[Ards]

Sonore opticalRendu, perhaps an underrated streamer?

I think so. I also use the OpticalRendu, after a long journey through many different endpoints (Innuos, dCS, Bel Canto, Auralic). During that journey I discovered the necessity of fibre ethernet in my system, making the OpticalRendu an ideal candidate as it's one of the few endpoints with SFP support. That it offers Squeezelite for Roon is a bonus. Powering mine with a Farad3 for a further boost.

 

[Slim1970]

I noticed you have a opto dx in your chain.. Can you discribe the exact changes you hear compared to using coax (maybe even Waves)?

Are you running them from batteries?

Im figuring a circuit making my own optic dual data link..

I have the Opto DX in my chain for a couple of years now. Here's a review that I read before making the move. It should give a good sense of what to expect.

https://audiobacon.net/2020/02/22/audiowise-opto-dx-the-rf-noise-killer/

 

[LucyWu]

I have been curious about the Opto-DX for a while. Is there a view on whether it's really only beneficial/good value in an Mscaler scenario? I have the SRC.DX from my computer transport feeding the DX goodness to Dave. RF is often an issue you don't know you have until you remove it!

 

[Triode User]

Hello All,

Want a cheap upgrade for Dave if you connect to a network server or stream ?
I found an extremely good improvement.

To save double posting check this out :-

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussi...utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=website#2427118

You may try these as an experiment. You will need two of these :
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B078RLXT79/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

And one fibre cable

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B088LWY3GP/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Other makes available.

"Just gone down another rabbit hole"

Hi Clive, I ordered those exact items from Amazon UK and they came the next day. In the meantime I recalled that the Cisco switch I have in my sitting room also has the same optical connections which I use to separate the whole of my hifi network from the other half of the house comprising the 4G router, various family computers and a particularly noise generating laser printer.

Normally the sitting room Cisco switch is connected to my PhoenixNET and which is then directly connected to my streamer but just to see what the new units can do I took out the PhoenixNET and connected one of the newly bought fiber media convertors to the Cisco switch via optical (using the supplied smps for power). My reaction is that it was pretty good but not as good as the PhoenixNET. The treble was bit ’splashy’ compared to when I put the PhoenixNET back in.

Then I put the little fiber media convertor back but this time I powered it with a Sean Jacobs DC4 (not the ARC6, just the ‘normal’ DC4 version). Now the sound was pretty close to the PhoenixNET. Perhaps even close enough to not tell them apart. The only trouble is that a single 5V rail DC4 itself costs more than the PhoenixNET.

So my evaluation is that the optical isolation itself is perfect in its ability to isolate noise but as per my previous experiences with dual bnc optical its success is more or less totally dependant on having very good power supplies otherwise the performance can be somewhat let down and not live up to full potential. However I have a second system and I think I will use the little optical convertors for that but I will try and find a more economical way of powering then rather than using a DC4!

​

 

[Clive101]

Hi Clive, I ordered those exact items from Amazon UK and they came the next day. In the meantime I recalled that the Cisco switch I have in my sitting room also has the same optical connections which I use to separate the whole of my hifi network from the other half of the house comprising the 4G router, various family computers and a particularly noise generating laser printer.

Normally the sitting room Cisco switch is connected to my PhoenixNET and which is then directly connected to my streamer but just to see what the new units can do I took out the PhoenixNET and connected one of the newly bought fiber media convertors to the Cisco switch via optical (using the supplied smps for power). My reaction is that it was pretty good but not as good as the PhoenixNET. The treble was bit ’splashy’ compared to when I put the PhoenixNET back in.

Then I put the little fiber media convertor back but this time I powered it with a Sean Jacobs DC4 (not the ARC6, just the ‘normal’ DC4 version). Now the sound was pretty close to the PhoenixNET. Perhaps even close enough to not tell them apart. The only trouble is that a single 5V rail DC4 itself costs more than the PhoenixNET.

So my evaluation is that the optical isolation itself is perfect in its ability to isolate noise but as per my previous experiences with dual bnc optical its success is more or less totally dependant on having very good power supplies otherwise the performance can be somewhat let down and not live up to full potential. However I have a second system and I think I will use the little optical convertors for that but I will try and find a more economical way of powering then rather than using a DC4!

