[nmatheis]

I was hoping bluetoothing to the N3 would give me better sound out of Spotify than the iPhone 7 directly, but sounds like that was a vain hope

I do find that listening to streaming music using N3 as a Bluetooth receiver does indeed sound better than just listening directly from my phone. I'm not using iPhone 7, though so ymmv...

 

[docholliday]

I was hoping bluetoothing to the N3 would give me better sound out of Spotify than the iPhone 7 directly, but sounds like that was a vain hope

Crap in = crap out. You can't get better quality than the original source (or the weakest link in the path). That's why there's so many 24/192 tracks out there that are just a gimmick - the original source recorded no data in the upper frequencies so up-res'ing the file doesn't make it better.

Nothing can replace the quality of a wire. Hence why I don't have any BT devices (other than my Qi charger communication with my phone).

 

[gLer]

Quick question - I'm really interested in this DAP but will have to order blind as it's not stocked anywhere in South Africa. Does anyone have a link (or can post a PDF) to/of the user manual, so I can at least get a better understanding of how the different features work etc.? Thx!

 

[BasilShim]

Hi, guys!

I'm really interested in this DAP, but unfortunately can't try it in my area, so I was wondering wether anybody here has tried it with FiiO E12 + ATH-ES10 and maybe can compare it to M2s or FiiO X1/3/5 II.

 

[BrianD19]

Does the N3 do gapless properly?

Does the line-out bypass any gain circuitry?

 

[waynes world]

Short answer is that Bluetooth is transmitting a digital signal, but not the one you streamed from Spotify. It has to go through a conversion into aptX (another codec), which may or may not lose data, depending on the bitrate of your stream. The digital to analogue conversion is done by N3.

Bluetooth is like 802.11. A wifi router uses radio waves to carry encoded data (tcp/ip headers and payloads of encoded data). In the same way, bluetooth uses radio waves to transmit codecs like SBC, ATRAC, and aptX. So first, for audio streams, the digital source is decoded/unpacked from the tcp/ip payload, and then re-encoded into a codec which can be transmitted by bluetooth.

Simplified for brevity and boringness. Hope that helps.

Yep, you guessed it! (and their own little amps, too). We spend all this time researching DACs and amps employed by our players, and then we go and listen through bluetooth headphones I believe this player supports the AAC (and MP3) codec, both of which should be supported by Apple over A2DP (a Bluetooth profile).

A2DP (using SBC) has limited bandwidth to around the same quality as a 256kb/s MP3. Apt-X increases the bandwidth to support closer to CD quality MP3 (around 320-360kb/s). Higher codecs such as Sony's LDAC support almost 1mb/s of bandwidth, which will allow closer to "lossless" CD quality.

There's overhead in the stream, but these are simplified quality definitions.

Very informative. Thanks. So the N3 as a bluetooth dongle would not be exactly what I was hoping for (ie I was hoping for lossless streaming), but is still pretty useful.

Note: I wanted to put the above into a spoiler, but I guess the "upgrade" doesn't allow for that.

 

[nmatheis]

@waynes world - AFAIK, lossless streaming would require WiFi. Perhaps someone can correct me?

 

[BrianD19]

Anyone? Does the N3 do gapless play properly? I assume from more reading the line-out does not bypass the amp, it seems this just isn't the case in DAPs so I'll give up on that one, but gapless play surely is simple?

 

[AudioNewbi3]

Anyone? Does the N3 do gapless play properly? I assume from more reading the line-out does not bypass the amp, it seems this just isn't the case in DAPs so I'll give up on that one, but gapless play surely is simple?

If I am not mistaken, it is only when connecting via USB and COAX does the volume seem to be adjustable. I think volume in LO should be fixed and bypass the amp section of the N3 no?

 

[chellity]

So glad I went for this audio player...haven't owned one since an OG iPod! I figured this player would be cheaper than any memory upgrade on an iphone, so I went for it. and i'm so glad I did! Puts the iphone 6 to shame. This little player is so versatile, I have a hard time complaining about it. The warm balanced sound is exactly what I wanted for my mobile set up, and it has plenty of power for lower impedance earbuds. I can only imagine what future updates will bring with a developer that actually reads the thread on their product

It sounds amazing with my Rose Masya, or tennmak cello. I went for this player over the shanling since it has a proper output impedance for my low ohm stuff, and im so glad I did.

