[Erwinatm]

From my experience with Class A SET amps either with 300B or 2A3 tubes, best sound is after 1 hour and before 4 hours. After 4 hours the quality starting to degrade.

Of course it also depends on your working temperature and also the quality of the power tubes.

 

[Wes S]

From my experience with Class A SET amps either with 300B or 2A3 tubes, best sound is after 1 hour and before 4 hours. After 4 hours the quality starting to degrade.

Of course it also depends on your working temperature and also the quality of the power tubes.

Interesting, and I definitely agree with the first part and don't even start listening until about 45 min to an hour after power up. However, I have listened for longer than 4 hours tons of times on both my SET amps, and the sound stayed the exact same after that first hour of warm-up. Honestly, I usually only run the amp for 4 - 5 hours at a time, as I don't like using up my tubes and my small listening room can really heat up as well and I have to crank up the ceiling fan (external noise), but I really don't think the sound ever starts to degrade from extended hours of usage.

 

[Erwinatm]

Interesting, and I definitely agree with the first part and don't even start listening until about 45 min to an hour after power up. However, I have listened for longer than 4 hours tons of times on both my SET amps, and the sound stayed the exact same after that first hour of warm-up. Honestly, I usually only run the amp for 4 - 5 hours at a time, as I don't like using up my tubes and my small listening room can really heat up as well and I have to crank up the ceiling fan (external noise), but I really don't think the sound ever starts to degrade from extended hours of usage.

I said 1-4 hours peak performance is of course relative depends on the bias setting as well and how hard you push the amp.

My opinion is based on 2-3 amps : Audio Note Conqueror, Sun audio 2a3, Audion 845 in my speaker setup.

 

[Wes S]

I said 1-4 hours peak performance is of course relative depends on the bias setting as well and how loud listening level.

My opinion is based on 2-3 amps in my speaker setup.

. . . I see we agree to disagree on this one, and whatever floats your boat go with it.

I would love to hear what Cayin has to say about this, as I imagine they ran the amp for many hours at a time during the development process. Tubes are made to run for extended periods of time as well as the gear they go in, and just out of curiosity what exactly starts degrading after the 4 hour mark for you?

 

[mfgillia]

Interesting, and I definitely agree with the first part and don't even start listening until about 45 min to an hour after power up. However, I have listened for longer than 4 hours tons of times on both my SET amps, and the sound stayed the exact same after that first hour of warm-up. Honestly, I usually only run the amp for 4 - 5 hours at a time, as I don't like using up my tubes and my small listening room can really heat up as well and I have to crank up the ceiling fan (external noise), but I really don't think the sound ever starts to degrade from extended hours of usage.

Likewise I haven't noticed performance diminishing after 4-5 hours but rarely listen critically, non-stop for that length of time.

However, once I turn on the Cayin in the morning/afternoon I usually don't turn it off until the late evening, which is also when I tend to listen more critically for an hour or so. During this time period - i.e., late evening after the amp has been on for 8 to 12 hours, I continue to be very happy with the results since purchasing this amp and upgrading my DAC.

 

[Erwinatm]

. . . I see we agree to disagree on this one, and whatever floats your boat go with it.

I would love to hear what Cayin has to say about this, as I imagine they ran the amp for many hours at a time during the development process. Tubes are made to run for extended periods of time as well as the gear they go in, and just out of curiosity what exactly starts degrading after the 4 hour mark for you?

Bass region, especially in low bass. Less tight. Tonally the sound shifting to more dominant midrange. Sometimes you will hear a little brighter. That's perhaps because you are hearing less bass.

Input transformer is hotter than usual.

4 hours marks is in my environment, for your case might be longer because you live in colder country.

 

[Erwinatm]

Likewise I haven't noticed performance diminishing after 4-5 hours but rarely listen critically, non-stop for that length of time.

However, once I turn on the Cayin in the morning/afternoon I usually don't turn it off until the late evening, which is also when I tend to listen more critically for an hour or so. During this time period - i.e., late evening after the amp has been on for 8 to 12 hours, I continue to be very happy with the results since purchasing this amp and upgrading my DAC.

When you only turn it on without music is different. You should turn up and make the amps working.