​

Hi Nick,

So your Phoenix was isolated by the fiber on the Cisco. That is Fiber to Cisco, Cisco to Phoenix by ethernet, then Phoenix ethernet to steamer.

Which means if I am correct the Phoenix wizardry with the included Sean Jacobs power supplies internally is same ball park as the generic FMC with a DC4 ?

I am about to purchase a switch that has been upgraded with a new clock and other parts.

Dela
https://www.adark.co/collections/de...udiophile-network-hubs?variant=39614852431990 or

AFTERDARK. PROJECT CLAY
https://www.adark.co/collections/pr...lack-modernize-edition?variant=39397872271478

Both need an 12 volt power supply the second also needs mains input.

Any help or advice as I am using this to help isolate the Dave downstream.

 

[Reactcore]

I have the Opto DX in my chain for a couple of years now. Here's a review that I read before making the move. It should give a good sense of what to expect.

https://audiobacon.net/2020/02/22/audiowise-opto-dx-the-rf-noise-killer/

Do you also notice that 'less organic' only trade off he talks about?

Can also be due to his coax and batterypack choice.. a krisdonia uses switching inside

 

[Slim1970]

Not at all. I infuse some warmth back into my system with my Snake River Audio Boomslang BNC cables. I also use PowerAdd battery packs and Ghent DC cables as well.

 

[Triode User]

Hi Nick,

So your Phoenix was isolated by the fiber on the Cisco. That is Fiber to Cisco, Cisco to Phoenix by ethernet, then Phoenix ethernet to steamer.

Which means if I am correct the Phoenix wizardry with the included Sean Jacobs power supplies internally is same ball park as the generic FMC with a DC4 ?

I am about to purchase a switch that has been upgraded with a new clock and other parts.

Dela
https://www.adark.co/collections/de...udiophile-network-hubs?variant=39614852431990 or

AFTERDARK. PROJECT CLAY
https://www.adark.co/collections/pr...lack-modernize-edition?variant=39397872271478

Both need an 12 volt power supply the second also needs mains input.

Any help or advice as I am using this to help isolate the Dave downstream.

Hi Clive, yes you are correct - ie, ‘Phoenix was isolated by the fiber on the Cisco. That is Fiber to Cisco, Cisco to Phoenix by ethernet, then Phoenix ethernet to steamer.’

The PhoenixNET does not have a DC4 supply in it. It looks to my eyes like somewhere between a DC3 and a DC4.

So in very broad terms the fancy DC4 power supply plus generic FMC (total ~ £4,400 inc VAT) after a couple of hours listening was very approximately in the same ball park to the PhoenixNET (£2,600 inc VAT) with a lesser SJ power supply in it but with fancy circuitry. So that sort of makes the PhoenixNET look like good value even though very expensive for a switch!

Looking at what Innuos say about the NET on their web site they seem to mention noise reducing measures a lot more times than they mention the clock in it but just exactly what one can read into that I do not know.

Anway, I think what I might do for my second system is to build a DIY DC4 to use with the generic FMC that you found. Looking on Sean Jacobs website and his prices for DIY construction parts he sells DC4 regulators for £700 and DC4 rectifier/caps for £350 so one would need to add a transformer and a case. It is still a lot of money but the DC4 + FMC did good things through my Dave and Mscaler. But I have a money saving wheeze to bring the price down because I already have a second hand DC4 rectifier/cap board from an earlier bit of DIY experimenting as well as a second hand transformer and a previously used case. So I get away with just over £700 total outlay to recreate a DC4 powered generic FMC.

That was a good heads up tip you posted!!

 

[muski]

I noticed you have a opto dx in your chain.. Can you discribe the exact changes you hear compared to using coax (maybe even Waves)?

Are you running them from batteries?

Im figuring a circuit making my own optic dual data link..

To my ears the Opto-DX removed the harshness that I was getting with the stock BNC cables. More relaxed treble, stronger mid-bass, without losing any resolution—the soundstage information and transients/attacks/decay information that the M Scaler can bring out from good redbook recordings are all there. (The word "holographic" used in the Audiobacon review is spot on).

I use a battery on the R side and an LPS on the T side. Sometimes I experiment by adding an Uptone Audio Ultracap LPS-1.2 between the battery and the Opto-DX T side. It's a small difference, but I think I can hear the the "speed" of the Ultracap improving detail.

