[Dragon Leader]

The what hifi article wasn’t comparing the AK to the Hugo2 though, just other DAPs, not to say they aren’t close but that last sentence isn’t necessarily applicable to the AK vs the Hugo2.
Having said that I agree that making an investment of that nature without hearing both is a real risk.

I read that article as well and it was very positive about the SP2000 but it is true it does not compare it to the Hugo2.
I can't find any reviews that directly compare them.
Appreciate the advice regarding spending a bunch of money blindly. I know the Hugo2 quite well had it here for 2 weeks and will borrow it from a dear friend again. Anyone that owns both? Looking forward to more insights.

 

[Boldakov]

Dear Hugo 2 owners - I need your advice, not really about the Hugo, but about a headphone.

I recently bought Focal Clears as my first serious headphone, after I have only bought IEMs in the past years. I am burning them in for a week now, listening to them for some time every day. Somehow I am a little disappointed, and after listening to the Clears through the H2, the Mojo and the HiBy R3 DAP which I usually only use as digital transport I am also confused.

Hotel of California is a good example.
With the H2 the Clears sound a little muffled, especially vocals show it. They are pushed back, bass guitar is bleeding or overpowering them.
With the Mojo the sound is a bit smoother, vocals come through a little better as the bass lines are softer and not as forward, treble is also a bit smoother.
The HiBy R3 sounds quite a bit brighter, not as clean as the Mojo, but the brighter signature helps the vocals as well.
It's really not easy to describe, sometimes they sound really good, sometimes I really long for a more open and clear, lighter, airier sound.

The only explanation I can think of is that the Focal Clears are a bad pairing with the H2. Either because of their punchiness paired with the H2's energy and drive, making it too
intense. Or an impedance issue.

Now my reference are mostly IEMs and I understand that IEMs and headphones sound very different.
But I also listened to the HD800S a few weeks ago and found them to sound very open, detailed and clear with the H2, if a bit intense and sharp at times.
The soundstage was also really impressive, very big, good for classical!
Another reference I have is a quite good stereo system with the CHORD 2Qute DAC, a €5000 integrated amp and custom speakers. Sounds different again, but like the IEMs the stereo has a transparent and flowing sound, the Focal Clear a bit more focused and maybe compressed? A bit velvety, or slightly veiled?

I have a few days left to decide whether to keep or return them, and reading what I just wrote I think I should.
What headphones up to €1000 (also used) would you recommend if I am looking for a smooth, transparent, detailed and layered sound with very good soundstage?
Comfort and low weight would be additional requirements.
As a reference, my best IEMs are the Sony IER-M9 and I really like them. I listen to a lot of classical music, instrumental, vocal, some classic rock, pop, latin etc. No real hard stuff like rap ort metal.

Thanks!

Defenetly Campfire Audio Solaris my lovely pair with Hugo 2. With Hugo 2 they are more sweety and not as dry as paired with RME ADI-2 Pro.
Campfire Audio Atlas btw reverse the scheme: crazy good with analytical RME ADI-2 while sounding too fat with Hugo 2.

 

[number1sixerfan]

Does anyone have issue using Bluetooth as an input? Got a new macbook pro and for my living room speaker setup it would be far easier to use bluetooth, but every time I've used it it's been choppy, laggy and just flat out unacceptable sound wise. (sounds perfect via every other input)

It is now near other electronics after moving the room around, but it was isolated before and same issue.. my $50 HK usb adapter is much more reliable and sounds better. Any insight would be appreciated.

 

[miketlse]

Does anyone have issue using Bluetooth as an input? Got a new macbook pro and for my living room speaker setup it would be far easier to use bluetooth, but every time I've used it it's been choppy, laggy and just flat out unacceptable sound wise. (sounds perfect via every other input)

It is now near other electronics after moving the room around, but it was isolated before and same issue.. my $50 HK usb adapter is much more reliable and sounds better. Any insight would be appreciated.

Does your macbook use Aptx?

 

[moemoney]

Interesting choice. At the end of the day it is your's to make. Maybe if you could at least hold these in your hand and have a play with them. Given how expensive they are it seems risky to decide without at least seeing and touching them in person. That way you can answer the build quality question yourself.
Is the sound quality difference huge? I doubt that very much. Who knows, the AK may even sound better. According to these people:
https://www.whathifi.com/au/reviews/astell-and-kern-aandultima-sp2000
The AK is the "Best music player we’ve heard." They have heard a lot of players so that is a solid recommendation.

I don’t know I have the AK SP1000 and it’s a good player with my JH Layda IEMs but that’s where it ends, My H2 at least to my ears is clearly better with full size headphones. And that’s with the SP1000 add on amp. But hey, thats IMHO.

