[BS5711]

Yes, the current limit cut out protection only occurs at volume much higher than normal listening levels. If you were curious you could take the headphones off your head and crank the volume up with the gain on the higher settings, the original Diablo will almost certainly cut out at around 3 o'clock on the knob, it would be interesting to know if that behaviour carried over to the 2 or if they improved things. To reset after cut out you just connect a charger.

I wonder if the harshness with the Expanse that you describe is distortion. Tests that Golden Sound did show that the Diablo will produce very audible distortion at high volume when using low impedance headphones. It doesn’t distort with high impedance headphones.

The original has a desktop mode as well.

 

[iFi audio]

Hm. I have both here, the Diablo and Diablo 2 as well as the Expanse and I can not reproduce the issue you shortly described. Or maybe it kicks in far beyond normal hearing level.
But what I can say is that I can not hear very loughtly with the Expanse, because both Diablos are getting shrill and exhausting. Which is usually the case when the amp does not have enough power. I assume that this is a sign that both Diablos does not deliver the ~5W but far less. I can set my D90SE + ifi Pro iCan Sig to the same db volume (Measured with a sound pressure meter) and the same song sounds much more pleasant on the desktop stack. Sure sure, apple vs pears, but just saying.
I had the same hearing experience with the Fiio Q7, which should have 3W on paper. But the Q7 was a bit less engaging compared to the Diablos. With low and medium hearing level, I like the Diablos more compared to the Q7 from Fiio.

Since I owned every ifi micro iDSD device in the past years (expect the Diablo X, which was an absolutely unnecessary product?), I had the hope that the Diablo 2 is a step up in sound quality and power deliverey. But unfortunatly this is not the case. It sounds the same or almost (maybe a bit more resolving) the same as the original Diablo. Is this bad? I do not think so, I really like the Diablo and for me it is still one of the best (or maybe the best?) portable DAC/Amp device out there. And the Diablo 2 is a smart improvement with features I was missing a lot on the original Diablo. I like the Bluetooth option, the integrated IEmatch (I used an external ifi 4.4 IEmatch with the original Diablo when using IEMs), volumen knob lock, USB-C for data and charging and the desktop mode. Its not mentioned by ifi as far as I know, but ifi improved the annoying channel imbalance with the volumen know. I will not say its completly gone, but much better and no problem in daily usage anymore. At the end it is a clever further development, but not the jack-of-all-trades (I used Google translate here, in Germany we call it "Eierlegende Wollmilchsau") that many fans were waiting for. Is the Diablo 2 worth the extra 300€? Due to all the additional improvements and added features, I would say yes. But if we are honest, both Diablos are just to expensive for what they are. I would see the original Diablo at around 749€-799€ and the Diablo 2 at around 899€-949€.

PS: ifi, I still miss the Xbass, even if I do not need it for my Expanse and Tia Trio But your Xbass is a killer feature in many of your products and the community like the feature a lot

Thank you for your thoughts and impressions on the unit. I also agree with some of your descriptions, more resolving than the original, and the new features are very welcome for my taste.

We appreciate you taking the time!

Hopefully, I will issue a statement regarding the power measurements shortly, thanks for your patience.

Cheers!!

 

[tramubla]

A few questions on Diablo 2 as a DAC.

In the first post @iFi audio mentions the DAC can go in NOS mode. I love NOS sound and my main DAC is a TDA1541A tube DAC so is this BurrBrown DAC chip able to work and sound like those old NOS chips?

Is the BB chip used the same as the one in other DAC/AMP from iFi and does it sound the similar when using the line out of the Diablo2? If so could reviews of older products bring similar expectations on the sound of the line out of Diablo2?

Is the line out dedicated with very good parts in its signal path or since most users use Diablo like device as DAC/AMP then it’s not worth using high quality parts for the line out?

I’ve been looking for a « battery transportable » DAC for a long time to feed my Woo WA8 transportable tube amp but I usually dislike the sould of ESS and AKM DAC chips so I’ve been waiting for someone to finally make an R2R transportable DAC (not dongle), doesn’t seem like this will ever happen!

