Had an interesting conversation at a dealer yesterday. I used my Mojo 2 as a DAC and was trying a few headphone amps. I really struggled to hear any benefit/difference as I went through a solid state, hybrid and full tube amp other than a slightly different presentation.
I'm starting to think that, assuming the Mojo 2 is capable of driving your particular headphones to a level well above your normal listening level, adding an amp can only make things worse or different. It can't make it 'better', for example by widening the soundstage or adding more detail.
What do you think and if you think an amp can add detail, would it not be an illusion created by a shift in overall frequency curve, thereby revealing details that were there in the first place but somewhat masked by other frequencies?
I can understand that in some cases, bass response, extension, control might improve but as I said, making the assumption that the Mojo 2 can drive your headphones properly with plenty of headroom, can an amp actually 'add' anything?
Had an interesting conversation at a dealer yesterday. I used my Mojo 2 as a DAC and was trying a few headphone amps. I really struggled to hear any benefit/difference as I went through a solid state, hybrid and full tube amp other than a slightly different presentation.
I'm starting to think that, assuming the Mojo 2 is capable of driving your particular headphones to a level well above your normal listening level, adding an amp can only make things worse or different. It can't make it 'better', for example by widening the soundstage or adding more detail.
What do you think and if you think an amp can add detail, would it not be an illusion created by a shift in overall frequency curve, thereby revealing details that were there in the first place but somewhat masked by other frequencies?
I can understand that in some cases, bass response, extension, control might improve but as I said, making the assumption that the Mojo 2 can drive your headphones properly with plenty of headroom, can an amp actually 'add' anything?
Does Chord make headphones?
Does Rob Watts design anything remotely transducer wise?
He designs the Digital side of things and some analogue bits to go with them, so he tries to design the best he can in his own field.
Let those who are in transducer/headphone design circles, such as Dr. Olive worry about that aspect of the chain.
Your argument is like saying, all the technology that goes into modern cars is of little importance, because we drive them over roads with pot-holes and under a speed limit!
You got issues with headphone design, drop their designers a post or two and complain.
If you see how wildly headphones and IEMs measure, like speakers, you will see why AutoEQ and oratory1990 and crinacle's PEQ generating site are popular
Would be great to stick such EQ in a Mobile Joy device connected to iPhone
Mojo2's EQ is way too limited when you consider those EQ sources I mentioned
That's where we differ. I don't chase measurements or corrections to measurements. Don't like a manufacturers/designers headphone tuning or sound? Don't buy it. Other factors including burst decay and cup resonance aren't reflected in FR. It's a big rabbit hole to fall down. It's easy to start listening to equipment instead of music. No thanks.
I understand that everyone hears different and things like pinna gain and ear/ear canal shape affect sound. But its a far cry from how a speaker in a large room with furniture is affected. If Chord offered room correction on their 2 channel products, I could see a route to scaling it down to their two channel products.
This makes the point for the need for slight EQ tweaks to the sound. These are still 5 distinct headphones and any one measurement from each will pretty much separate them into 5 (maybe a couple of exceptions). So, if you like that frequency response, you are well within your rights to tune it a bit to get the designers desired tuning or your preference for your head!
Had an interesting conversation at a dealer yesterday. I used my Mojo 2 as a DAC and was trying a few headphone amps. I really struggled to hear any benefit/difference as I went through a solid state, hybrid and full tube amp other than a slightly different presentation.
I'm starting to think that, assuming the Mojo 2 is capable of driving your particular headphones to a level well above your normal listening level, adding an amp can only make things worse or different. It can't make it 'better', for example by widening the soundstage or adding more detail.
What do you think and if you think an amp can add detail, would it not be an illusion created by a shift in overall frequency curve, thereby revealing details that were there in the first place but somewhat masked by other frequencies?
I can understand that in some cases, bass response, extension, control might improve but as I said, making the assumption that the Mojo 2 can drive your headphones properly with plenty of headroom, can an amp actually 'add' anything?
It's not mutually exclusive. The Mojo2 sounds excellent directly driving transducers. It also unleashes the amplifiers potential and therefore sounds excellent driving transducers. The illusion of soundstage and details is fairly complex and comes down to partially synergy of the components. The Mojo2 sounds incredible paired with a good OTL tube amp. The system objectively will measure probably terrible, but it will sound immersive and tonally amazing. Yet another person will think the total opposite.
It's also not just headroom but ability to provide current. Playing a headphone loud is different than driving a headphone properly loud. Mojo2 is excellent in that regard but isn't the best choice for power hungry planars like the 1266TC or Susvara. Nor for the HE-5 or the like will it be ideal. For the greater majority of headphones and iems, Mojo2 should perform well.
;TLDR
If you want to pair an amp with the Mojo2, great. Otherwise the Mojo2 does amazing in its own.
Had an interesting conversation at a dealer yesterday. I used my Mojo 2 as a DAC and was trying a few headphone amps. I really struggled to hear any benefit/difference as I went through a solid state, hybrid and full tube amp other than a slightly different presentation.
I'm starting to think that, assuming the Mojo 2 is capable of driving your particular headphones to a level well above your normal listening level, adding an amp can only make things worse or different. It can't make it 'better', for example by widening the soundstage or adding more detail.
