[GuiltyRocker]

This sums so well my thoughts. I absolutely love Amir's work on measurements. It gives us great objective baseline for comparisons and understanding about not only gear, but personal preferences as well. But many people there seem to lack scientific humility and real scientific curiosity. It's about ego and being in "inner circle" that "knows". Kind of emotional jail.

I've seen the same phenomenon elsewhere in science as well, and it's nothing new. It's so safe position for a scientist to parrot the narrative of the hegemony and not to take a risk of losing credibility due to suddenly being seen as someone "who doesn't understand". Darwin, Kopernikus, Einstein... It wasn't easy for them to challenge the paradigm.

He has shown some products that are broken, having an objective approach is also good, but to the extreme when it becomes religion then it's also ridiculous. Judging it all on SINAD and placing products on a scale based on that metric is hilarious. The message that a Cheap high-SINAD product is all you need is just flawed, especially when you disparage higher-priced products. It is what it is.

 

[AussieMick]

Even Einstein was unable to challenge the paradigm that the Universe is mechanical and deterministic - he rejected Quantum Mechanics because "God does not play games with dice"

The underlying issue here is not that measurements are useless, it's that the ones on which in audio we usually focus do not tell anything like the whole truth.

If you put a cheap transistor radio with a 1" speaker through the usual tests the results of course will be horrible.

But if you switch that radio on and and listen to a recording of a grand piano you can still easily tell that you are listening to a grand piano.

I don't think any of the measurements which we usually consider come anywhere near explaining how that is possible.

This. 100% this. Couldn’t agree more.

 

[AussieMick]

On different measurements, seem this? A bit old now, but..,interesting read

https://www.nordost.com/downloads/NewApproachesToAudioMeasurement.pdf

 

[Rayon]

Even Einstein was unable to challenge the paradigm that the Universe is mechanical and deterministic - he rejected Quantum Mechanics because "God does not play games with dice"

The underlying issue here is not that measurements are useless, it's that the ones on which in audio we usually focus do not tell anything like the whole truth.

If you put a cheap transistor radio with a 1" speaker through the usual tests the results of course will be horrible.

But if you switch that radio on and and listen to a recording of a grand piano you can still easily tell that you are listening to a grand piano.

I don't think any of the measurements which we usually consider come anywhere near explaining how that is possible.

Yes. ASR (or other similar) measurements are definitely not wrong or useless. Frequency response, noise floor, jitter, channel balance and linearity are fantastic tools. Also general relativity has it's limits, at very small scales. However, general relativity did challenge the paradigm about the nature of time and space, which in itself was a great win. All theories that can predict something reproducable have their use cases.

 

[SteveHulk]

On different measurements, seem this? A bit old now, but..,interesting read

https://www.nordost.com/downloads/NewApproachesToAudioMeasurement.pdf

A very interesting and approachable article, and I recommend it to everyone here.

 

[eric1974]

I recently upgraded from a Qutest to a Dave/M Scaler setup (with BixPower BP90 12v battery for the M Scaler) and couldn't be more pleased! All the usual adjectives about soundstage, detail, etc. all contribute to an emotionally satisfying reproduction of music. I listen to both headphones and speakers (B&W 802 D3 crossed over to two DB1D subs) and both reveal Rob's DAC accomplishments. I would appreciate anyone's insights about the questions below.

1. Right now, I use an Aurender N100H music streamer, which has USB galvanic isolation, to connect to the M Scaler which also has galvanic isolation. Upstream, I use the new English Electric EE1 ethernet noise isolator inbetween the router and the Aurender. Given the "double" galvanic isolation between the two components, and the asynchronous USB control of the M Scaler of the streamer data transfer and the M Scaler's immunity to jitter, will this configuration remove all or almost all noise into the M Scaler? Some companies, including Aurender, offer much more expensive streamers with even more advanced power supplies and designs, intended to further improve sound. Will this matter for the M Scaler/Dave?
2. I couldn't find any discussions online about whether or not the best DACs already exceed the ability of the best headphones and speakers to accurately reproduce subtle information such as small signals and fast transients. For example, can a headphone transducer or speaker cone handle the full benefit from the M Scaler/Dave? And looking at Rob's next generation of DACs, which will be even more advanced, will we be able to benefit from them given these potential limitations? And you can add in the potential limitations of other components downstream such as interconnects, preamps, amps and speaker cables--all of which will have less precision than the Chord DACs.