 

[NickT23]

According to the specs on the site, it has Apt-X. Maybe @Mojo ideas can update the Hugo 2 before it is released?This way It can have Apt X HD which supports Hi-Res audio and better PCM playback than the orginal algorithm.

And yes Apt-X works with Tidal and Spotify I have been using it with the Hugo.

Hello, do you have Hugo 2 and have you tested Youtube and Spotify music ? If so what headphone do you test it ?

 

[number1sixerfan]

Does your macbook use Aptx?

I'll double check today. Didn't think of it. You're thinking maybe it does and I'm not leveraging it or it may not be transmitting correctly? I'm also new to bluetooth here as I've always preferred optical for everything.

 

[miketlse]

I'll double check today. Didn't think of it. You're thinking maybe it does and I'm not leveraging it or it may not be transmitting correctly? I'm also new to bluetooth here as I've always preferred optical for everything.

I was thinking that Apple devices use airplay, instead of bluetooth, so maybe your macbook may be using a third party add-in codec or similar.
Worth checking/clarifying if any settings need changing.

 

[robo24]

I'll double check today. Didn't think of it. You're thinking maybe it does and I'm not leveraging it or it may not be transmitting correctly? I'm also new to bluetooth here as I've always preferred optical for everything.

It's a bit cumbersome but easy to enable. https://www.howtogeek.com/425605/ho...-aptx-or-aac-codecs-for-bluetooth-headphones/

 

[GreenBow]

Dear Hugo 2 owners - I need your advice, not really about the Hugo, but about a headphone.

I recently bought Focal Clears as my first serious headphone, after I have only bought IEMs in the past years. I am burning them in for a week now, listening to them for some time every day. Somehow I am a little disappointed, and after listening to the Clears through the H2, the Mojo and the HiBy R3 DAP which I usually only use as digital transport I am also confused.

Hotel of California is a good example.
With the H2 the Clears sound a little muffled, especially vocals show it. They are pushed back, bass guitar is bleeding or overpowering them.
With the Mojo the sound is a bit smoother, vocals come through a little better as the bass lines are softer and not as forward, treble is also a bit smoother.
The HiBy R3 sounds quite a bit brighter, not as clean as the Mojo, but the brighter signature helps the vocals as well.
It's really not easy to describe, sometimes they sound really good, sometimes I really long for a more open and clear, lighter, airier sound.

The only explanation I can think of is that the Focal Clears are a bad pairing with the H2. Either because of their punchiness paired with the H2's energy and drive, making it too
intense. Or an impedance issue.

Now my reference are mostly IEMs and I understand that IEMs and headphones sound very different.
But I also listened to the HD800S a few weeks ago and found them to sound very open, detailed and clear with the H2, if a bit intense and sharp at times.
The soundstage was also really impressive, very big, good for classical!
Another reference I have is a quite good stereo system with the CHORD 2Qute DAC, a €5000 integrated amp and custom speakers. Sounds different again, but like the IEMs the stereo has a transparent and flowing sound, the Focal Clear a bit more focused and maybe compressed? A bit velvety, or slightly veiled?

I have a few days left to decide whether to keep or return them, and reading what I just wrote I think I should.
What headphones up to €1000 (also used) would you recommend if I am looking for a smooth, transparent, detailed and layered sound with very good soundstage?
Comfort and low weight would be additional requirements.
As a reference, my best IEMs are the Sony IER-M9 and I really like them. I listen to a lot of classical music, instrumental, vocal, some classic rock, pop, latin etc. No real hard stuff like rap ort metal.

Thanks!

I am as stuck with you over headphones. In the end I never did finally decide what full-size headphones to buy. However I did by another quirk of fate, end up with Shure KSE1200 electrostatic IEMs. Effectively I don't really feel the need for full-size headphones anymore. Shame because I think I would love some, since there are some things IEMs can't do. Like IEMs generally tend to have a smaller sound-stage. (The KSE1200 are surprisingly good at soundstage though.) The KSE1200 full-fill so much of my wishlist, I just ran out of energy even looking for full-size headphones.

I think the KSE 1200 could be described as an acquired taste though, since they took a while to fully understand. On the surface they are very good. After brain-burn-in and adjustment they are astounding, and I feel no need for any more headphones. … IEMs were never my end-goal. It just sort of happened due to me wanting some isolation and quality together.

 

[surfgeorge]

I like the Focal line. I have both the Elears and the Clears and they sound really good to me with my Hugo2 - 2go setup. The Clears are dynamic cans but I also like the warmth of the Elears with the setup. I don't hear the muffled vocals in my system. Good look on your quest for some good cans!