I havent tried it on Cayin, because I can't do critical listening with headphones for more than 2 hours. I have neck problems. With my speaker setup is easier because I just sit back and relax

 

[Wes S]

Bass region, especially in low bass. Less tight. Tonally the sound shifting to more dominant midrange. Sometimes you will hear a little brighter. That's perhaps because you are hearing less bass.

Input transformer is hotter than usual.

4 hours marks is in my environment, for your case might be longer because you live in colder country.

Interesting and thanks for sharing. I had never heard of or experienced this before, so I am quite curious why this would happen? Seems to me all the gear would eventually stabilize, and then coast at the same temperature no matter how long you run it at normal listening volumes.

 

[Erwinatm]

Interesting and thanks for sharing. I had never heard of or experienced this before, so I am quite curious why this would happen? Seems to me all the gear would eventually stabilize, and then coast at the same temperature no matter how long you run it at normal listening volumes.

Yes For class AB or low watt class A (preamp) solid state amp. Some manufacturers even recommend not turn it off, PS Audio if I am not mistaken. But I don't recommend that for class A tube amps.

Unless you are willing to replace tubes faster than normal.

 

[justanut]

Bass region, especially in low bass. Less tight. Tonally the sound shifting to more dominant midrange. Sometimes you will hear a little brighter. That's perhaps because you are hearing less bass.

Input transformer is hotter than usual.

4 hours marks is in my environment, for your case might be longer because you live in colder country.

Don't forget to account for your own physiology and psychology.. I find that it's usually my ears that need a break, esp for critical listening. And frankly difficult to quantify what you mentioned, unless you're listening to the same track over and over... which I don't recommend. Enjoy the music! Cheers.

 

[Wes S]

Yes For class AB or low watt class A (preamp) solid state amp. Some manufacturers even recommend not turn it off, PS Audio if I am not mistaken. But I don't recommend that for class A tube amps.

Unless you are willing to replace tubes faster than normal.

Obviously, the tubes in tube amps get used up quicker if you just leave the amp on, but I still don't think the sound starts degrading after a few hours (1-4) of use like you are saying.

I really would love to hear what Cayin has to say about this, as I am sure they have tested this, and I imagine every show they go to the amp stays on longer than 4 hours. @Andykong any thoughts on this?

 

[Andykong]

. . . I see we agree to disagree on this one, and whatever floats your boat go with it.

I would love to hear what Cayin has to say about this, as I imagine they ran the amp for many hours at a time during the development process. Tubes are made to run for extended periods of time as well as the gear they go in, and just out of curiosity what exactly starts degrading after the 4 hour mark for you?

We can only comment that in our lab test environment, we didn't experience any noticeable performance diminishing after 4 hours of continuous operation if the operating environment can remain unchanged during the test.

However, we do receive a lot of comments from our users that their amplifier sounds better when on weekdays and afternoon when the electricity are not at peak load. I guess that is not necessarily the case when compared to Europe or North American users since the city power supply is steady and the population is not as crowded as in China.

 

[Wes S]

Don't forget to account for your own physiology and psychology.. I find that it's usually my ears that need a break, esp for critical listening. And frankly difficult to quantify what you mentioned, unless you're listening to the same track over and over... which I don't recommend. Enjoy the music! Cheers.

I think you are on to something here and good point. I remember back in my earlier basshead days (I used to be all about the bass ) I would sometimes become "bass deaf" after long listening sessions and prolonged exposure to intense bass, so listening fatigue could definitely account for a perceived loss in bass or uptick in mids and highs.

 

[Wes S]

We can only comment that in our lab test environment, we didn't experience any noticeable performance diminishing after 4 hours of continuous operation if the operating environment can remain unchanged during the test.

However, we do receive a lot of comments from our users that their amplifier sounds better when on weekdays and afternoon when the electricity are not at peak load. I guess that is not necessarily the case when compared to Europe or North American users since the city power supply is steady and the population is not as crowded as in China.

Thanks for the info Andy!

 

[Erwinatm]

after 4 hours of continuous operation if the operating environment can remain unchanged during the test.

Wise answer. It has to be in a controlled environment in factory's testing labs. I guess as manufacturer you won't release statement that your Class A amps are designed to handle long time heat / always on with loads for long hours. CMIIW.

Again, My opinion is based on my system, my experience, my environment, my mileage. YMMV. I agree you disagree.

Cheers and enjoy music friends.