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Originally Posted by Trapper32 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Just wondering what seems to be "to (sp) good to be true" about this amp? I reread the thread and there are 7 members that give high praise for this amp based on personal experience. Your "valid counterpoint" is based on one "friends" opinion...and he hasn't expressed just what he found so "very underwhelming" as of yet.
I find it interesting that the first mention of a "giant killer" I believe is in your own post #49 "Everyone is ready to proclaim the CI giant killer status based on one persons apparent dissatisfaction that his more expensive amp isnt that much better then the CI with AKG 701's." I think that may be a bit of hyperbole. The members of this forum that expressed an opinion of the CI amp were doing so based on personal experience and not as you state "based on one person's apparent dissatisfaction" And has anyone let alone everyone proclaimed it "giant killer status"?
In that same post #49 you state "I broke up the SP negativity even if doing so was inadvertant. Because, what certain people really seem to want is not for the CI to be really good. But, to be able to claim the SP is not that great."
I don't agree. I think the tone of this whole thread is just how good the CI amp is (well, except for your friend) . I think everyone also agrees that the SP is a very good amp. Offhand I don't recall anyone putting the SP down...maybe you can point them out for me.
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Here we go again .... someone gets off track and everyone follows. The whole tone of the post WAS how good the CI is claimed to be. As I said before I never commented on the OP's opinion. That was their opinion. I understand the issues was that the SP was not that much better in the OP's opinion but cost considerably more.
But, when I commented on my friends experiences that was somehow construed as protecting SP; when my post had nothing to do with SP .... and a whole sidebar developed because everyone jumped on one posters misinterpretation.
This comment started the ball rolling immediately after I originally posted ....
However, if an amp is pitted against an SP amp, a small army starts to gang up to protect the latter. It is as if it is totally inconceivable that another amp brand could be as enjoyable, nevertheless surpass, the SP. I am not talking about "technical" superiority of the amplifiers (although that may be a factor for many); simply the enjoyment thereof. It is also as if one person saying they enjoyed amp X more than an SP amp they tried, they've stepped on someone's turf/toes.
followed by this one ....
Of course SP are great amps, but you should be able to say they are not great amps without being treated like you just burnt a cross in a church. The OP of this thread had another thread that questioned the rising costs of SP amps, and the replies that followed would make you think a mortal sin has been committed.
Eventually I responded ....
I find it interesting, if you read all the posts in this thread, no one is defending SP. No one said the OP was wrong. Almost all the discussion centered on the CI amp itself or its discrete op amp topology.
The only post questioning the OP's assertion about the CI's goodness was me .... and that had nothing to do with SP.
But guess what? Despite my attempt at clarification .....
sacd lover, I'm not sure why you are being so defensive about SP. I haven't gone back to read all from the beginning today, but the way I read this discussion is that Singlepower is the top of the heap, the gleaming perfection that all others would hope to attain. Of course that comes at a price.
So, yes, SP was not the subject and it certainly was not mine.
As for the CI, I posted my friends opinion because the opinion was relevant. As I said, you see FOTM's develope from these type threads all the time. Many times I dont know anything about the product in question so I dont post. But, I had several lengthy discussions with my friend about his dissatisfaction with the CI and I was very clear on his opinion. I was skeptical and remain skeptical the CI is a "giant killer" as I termed the amp in relation to any amp .... not just SP. By the way, greggf did state ....
I think the problem may be that the VHP-2 truly is a giant-killer. It has gotten me to stop expensive rotation of equipment, to stop and take an extended listen.
Next, the comments I made about the SP PPX3 were also relevant. We had on person saying the liked the CI nearly as well as a MPX3. But, my friend liked the Gilmore Lite, a similarly priced SS amp .... better. Plus, he liked a PPX3, which is the SP entry level amp and generally acknowledged to NOT be up to the MPX3's performance level better than both the CI and Lite. I thought this perspective added some balance to the assessment of the CI.
That an inexpensive chip amp was deemed "almost as good" compared to an expensive tube amp IS interesting. But, I had knowledge that ran directly in contrast to that opinion where a similarly priced SS amp the Lite was deemed better .... and that an entry level amp from the same manufacturer of the expensive tube amp was deemed superior to both SS units. Moreover, I know Glenn and how seriously he listens and evaluates his equipment so I trust his opinion. But, after I pass on the info it seems everyone missed the whole point and goes on about how SP cant be criticized or SP is protected.
back to my original post I summarized ....
So, on one hand we have a member who feels the CI was almost as good as a much more expensive MPX3. On the other hand, we have an experienced member who definitely preferred a similarly priced Gilmore Lite/ DPS to the CI Audio VHP-2.... and who overwhelmingly preferred a $425 used PPX3 to both.
This information should have given people food for thought rather than an excuse to attack.