Many thanks for your answers.

They weren't saying it has a NOS mode; they were making an unfortunately worded analogy to cars getting extra performance with nitrous oxide (NOS)

 

[Currawong]

But what I can say is that I can not hear very loughtly with the Expanse, because both Diablos are getting shrill and exhausting. Which is usually the case when the amp does not have enough power. I assume that this is a sign that both Diablos does not deliver the ~5W but far less.

GoldenSound measured it.
1.6W RMS and 2.5W peak. You might get better results from the 6.3mm socket too, funnily enough.

The thing is, 1.6W is very respectable for a portable device. iFi have just ruined their reputation repeatedly insisting that their products can do things they can't, when they already perform very respectably.

 

[Thorsten Loesch]

But what I can say is that I can not hear very loughtly with the Expanse, because both Diablos are getting shrill and exhausting.

Try SE out.

Mind you, compared to classic "iFi Tuning" the Diablo was made deliberately more "bright" sounding (it was requested to sound "high resolution", which after much parsing to work out what it is translated to "bright") and playing loud emphasises this.

Thor

 

[iFi audio]

Folks, a brief statement on the measurement of the Diablo 2...

"We want to express our sincere appreciation to the community for your dedication to detail and commitment to quality.

Acknowledging the significance of precise technical specification, it is our standard practice to provide Root Mean Square (RMS) values for ALL our products as a measure of transparency; from the GO Link to the Gryphon, the Uno to the iCAN Phantom.

In light of personnel transitions subsequent to the Global recovery from the pandemic, it has been brought to our attention that human error resulted in our website solely displaying the maximum power specification for The Diablo 2, without listing the RMS value or elaborating on the methodology used.

We extend our sincerest apologies for this oversight and any resultant confusion. In response, our website has been updated to comprehensively include both RMS values and maximum power specifications, accompanied by detailed explanations of the conditions under which the maximum power is determined.

Your feedback has also prompted us to reevaluate our approach to presenting technical information, so we will list both the Maximum power output and the RMS value on the spec table of each product on our website to ensure that you can make informed decisions. We strive to continually improve and appreciate your dedication to holding us to high standards.

Further on the iDSD Diablo 2 design, it prioritizes the effective handling of real music signals while delivering optimal performance in terms of cost and size. We place a high priority on allocating resources to enhance the quality of music signals. However, this approach may not be fully apparent when solely considering RMS values.

Music features dynamic variations in loudness, rather than maintaining a constant volume. Typically, music has a 20dB crest factor, with peaks reaching ten times higher in volume. Our simulated measurement is achieved through simulating a 0dB signal at 1kHz, alternating with a one-on and nine-off pattern, allowing for a more accurate determination (from our experience) of the most relevant maximum power for music.

We will illustrate the difference between Maximum and RMS output using three examples below. It's important to emphasize that although Cases 1 and 3 may appear similar in terms of RMS values, Case 3 actually provides a significantly superior real music experience, akin to Case 2.

We express our gratitude for your ongoing support and seize these instances as opportunities to reinforce our dedication to quality and excellence in customer service"

Hope this helps in the discussion as it is valuable to our community.

Cheers!!

 

[ufospls2]

I have a Diablo 2 here. I was using it with the LCD-5 which is a very low impedance headphone at 14ohms, but also fairly low sensitivity at 90db/mw. I was hitting the clipping/current protection limit via the 4.4mm output with a modest bass boost via EQ at higher volumes (I was using the highest gain setting to be clear.) Based on recent discussions, I figured I'd try the 6.35mm SE output. No problems at all via the SE output. So it does appear that the lower impedance you go, the more sense it makes to use the SE output.

 

[Terr0rSandmannLuxx]

Try SE out.

Mind you, compared to classic "iFi Tuning" the Diablo was made deliberately more "bright" sounding (it was requested to sound "high resolution", which after much parsing to work out what it is translated to "bright") and playing loud emphasises this.