I haven't auditioned the popular Wave cables because my listening setup needed more distance between the M Scaler and DAVE (I use a 3m fiber cable with the Opto-DX).

 

[alxw0w]

My 5cents according optodx and wave storms.

I couldn't really tell the difference between them. You can find my posts comparing them somewhere here in the topic.

Alas it was hard to do fast a/b test and also my power for optodx was not fully optimized.
Bottom line you cannot go wrong with both approaches, still I believe with ultra care approach to the power side of optodx you can get better performance as it's at least in theory perfect optical isolation.

Maybe in the future I'll try combining optodx and wave storm. For now I chosen simpler route with waves.

 

[AndrewOld]

To my ears the Opto-DX took much of the harshness that I was getting with the stock BNC cables

Have I understood you correctly? You found the standard M Scalar sounded harsh, and after spending a substantial amount of money trying to fix that, there was still some harshness? That is an awful lot of money to spend to end up with a harsh sound! Might there not be an issue somewhere else in your system?

 

[Reactcore]

To my ears the Opto-DX took much of the harshness that I was getting with the stock BNC cables. More relaxed treble, stronger mid-bass, without losing any resolution—the soundstage information and transients/attacks/decay information that the M Scaler can bring out from good redbook recordings are all there. (The word "holographic" used in the Audiobacon review is spot on).

I use a battery on the R side and an LPS on the T side. Sometimes I experiment by adding an Uptone Audio Ultracap LPS-1.2 between the battery and the Opto-DX T side. It's a small difference, but I think I can hear the the "speed" of the Ultracap improving detail.

I haven't auditioned the popular Wave cables because I wanted more distance between the M Scaler and DAVE (I use a 3m fiber cable with the Opto-DX).

I hear the effect of better fluent treble and better definition already with just toslink in to HMS and out to Dave too.. with only 250k taps ofc. And nothing else connected to both units.

Is that cells without electronics in it?
I find it strange opto dx has 12v in and not 5v ttl ..seems like theres voltage conversion inside..

I cant find a picture of one inside..

 

[muski]

A couple of observations from the fiber networking rabbit hole:

1) I had an interesting exchange with Barrows at Sonore about how to best make the conversion from ethernet to optical. In my case I had an ASUS RT-AX89X router that has SFP slot, and also an SGC Transporter i9 optical that has an optical network card. Barrows suggested that both a router and a PC are "noisy" places to do conversion and suggested I try an inexpensive FMC (Fiber Media Converter) like this $20 one from Amazon powered by a decent LPS (in my case a rail on my HDPLEX LPS). He was absolutely spot on—a big improvement. But power really matters—the TP-Link SMPS sounded awful.

2) Another advantage of a separate FMC is it can plug into the PhoenixNET so it gets a cleaner/better-timed signal. Again a nice (but smaller improvement).

3) Sonore will soon be releasing a new version of its opticalModule Deluxe, a low-noise FMC. Can’t wait to hear it. Details here

 

[muski]

Have I understood you correctly? You found the standard M Scalar sounded harsh, and after spending a substantial amount of money trying to fix that, there was still some harshness? That is an awful lot of money to spend to end up with a harsh sound! Might there not be an issue somewhere else in your system?

Thanks for catching my sloppy writing—I corrected my post!

muski

 

[Triode User]

A couple of observations from the fiber networking rabbit hole:

1) I had an interesting exchange with Barrows at Sonore about how to best make the conversion from ethernet to optical. In my case I had an ASUS RT-AX89X router that has SFP slot, and also an SGC Transporter i9 optical that has an optical network card. Barrows suggested that both a router and a PC are "noisy" places to do conversion and suggested I try an inexpensive FMC (Fiber Media Converter) like this $20 one from Amazon powered by a decent LPS (in my case a rail on my HDPLEX LPS). He was absolutely spot on—a big improvement. But power really matters—the TP-Link SMPS sounded awful.

2) Another advantage of a separate FMC is it can plug into the PhoenixNET so it gets a cleaner/better-timed signal. Again a nice (but smaller improvement).

3) Sonore will soon be releasing a new version of its opticalModule Deluxe, a low-noise FMC. Can’t wait to hear it. Details here

1) you seem to report very much in line with my experience. The power supply was crucial in my comparison.
2) also agreed but I found the improvement to the PhoenixNET by doing this to be slight (sometimes slight is still worth having).