What do you think and if you think an amp can add detail, would it not be an illusion created by a shift in overall frequency curve, thereby revealing details that were there in the first place but somewhat masked by other frequencies?
I can understand that in some cases, bass response, extension, control might improve but as I said, making the assumption that the Mojo 2 can drive your headphones properly with plenty of headroom, can an amp actually 'add' anything?
I second your results. I used Mojo 2 as a DAC into a Ferrum Oor and, frankly, it sounded worse than the Mojo itself, or a different DAC/Amp combo by itself.
I don’t think Mojo serves well as a standalone DAC. I also think Chord DACs are easily steamrolled by powerful amps. If you go with Chord, I feel like you have to use Chord end-to-end for full benefit.
I second your results. I used Mojo 2 as a DAC into a Ferrum Oor and, frankly, it sounded worse than the Mojo itself, or a different DAC/Amp combo by itself.
I don’t think Mojo serves well as a standalone DAC. I also think Chord DACs are easily steamrolled by powerful amps. If you go with Chord, I feel like you have to use Chord end-to-end for full benefit.
I agree with both of you. But that’s the thing, staying with Chord also limits the headphone choices because of their character and drivability. I wonder if they will ever make a headphone.
I agree with both of you. But that’s the thing, staying with Chord also limits the headphone choices because of their character and drivability. I wonder if they will ever make a headphone.
I don’t think they will ever make a headphone. And although I agree that Chord has a unique sound, I think they pair well with many types of headphones I’ve tried including Focals, DCA, and HIFIMAN, all which have paired fantastically with Chord, albeit with Chord’s sound signature of utmost detail and lighter low-end.
Very interesting readings and experiences. By now I ordered a v550, hopefully it doesn't mask anything coming from Mojo2. Let's see, if the violectric does worsen anything sitting in between Mojo2 and my headphones, be it so, I'm gonna spend my budget on a new headphones, no power hungry hifiman, "only" a Grado, whose rolled-off lows and over sparkling highs can (easily) be addressed with Mojo2’s transparent EQ
Or is there any Device for headphones/Mojo2 in between Mojo2/Poly and €2.5k inside the Chord universe? As far as I am aware of Hugo M Scaler requires €4.5 K new…
I don’t think they will ever make a headphone. And although I agree that Chord has a unique sound, I think they pair well with many types of headphones I’ve tried including Focals, DCA, and HIFIMAN, all which have paired fantastically with Chord, albeit with Chord’s sound signature of utmost detail and lighter low-end.
I agree with you. However, (for me) my two favorite headphones HD800S and Susvara didn't pair well with Chord - but that's ok! I like my HD600 and Moondrop Kato with the Mojo 2 and that's good enough for me. The DAVE which would be my "dream" DAC can't drive the Susvara and the pairing with HD800s I have heard repeatedly that the Sennheiser is too lean for the sound character of the DAVE (also there is a resolution gap let's say between the HD800s and Susvara). So I had to stay away from the higher Chord models. But really like what Chord does in general
It's not mutually exclusive. The Mojo2 sounds excellent directly driving transducers. It also unleashes the amplifiers potential and therefore sounds excellent driving transducers. The illusion of soundstage and details is fairly complex and comes down to partially synergy of the components. The Mojo2 sounds incredible paired with a good OTL tube amp. The system objectively will measure probably terrible, but it will sound immersive and tonally amazing. Yet another person will think the total opposite.
It's also not just headroom but ability to provide current. Playing a headphone loud is different than driving a headphone properly loud. Mojo2 is excellent in that regard but isn't the best choice for power hungry planars like the 1266TC or Susvara. Nor for the HE-5 or the like will it be ideal. For the greater majority of headphones and iems, Mojo2 should perform well.
;TLDR
If you want to pair an amp with the Mojo2, great. Otherwise the Mojo2 does amazing in its own.
Funny you say that about OTL amps. I tried the Feliks Audio Elise and although the output is quoted as 200mW, it played far louder and smoother and more impactufullywith my HEKSE than either the hybrid or the SS amp I tried.
Funny you say that about OTL amps. I tried the Feliks Audio Elise and although the output is quoted as 200mW, it played far louder and smoother and more impactufullywith my HEKSE than either the hybrid or the SS amp I tried.
There is something about OTL amps that needs to be taken into account.
OTL amps are Current Amplifiers.
That means, theoretically and upto their max current capability, the power goes up as load impedance goes up. SSD amps, standard tube amps with transformers are the opposite, as they are Voltage Amplifiers!
A voltage amplifier's output increases as the load impedance decreases, again upto their max current capability (can't escape that).
Examples:
- OTL amp with rated power output of 200mW at 20 ohms, will output 400mW into a 40 ohm load & 100mW into a 10 ohm load.
- SSD amp with rated power output of 200mW at 20 ohms, will output 100mW into a 40 ohm load & 400mW into a 10 ohm load.
That is all else being equal, under theoretical conditions.
OTL amps feeding transducers of varying impedances, will affect the tone, SSD amps won't. (inside their operating zones).
This could explain why you had such an experience.
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