 

[BogdanUK]

Thank you for your positive feedback on N3. I don't exactly have an scientific explanation but I do agree that N3 will sound better after 1 week of regular usage. I have experienced that myself, and several members of this thread has similar observation.

The ATH headphones are well-known for it sweat female vocal, but bass response is not its strong suit unless you are going for DJ or bass-head targeted models such as ATH-M50x. The closed wood cans can offer lots of bass relatively, but they aren't the headphones that I'll recommend if you are looking for linear, articulated, and punchy bass response. I am not sure if you are really should go for the basshead cans. From what I read, you are more bass from your ATH and something that can go lower. I would suggest you to add Meze 99Classic to your candidate list, or 99 Neo if you need something to compare against the JVC at similar price range. I haven't heard the 99Neo yet, but the 99Classic was one of the most loved headphone with Cayin DAP since I collected them at Munich High End Show 2016.

Regarding the video delay issue, I can basically claim that the problem is inevitable because N3 is using asynchronous usb transmission. I shall quote the following explanation on asynchronous USB for discussion purpose:


I would like to draw your attention to two issues:

1. the DAC’s master clock isn’t synchronized directly to any clocks within the computer
2. This clock controls the datastream from the computer to a buffer near the DA converter

In other word, the audio signal processing is deliberately "disconnected" from the computer clock but the video display remain connected to the computer clock, so the video and audio are not synchronized by nature. In addition, we need to create a data buffer in the audio circuit in order to hold the audio datastream from the computer, and the buffer will inevitably caused delays in the audio signal with reference to the non-buffered video signal.

If you must achieve audio and video synchronization, you can only do that by adding a delay in the video reproduction. Most Home Theater system will have to handle similar issue and they call it lip-sync, this can be a DSP feature in the Audio-Visual Control Center (Receiver) or a video delay adjustment in the LCD TV or projector, so please check your computer monitor to see if similar feature is in place.

Thank you Andy for taking the time to respond. The Meze 99 Classic are not really of interest to me because many people complained about comfort in their reviews. But I did find something better, in my opinion, the Audio-Technica ATH-WS1100iS Solid Bass and I read many good opinions about them. Do you have any opinion about these headphones?

 

[mashuto]

N3 and Vega

How do you feel about that pairing? I am happy in terms of the pairing itself, but I find the N3 to be hissy/buzzy when using my vegas. The N3 has less hiss/buzz with other iems I own, but the vegas just seem to pick it up a little too well.

 

[micropixel]

Been having the N3 for couple of days now. Bought it for BT play with Plantronics BB Pro 2, there's definitely sound improvement over my Samsung S7 Edge. However I found more time spent using it cabled to my Denon MM400 - they simply sound awesome together. In short - just smooth, very smooth indeed. No digital artifacts, it sounds very analogue, smooth analogue. Keeping my Questyle QP1R aside for a while now!

So Day 3 today am charging the N3 for the first time. Guess what, the divider bars for the capacitive buttons actually lit up while charging, the bars do the breathing light (correction : more like blinking, or panting; definitely not breathing lol) while charging. Which means the hardware is there for the lights. If the case I believe it is very useful to have the bars lit up whenever the screen is on, that makes aiming for the buttons easier and not to mention aesthetically attractive too. I remember reading comments in earlier part of this thread that some users wish the buttons are backlit - I guess it is good enough if we can have the bars lit! What do you say?

BTW, it's on firmware v1.1, you can see the bars lit:

 

[hung031086]

How do you feel about that pairing? I am happy in terms of the pairing itself, but I find the N3 to be hissy/buzzy when using my vegas. The N3 has less hiss/buzz with other iems I own, but the vegas just seem to pick it up a little too well.

I think they pair well. I heard hissing but not often, just a few times. I just use this combo when i go to sleep lolz.

 

[nplateau]

My N3 just arrived. Looking to download the firmware update, but the Cayin site seems to be down. Any alternative download sites?