[audio_1]

So, we are talking about a 12.5kEuro budget at list price, and you are at the top of the Chord DAC ecosystem. You may consider if there are other options from other vendors at a 12.5k price point, especially if you don't need the 2W digital amplifier built-in the DAVE.

There are no other options from other manufacturers with similar sound quality to Dave and Blu 2 or the m-scaler at any price, let alone 12.5k euro. Rob Watts is the only person doing DA conversion correctly with long tap length reconstruction filters in my opinion. People don't appear to appreciate the technology and specifications of Chord DACs or realise the sound quality that Rob has achieved. If this is not immediately apparent there is something wrong with the system that Dave and Blu 2 are being played through.

 

[sasaki99]

Thanks for the inputs. My setup is 2CH, will mainly use the Dave as a dac only. Knowing that Dac technology changes really fast like 4-5 years cycle. The Dave is on the declining stage but still it's the price benefit for second hand market. You can find the Dave at $7000 these days, adding $3000 more you could get the TT2+M-scaler which is newer technology. but idk if the newer is better tho.

 

[miketlse]

I would say it depends on what you are going to use it for. If you will always use it with an external amplifier or if the power output of the Dave is more than enough for your headphones then the transparency of the Dave is unbeaten and Dave is still better than any other option in the Chord line up including the TT2. However if you want more power either for headphones or to use direct with efficient speakers then TT2 is better, not in terms of absolute sound but in terms of it's power output.

Rob Watts has previously said that he is not even contemplating a Dave 2 at the moment because it is supreme and will remain that way for some time to come.

Just to extend this slightly for @sasaki99
Just suppose Rob was to start contemplating a Dave 2, how could he improve it?

• upscaling? at the moment the improvements in upscaling are being made using the external Blu2 and the Hugo MScaler. Rob has posted that his experiments with combining Dave plus a MScaler in one case, generate too much electrical noise. A good indicator that Dave 2 would not feature an integral MScaler - so hard to visualize any modification to the Dave upscaling, unless Rob removed all the current upscaling (to free up FPGA cores) and declared that the Dave2 would be fed by the external MScaler.
• noise shapers? Dave already has the most noise shapers in the Chord range, but it is plausible that he could add further noise shapers, just to enable Dave 2 to maintain a gap with the rest of the chord range
• output power? Dave used to be the most powerful dac, enabling it to direct drive efficient speakers, with great transparency. The TT2 has now incorporated elements of the power pulse digital amplifiers, to enable it to direct drive more inefficient/larger speakers. It is plausible that Dave 2 could also incorporate the power pulse amplifier technology
• nothing else jumps to mind

Rob has posted that even adding a usb output to the MScaler, would have added 6 months to the development/testing time.
Based on that the development/testing of Dave 2 would probably take over a year, and deliver only a small incremental improvement in functionality, mainly for owners who wanted to direct drive larger inefficient speakers.
I can understand why Rob/Chord may feel there is no great urgency to start thinking about Dave 2, when there are already enough other products/projects that need time spending on them, to produce step changes in performance/capability, eg digital amps, davina, 2go, and generate more sales.

You will be using the Dave to feed an amplifier anyway, so you would benefit little from the Dave 2 that I visualise
So no point delaying for a couple of years

 

[Triode User]

@miketlse Yes, thanks, good extra background thinking and explanation to help anyone considering buying a Dave.

 

[maxh22]

I find it interesting how even though Rob says Dave is the final word in transparency and depth resolution he is no longer bringing it along with him on trips. TT2 is now filling that role along with the new Hugo M Scaler.

Since actions speak louder than words I’m getting the hunch that either TT2 is close enough to Dave for him or he just prefers the higher power output with his portable hotel room speakers?

Anyways, I’m looking forward to TT2 vs Dave comparisons in due time before I make my choice..

 

[OK-Guy]

Max... it maybe the case that the TT2/Mscaler is more compact than Dave for Rob's travels, afterall he would have to take Blu-2 or Mscaler with him if he was taking Dave for the same sonic nirvana. It could also be the case that Rob just likes to listen to the products he's had a hand in designing... first time I heard Dave it was just a board with a load of electronics, it was awesome listening to the future in development.

 

[elviscaprice]

Also, DAVE runs off of AC. Be kind of difficult on the airplane to use mobile.

 

[Triode User]

Also, Rob gets paid for each Chord unit that is sold. TT2 and Hugo MScaler are the new kids on the block so he is bound to push them. That's not a cynical view, it's just life.

 

[ufospls2]

Hey Guys,

I got a chance to hear a piece of gear I thought I would never get my ears on today. The Chord Electronics DAVE. I’ve had both good and bad experiences with Chord, but the DAVE always fascinated me with its out there looks and the reports of awesome sound quality. My Mojo experience was both positive and negative, I really liked its sound, but the battery died, and it took me forever to get it replaced.

I have always figured sort out the headphones first, then the amp, then the DAC. However, after having to sell all my gear recently, I have decided to go the opposite direction in terms of rebuilding a set up. I had a budget set, and had to work within it. I am in the UK currently, and figured I might as well try to find a dealer of the DAVE, so I could give it a listen. I found one an hour and a half away. I was completely honest with the shop that I wouldn’t be purchasing, I just wanted to listen. They were happy to let me listen, but tempted me with an offer of their demo model. They didn’t have a price set. I asked how much they wanted for it out of sheer curiosity, and got the reply “well how much are you willing to pay.” I threw out a nonsense number, and to my utter surprise, they said yes.

To cut a long story short, I went in with an open mind, and left with an empty wallet. It has eaten up far more of my budget than I thought would go to the DAC, but…damn. I never thought I would spend this much on a DAC.

The DAVE has detail, clarity, and definition I haven’t heard before. It is actually really impressive.