Thanks for your feedback, and also thanks to @Boldakov @Hooster @juansan @dontfeedphils @LCMusicLover

I drove 200km to a headphone store today and kept your feedback in mind when listening to a range of headphones.
It was clear from the beginning that I wanted to use the Hugo 2 output without an additional amplifier to preserve the Hugo's transparency. So it came down to trying different headphones and compare the Clears with them.
I first listened to Beyerdynamics T1, Hifiman Arya, Hifiman Sundara, Sennheiser HD-800S, then to the Meze Empyrean and Focal Utopia, and in the end I compared the store demo Clears with my 1 week old Clears.
To make it short, the HD-800S, Arya and Utopia were my favorites from least favorite to most favorite. HD-800S very good at some things but not an allrounder, Arya really transparent, detailed, good soundstage, really enjoyed it, just a little dark, and the Utopia was REALLY nice, very balanced, a great performing allrounder and with all the clarity I so much craved for in my Clears!
But my Clears just had this slightly compressed and strained sound, not objectively much but subjectively just something that bothered me. So I asked for the shop's well used demo Clears.
And those were sounding significantly more open, actually quite close to the Utopias! They used a different cable, and swapping the cable reduced the difference, but I suspect that my Clears are simply not completely broken in yet. So I ended up buying an upgrade cable and am looking forward to my Clears opening up even more.

@LCMusicLover - you were right about cables and Utopia - cables make a difference and Utopia sounds awesome!
@juansan - I discussed the Audeze headphones but in the end didn't get to listen to them today. I'll keep them in mind for sure.
@JaZZ - thanks for the PM. Good advice as well!

This setup is my half-century birthday gift to myself, and you all helped me to complete it.
Thank you

 

[surfgeorge]

I am as stuck with you over headphones. In the end I never did finally decide what full-size headphones to buy. However I did by another quirk of fate, end up with Shure KSE1200 electrostatic IEMs. Effectively I don't really feel the need for full-size headphones anymore. Shame because I think I would love some, since there are some things IEMs can't do. Like IEMs generally tend to have a smaller sound-stage. (The KSE1200 are surprisingly good at soundstage though.) However the KSE1200 fulfill so much of my wishlist, I just ran out of energy even looking for full-size headphones.

I think the KSE 1200 could be described as an acquired taste though, since they took a while to fully understand. On the surface they are very good. After brain-burn-in and adjustment they are astounding, and I feel no need for any more headphones. … IEMs were never my end-goal either. It just sort of happened due to me wanting some isolation and quality together.

I am with you - somehow each seem to have their strengths, but I wanted to add a good headphone to my inventory.
I still love my Sony IER-M9 after getting used to them and learning to appreciate their abilities. They also pair really well with the H2, since imaging is a strength they both share and the sharply defined notes of the Hugo 2 paired with it's driving capabilities compensate for the M9's slight lack of dynamics it has with weaker sources.
Did you try the Utopia with the H2? Pretty impressive!

 

[CaptainFantastic]

But my Clears just had this slightly compressed and strained sound, not objectively much but subjectively just something that bothered me. So I asked for the shop's well used demo Clears.
And those were sounding significantly more open, actually quite close to the Utopias! They used a different cable, and swapping the cable reduced the difference, but I suspext that my Clears are simply not completely broken in yet. So I ended up buying an upgrade cable and am looking forward to my Clears opening up even more.

Just make sure your Clears are not actually a broken unit somehow. Take advantage of the return possibility while it is still open, make sure the break in process doesn't take you past the return-by date (unless you read on the Focal Clear thread that breaking in is a thing with those particular headphones).

 

[hakunamakaka]

How was hifiman arya presentation compared to clears ? Arya is one of my choices in case things won’t work out with clear. Another goodie is lcd-x

 

[Hooster]

But my Clears just had this slightly compressed and strained sound, not objectively much but subjectively just something that bothered me. So I asked for the shop's well used demo Clears.
And those were sounding significantly more open, actually quite close to the Utopias! They used a different cable, and swapping the cable reduced the difference, but I suspext that my Clears are simply not completely broken in yet. So I ended up buying an upgrade cable and am looking forward to my Clears opening up even more.

Thanks for this, great news. When using components at the level of Hugo2 and high end headphones cables do in fact make a big difference, as you yourself have experienced. A chain is only as strong as the weakest link. It is worth devoting some time, effort and expense to find the most effective cable. A poor cable can mean that money spent on upgrading components is wasted because the cable is below standard.

Imagine spending tens of thousands on equipment and not realizing the benefits because the cables were neglected.