7, as well as using my X7 in my laptop over USB 3.0. Don't know if it's possible that your unit itself is the issue?

Yes I used to have another rig that had dedicated USB port for audio devices and the X7 behaved much better. Unfortunately I am stuck with the new rig which is more powerful but lacking dedicated audio usb. My solution to use optical and the x7 is not optimal and is a workaround. Merely suggesting it to others in similar setups.

Hope you had a chance to try pubg in direct mode stereo and wondered what you thought. To me it sounded better but sound is a subjective thing.

 

[Duun]

So I know in CS I would always set my audio in game to "5.1 speakers" and that would typically enable their HRTF surround sound stuff, should I just be leaving my setting at "Stereo Headphones" and letting the X7 handle the rest of everything? PUBG I never set anything specific up but I noticed in the settings they do have a HRTF option for enemy guns which is turned on by default. I think CS was really my biggest gripe and game I had issues with so I have tried setting it to stereo headphones in game, as well as turning the surround in the creative software down to about 65% and will give this a shot and see how things sound, unless you think I should leave CS at 5.1

Not trying to hijack the post but I have a suggestion. Explore if CS has built in surround. If it does(like pubg) you have the option of simply utilizing x7 direct mode. Unless you can turn off surround In CS(like pubg) you might be pleasantly surprised. As was said, the worst thing you can do for sound is have two surround algorithms stacked on top of one another.

 

[acygni]

Hum Interesting. Thanks.

 

[illram]

Anyone dealt with random lower volume for line-outs? I have an iFi ICAN SE hooked up to my X7 and I remember it being perfectly fine at about 1/4 dial on the volume. Tonight, for no reason I can tell whatsoever, I had to crank it up past halfway. Volume is set at 100% on the lineout, I tried toggling headphones on/off, etc.

 

[tmaxx123]

Has anyone been able to get more then 44.1 /48 kHz out of the host usb ? My iPod Touch with onkyo hf player seems limited for some reason by the x7. Pc plays higher bit rate, without issues.

 

[slayer6288]

Quick question for you all. So despite it being under the speakers portion of settings in the x7 control panel it seems to have an effect on the positional sound in a good way to select Front left right surround left right center and sub as speakers in here when using headphones. Now I notice there are also options for full range for the front and surround speakers. Usually with a 5.1 system with speakers usually you leave the speakers as small or without full range selected when using a sub. Since this is emulation to a pair of headphones do you guys enable full range for the front and surround speakers in this setting or leave it off?