I don’t want to comment too much on sound as I haven’t spent a very long time with it yet, and don’t have my favourite headphones at the moment (Abyss Phi.)

So yeah, so far? DAVE gets two thumbs up

 

[Rob Watts]

I find it interesting how even though Rob says Dave is the final word in transparency and depth resolution he is no longer bringing it along with him on trips. TT2 is now filling that role along with the new Hugo M Scaler.

Since actions speak louder than words I’m getting the hunch that either TT2 is close enough to Dave for him or he just prefers the higher power output with his portable hotel room speakers?

Anyways, I’m looking forward to TT2 vs Dave comparisons in due time before I make my choice..

There is a more pragmatic reason; chord are still testing TT2 and I need to bring a unit with me, together with my programming tool in case of updates. It's looking less likely now, as no change had been requested for some weeks now. I can then get back to carrying a Dave and the Hugo M scaler, assuming that no demos of TT2 are needed on my travels....

 

[Triode User]

Hey Guys,

I got a chance to hear a piece of gear I thought I would never get my ears on today. The Chord Electronics DAVE. I’ve had both good and bad experiences with Chord, but the DAVE always fascinated me with its out there looks and the reports of awesome sound quality. My Mojo experience was both positive and negative, I really liked its sound, but the battery died, and it took me forever to get it replaced.

I have always figured sort out the headphones first, then the amp, then the DAC. However, after having to sell all my gear recently, I have decided to go the opposite direction in terms of rebuilding a set up. I had a budget set, and had to work within it. I am in the UK currently, and figured I might as well try to find a dealer of the DAVE, so I could give it a listen. I found one an hour and a half away. I was completely honest with the shop that I wouldn’t be purchasing, I just wanted to listen. They were happy to let me listen, but tempted me with an offer of their demo model. They didn’t have a price set. I asked how much they wanted for it out of sheer curiosity, and got the reply “well how much are you willing to pay.” I threw out a nonsense number, less than units go for on the used market, and to my utter surprise, they said yes.

To cut a long story short, I went in with an open mind, and left with an empty wallet. It has eaten up far more of my budget than I thought would go to the DAC, but…damn. I never thought I would spend this much on a DAC.

The DAVE has detail, clarity, and definition I haven’t heard before. It is actually really impressive.

I don’t want to comment too much on sound as I haven’t spent a very long time with it yet, and don’t have my favourite headphones at the moment (Abyss Phi.)

So yeah, so far? DAVE gets two thumbs up

Nice!! Have fun.

 

[maxh22]

There is a more pragmatic reason; chord are still testing TT2 and I need to bring a unit with me, together with my programming tool in case of updates. It's looking less likely now, as no change had been requested for some weeks now. I can then get back to carrying a Dave and the Hugo M scaler, assuming that no demos of TT2 are needed on my travels....

Ahhhhhh makes sense. I assumed you were finished with the TT2 project long ago and you just preferred it for whatever reason.

 

[paul2qute]

I don't know how a hi-fi show can work

Just to extend this slightly for @sasaki99
Just suppose Rob was to start contemplating a Dave 2, how could he improve it?

• upscaling? at the moment the improvements in upscaling are being made using the external Blu2 and the Hugo MScaler. Rob has posted that his experiments with combining Dave plus a MScaler in one case, generate too much electrical noise. A good indicator that Dave 2 would not feature an integral MScaler - so hard to visualize any modification to the Dave upscaling, unless Rob removed all the current upscaling (to free up FPGA cores) and declared that the Dave2 would be fed by the external MScaler.
• noise shapers? Dave already has the most noise shapers in the Chord range, but it is plausible that he could add further noise shapers, just to enable Dave 2 to maintain a gap with the rest of the chord range
• output power? Dave used to be the most powerful dac, enabling it to direct drive efficient speakers, with great transparency. The TT2 has now incorporated elements of the power pulse digital amplifiers, to enable it to direct drive more inefficient/larger speakers. It is plausible that Dave 2 could also incorporate the power pulse amplifier technology
• nothing else jumps to mind

Rob has posted that even adding a usb output to the TT2, would have added 6 months to the development/testing time.
Based on that the development/testing of Dave 2 would probably take over a year, and deliver only a small incremental improvement in functionality, mainly for owners who wanted to direct drive larger inefficient speakers.
I can understand why Rob/Chord may feel there is no great urgency to start thinking about Dave 2, when there are already enough other products/projects that need time spending on them, to produce step changes in performance/capability, eg digital amps, davina, 2go, and generate more sales.

You will be using the Dave to feed an amplifier anyway, so you would benefit little from the Dave 2 that I visualise
So no point delaying for a couple of years

Wasn't it the Chord M scaler not the Hugo TT 2 that would of added six months to production to have a USB connection

 

[SearchOfSub]

I find it interesting how even though Rob says Dave is the final word in transparency and depth resolution he is no longer bringing it along with him on trips. TT2 is now filling that role along with the new Hugo M Scaler.

Since actions speak louder than words I’m getting the hunch that either TT2 is close enough to Dave for him or he just prefers the higher power output with his portable hotel room speakers?

Anyways, I’m looking forward to TT2 vs Dave comparisons in due time before I make my choice..

I hope this is the case as I will be picking up the TT2 soon!

 

[SearchOfSub]

There is a more pragmatic reason; chord are still testing TT2 and I need to bring a unit with me, together with my programming tool in case of updates. It's looking less likely now, as no change had been requested for some weeks now. I can then get back to carrying a Dave and the Hugo M scaler, assuming that no demos of TT2 are needed on my travels....

Rob Ican you do all a favor and cut the price down on the TT2? I wonder why TT2 costs $1000 more retail than TT1 when it was retail new.