Thor

Unfortunatly, I do not have a SE cable here (just 4.4mm and XLR). Since the Expanse benefits a lot from a powerful source, I alreays use balance. But nevermind.

But never than less, I started the return process for the Diablo 2 today. If I would not already have the original Diablo, I think I would keep the Diablo 2. But I would get just ~500€ if I sell my normal Diablo. I would have to spent additional 800€ to get a new Diablo 2 which is to much for me and my limited use case.

 

[kobinski]

I've been listening to the DIABLO 2 for about a fortnight now. In line with the OG, which I still own... and of which I am an enthusiast. If I considered upgrading it was because the usb port on the OG failed me: it got stuck on the cable that came from the factory... when I wanted to try it, as I had always used the Mercury 3.0. The usb-c I would say is a great idea. It's possible —well, I'd rather take it for granted— that with the 5W thing the iFi marketing guys went overboard.... although I see now that they've backtracked. In any case, and like the OG, it has enough power -and clean power- to drive almost any headphone you put in front of it.

However, my first impression is that they don't sound exactly the same. I listened mainly to classical and jazz. And I can't help but get the impression that the DIABLO 2 provides a more spherical soundstage and a wetter, deeper bass. As if it were an equalized OG. It gives the feeling that they have surreptitiously incorporated the 3D and xBass functions. I'm not saying they have. I'm saying it gives this impression... especially, when you compare it to the OG, which, obviously, I have done. Be that as it may, the result is *enchanting*. The dynamic contrast is top notch for a portable.

On the other hand, I also have the impression that the DIABLO 2 eats quite a lot of noise from the usb port of the PC —in my case, a Macbook pro—. Well, it doesn't "whine" when I connect it to the Astell SE300 through its line output. I don't know if iFi intends to bring out a usb-c iPurifier. I suspect that would be a good idea..... :guiño:

 

[Tano]

Too late ifi. You have deceived a lot of customers. Selling a product, which biggest selling point was power, with fake specs and way less real power than advertised. You should be offering a discount to the guys who bought the device.

 

[MartussDer]

Too late ifi. You have deceived a lot of customers. Selling a product, which biggest selling point was power, with fake specs and way less real power than advertised. You should be offering a discount to the guys who bought the device.

Just imagine if the specs of IFI Phantom are also fake.
I'd better continue using direct stax energizers. It's not going to be that the bias voltage of the IFI phantom is also fake and my stax will burn out.

 

[Currawong]

Folks, a brief statement on the measurement of the Diablo 2...

"We want to express our sincere appreciation to the community for your dedication to detail and commitment to quality.

Our current website renovation has unfortunately led to some inconsistencies, one being the omission of the word "maximum" in the power output specifications of some of the products, including the Diablo 2 (we did have that on the original Diablo page, this shows the inconsistence). We acknowledge this oversight and moving forward, we will ensure that our specification tables clearly state "Maximum power output," aligning with the original Diablo spec.

Your feedback has also prompted us to reevaluate our approach to presenting technical information, so we will list both the Maximum power output and the RMS value on the spec table of each product on our website to ensure that you can make informed decisions. We strive to continually improve and appreciate your dedication to holding us to high standards.

Further on the iDSD Diablo 2 design, it prioritizes the effective handling of real music signals while delivering optimal performance in terms of cost and size. We place a high priority on allocating resources to enhance the quality of music signals. However, this approach may not be fully apparent when solely considering RMS values.

Music features dynamic variations in loudness, rather than maintaining a constant volume. Typically, music has a 20dB crest factor, with peaks reaching ten times higher in volume. Our simulated measurement is achieved through simulating a 0dB signal at 1kHz, alternating with a one-on and nine-off pattern, allowing for a more accurate determination (from our experience) of the most relevant maximum power for music.

We will illustrate the difference between Maximum and RMS output using three examples below. It's important to emphasize that although Cases 1 and 3 may appear similar in terms of RMS values, Case 3 actually provides a significantly superior real music experience, akin to Case 2.