 

[pichler]

Hi Eric,
welcome.

We are fortunate to have chosen particularly high-performance devices and for this reason not so easy to manage as best as possible. I listen exclusively with speakers and as an amp I had chosen 1 Etude which I later realized was better to have 2 in mono. I chose rather efficient speakers with mid-high horns and the power of the amplifiers is quite adequate, it was the right choice for me, they are particularly transparent and fast, they "follow" me in every small change I make in the system. Precisely thanks to the performance of the Dave and the amp - speaker combination, based on your tastes, over time you will combine cables, sources, or other, which will lead you towards the result that comes closest to your tastes. It won't be a "painless" trip, but it will be very educational and exciting.

 

[GreenBow]

You folks have probably seen this and discussed this review and video. .. (I have not read the DAVE thread for a while, so would not know if it's already been discussed.)

https://goldensound.audio/2022/03/14/chord-dave-measurements-with-mscaler/#:~:text=-90.31dBFS 1khz sine (96khz,such as a Holo May

Figured you might like to see the content if you have not already. Personally find it hard to take seriously as he states the DAVE is no good as a headphone DAC.
There's also some critical stuff of the M-Scaler in his review.

This is the video on Youtube, that's also embedded in his website written review.




Am just saying by the way; not meaning to be inflaming anyone.

 

[nwavesailor]

I don’t follow everything Golden Sound reviews but he is a pretty big Holo May R2R fan.

It may be his preference listening to both of these DAC and that’s fine.
I have not heard the May so I have no point of reference compared to the Dave.

 

[Mr X]

You folks have probably seen this and discussed this review and video. .. (I have not read the DAVE thread for a while, so would not know if it's already been discussed.)

https://goldensound.audio/2022/03/14/chord-dave-measurements-with-mscaler/#:~:text=-90.31dBFS 1khz sine (96khz,such as a Holo May

Figured you might like to see the content if you have not already. Personally find it hard to take seriously as he states the DAVE is no good as a headphone DAC.
There's also some critical stuff of the M-Scaler in his review.

This is the video on Youtube, that's also embedded in his website written review.




Am just saying by the way; not meaning to be inflaming anyone.

As much as I absolutely love my Dave Mscaler combo, for years I didn’t rate it for headphone use and only used it via speakers.

That all changed when I recently had the caps modified in the DAVE and it totally changed my mind. I’m fact I’ve being using it daily ever since.

So I can relate to some people perhaps not liking stock DAVE for headphone use.

 

[GuiltyRocker]

As much as I absolutely love my Dave Mscaler combo, for years I didn’t rate it for headphone use and only used it via speakers.

That all changed when I recently had the caps modified in the DAVE and it totally changed my mind. I’m fact I’ve being using it daily ever since.

So I can relate to some people perhaps not liking stock DAVE for headphone use.

I never used it for headphones, I only listen by using speakers.

 

[GreenBow]

As much as I absolutely love my Dave Mscaler combo, for years I didn’t rate it for headphone use and only used it via speakers.

That all changed when I recently had the caps modified in the DAVE and it totally changed my mind. I’m fact I’ve being using it daily ever since.

So I can relate to some people perhaps not liking stock DAVE for headphone use.

Do you mean having the power supply caps made larger, so it operates a bit like a TT2.

 

[Reactcore]

Do you mean having the power supply caps made larger, so it operates a bit like a TT2.

He means the modification as described in the link 'supercharging' in my signature

 

[Mr X]

He means the modification as described in the link 'supercharging' in my signature

Correct!
I pair my DAVE with Meze Elite and Focal Stellia and prior to the Cap mods I would always prefer my Hugo2 for headphones over Dave. Not so anymore.

 

[shaylin3]

I don't know if this thread is appropriate for Cable. If it doesn't work I will delete it
"Tara Labs The 0.8 Onboard xlr Interconnect"

The sound density is extremely high, full and watery, and has a great sense of weight.
The lines of the instrument are significantly strengthened, and the high frequencies are refined and rounded.
Rich vocals, sincere emotions, very real
Although it is a copper wire, it is not dull at all and the background is extremely black.

It is not at the same level as the 1.TWL spirit II RCA and 2.Cardas clear reflection xlr that I have used before (of course the price is also very different)
The signal line characteristics of Taralabs are particularly well matched with Chord Dave, which can complement the weight and thickness.
I highly recommend giving it a try