Again, we appreciate your feedback and will start to incorporate both Max (real music simulated), and RMS values into future specifications."

Hope this helps in the discussion as it is valuable to our community.

Cheers!!

Sigh. You started off so well in the post, then that table, and the ridiculous self-justification. Let's be blunt:

Case 1: Being honest. How to gain the trust of your customers and the respect of the community, and get the most sales.
Case 2: Being dishonest. How to ruin your reputation after customers find out that they were deceived, have respectable reviews decline to review your products, and dealers refuse to stock them.
Case 3: Being deceptive. Ditto Case 2.

Do you know how annoying it is when I hear that a manufacturer will only rectify an issue if there is pushback on forums?
Did it occur to you that a certain company starting with "M" and ending with "A" went bankrupt and were just sold off after spending years using this same tactic?

 

[801evan]

Ifi is not wrong. I wholly enjoy susvara on low gain on the diablo and more so with mqa albums.

 

[MSXX]

Do you know how annoying it is when I hear that a manufacturer will only rectify an issue if there is pushback on forums?

Ifi lost all credibility - which is just sad.

And the spin ifi are trying ain’t doing anything to restore the lack of trust.

My issue is that that I own various ifi gear and have two elites. And now members on the forum thread of the elite found out that they have a ground wire issue hindering its performance and causing a potential serious issue in particular use cases. And now it seems that you have changed future Elite products by rectifying the problem. But doing so without a statement or reaching out to dealers and customers.

I Am not technical minded and don’t know what the issue was. But you refuse to answer questions regarding if my elites are safe to use and also if the performance is not what was promised. And may I remind you that these are not cheap units. Do you plan to retro-fix older elites???

And please, check in on the zen stream as well. We are many trying to get the streamer to work as planned, also.

 

[Thorsten Loesch]

Ifi lost all credibility - which is just sad.

Very. I remember how much hard work it took by a variety of folks) to show people "we are real and want to make you happy".

It is hard and takes years to build reputation. But you cannot list "goodwill" or "reputation" on a balance sheet, since it is "intangible", unlike cold hard cash in the bank.

My issue is that that I own various ifi gear and have two elites. And now members on the forum thread of the elite found out that they have a ground wire issue hindering its performance and causing a potential serious issue in particular use cases.

Hmm, I designed the iPower Plus, which basically the same PCB and parts in cheap plastic case for 1/3rd of the money. This was originally made for the Pro series in 15V/4A.

I had advocated a 2-wire power input and including an "EarthLink" (refuse to call it ground hog) for cases where a "missing earth" causes noise.

The thing is for low noise and using mains power the system MUST have one device referenced to earth, BUT ONLY ONE!

Not having an earth is now increasingly common and again causes noise.

A variety of international and national agency requirements for electrical safety make the life of the designer no easier.

The whole malarkey meant iPower Plus ended up with an earth. As Elite is basically iPower Plus in drag and dancing hula, it's the same.

And now it seems that you have changed future Elite products by rectifying the problem. But doing so without a statement or reaching out to dealers and customers.

Let's be more precise, the problem didn't get fixed. Because there is no fix that is also street legal.

One problem was traded for another, but the "another problem" is one iFi has a solution readily available.

I Am not technical minded and don’t know what the issue was. But you refuse to answer questions regarding if my elites are safe to use and also if the performance is not what was promised.

Best I know they are safe to use AND perform as designed.

And may I remind you that these are not cheap units.

They actually are. You just payed expensive for the "dress in drags and do the hula" part, which is the way it usually is.

And please, check in on the zen stream as well. We are many trying to get the streamer to work as planned, also.

Good luck. I suggested, back when I still had something to do with ifi, to use what is now the "WIIM" platform, concentrated on all the circuitry around where iFi had ready solutions and could add value.

Seems after I did "Exit, Stage, left" someone decided the basic idea was good, but why give money you can put into your pocket to someone good at job when you can do it badly?

Thor