[Wooglish]

Glad we are back to Solaris impressions! So, to answer the vocals: unless I am crazy, if you listen to female vocals with heavy instrumentation, the vocals do seem in the background, with instruments in the front. Listen to Amy Winehouse or Pat Benetar as examples and I think you are going to find the instruments in front of the vocals. I say this after a few weeks with Solaris and proper burn in. This doesn't mean I hate my Solaris and want to return them (many people seem to equate any criticism with a hatred of the phones), I still think they are fantastic, but like all iems I have tried, there is always a trade off. I plan to keep and love my Solaris phones, but they are not perfect to my ears. That seems to be the hobby: the constant search for perfection, which simply doesn't exist (although Focal Utopias are pretty close for me!)

 

[davidmolliere]

Honestly, I’m glad that there’s some dissent now? A lot of times, when a new product comes out, there just seems to be an echo chamber of positive impressions. Which is fine, and it’s good that people are liking their fancy new toys, but it’s also easy to fall into the trap of seeing anything new with rose colored glasses. (Like come on, you just dropped $1500 on those IEMs - you’re going to want to like them.) Crinacle’s impressions don’t change the fact that Solaris is at the top of my hybrid wish list, and if anything, it makes me more interested in trying it out.

Yeah well about the echo of positive impressions... as I said before you have to take into account the fact that people who buy first usually know what they're looking for in terms of signature and usually it's because they trust the house sound so there is a bias but not the bias you might think. Confirmation bias will come into play for some but really if something sounds bad or even average at this price point I am returning it or if it's too late reselling it. It's not like it's an un-reshellable CIEM

What I can say is I am still in awe at the Solaris sound and that's a month after and well over 200 hours with it... I still A/B with my other gear and regardless of price point it's a top contender in my opinion, I feel like great value for money and more importantly the enjoyment factor is sky rocket high

Campfire Audio has a 15 day return window (at your expense) if you decide you don't like them. I seriously doubt that they have received any Solaris back as a return. I would think the returns go to their B-stock sales, but I could be wrong.

We don't have that information but the few case of people that had fit issues sold it here on headfi rather than returned it. Fit issues are a real Solaris issue, it's not that widespread but still if you can you should try before you buy.

They need to do a tour and have random people sign-up and write their impressions. That would be a reliable statistic than the repetitive hype train posts. People say iSines or LCDi4 sounds great, but really the tonality is off. I see similarities in the measurements of Solaris. Vocals got to be off.

Measurements may be similar but the Solaris sound very different from the Solaris this would make me think there is a measurement issue (maybe because one is open back?), I encourage doing some A/B'ing this will be striking right the first minute...

If they believe so much in it, why don't they burn it in before selling? Do they want us to risk us hearing worse response from not being burnt in? Hmm.

I find it quite funny to suggest that a brand such as Campfire would quiver in fear of people knowing what their product really sound like... especially after the Andromeda became a all time classic that even to people who doubt the Solaris so called "hype" without having tried it

And I didn't find spectacular changes with burn-in, it sounded great right out of the box and aside from bass getting a bit tighter I didn't notice major changes. It's not the Vega, you could grind that axe

Glad we are back to Solaris impressions! So, to answer the vocals: unless I am crazy, if you listen to female vocals with heavy instrumentation, the vocals do seem in the background, with instruments in the front. Listen to Amy Winehouse or Pat Benetar as examples and I think you are going to find the instruments in front of the vocals. I say this after a few weeks with Solaris and proper burn in. This doesn't mean I hate my Solaris and want to return them (many people seem to equate any criticism with a hatred of the phones), I still think they are fantastic, but like all iems I have tried, there is always a trade off. I plan to keep and love my Solaris phones, but they are not perfect to my ears. That seems to be the hobby: the constant search for perfection, which simply doesn't exist (although Focal Utopias are pretty close for me!)

Can you provide more specific examples? It would be interesting to check what we all respectively hear. We did that back on the CL2 thread and it was very helpful. Source will also come into play.

Also, is this something you've noticed compared to other IEMs you own? It could also be the mastering of the tracks that is that way... so far the Solaris imaging is pretty great, even crinacle agrees on this.

 

[geagle]

I don't have the Solaris (but I AM thinking about getting it in the future).

About the whole crinacle thing, it looks to me that:

1) the guy was completely up front about what he did, how he did it, and the state the Solaris he heard was in (new, oob) - heck the disclaimer was as long as the impressions, looked to me
2) the guy did say he plans to go back to the Solaris again after unit has been sufficiently burned in
3) I seem to recall other people believing their Solaris did get better, after burn in (though I don't think they diametrically changed their opinions)
4) so this is actually interesting, could be a good way to assess the possible effect burn-in may (or may not) have on the Solaris

@Kitechaser maybe I'm wrong, but I seem to recall you hating the DM6 on open box (you wanted to return them?) and after a few days of burn in, you liked them quite a bit ? Could be that a similar thing may happen with crinacle and the Solaris.

Plus, I'd think that crinacle is entitled to his opinion and to expressing it (and he did not even do it here - probably waiting for a better grip on the unit, lol); it's another data point, and it's actually interesting (to me, at least) to see if and how it may change in the future.

I'd also think that the people who already have and enjoy the Solaris are very much entitled to continue enjoying it - and I don't really "get" why one dissenting data point would mar that, but that may be just me (or well, people are actually more interested in the satisfaction of having crinacle ranking their new toy high, rather than using it to listen to music? - which could be understandable, but has nothing to do with music)

 

[ustinj]

Yeah well about the echo of positive impressions... as I said before you have to take into account the fact that people who buy first usually know what they're looking for in terms of signature and usually it's because they trust the house sound so there is a bias but not the bias you might think. Confirmation bias will come into play for some but really if something sounds bad or even average at this price point I am returning it or if it's too late reselling it. It's not like it's an un-reshellable CIEM

What I can say is I am still in awe at the Solaris sound and that's a month after and well over 200 hours with it... I still A/B with my other gear and regardless of price point it's a top contender in my opinion, I feel like great value for money and more importantly the enjoyment factor is sky rocket high



We don't have that information but the few case of people that had fit issues sold it here on headfi rather than returned it. Fit issues are a real Solaris issue, it's not that widespread but still if you can you should try before you buy.



Measurements may be similar but the Solaris sound very different from the Solaris this would make me things there is a measurement issue (maybe because one is open back?), I encourage doing some A/B'ing this will be striking right the first minute...

I don't think the measurements are off, they seem to line up pretty closely with another measurements on another (unnamed) site (I saw you post your Solaris impressions there too!).

I do feel that a 3-4khz dip paired with a 2-3khz emphasis can sometimes sound a bit muted in the upper registers of vocals, my previous daily driver (HS1551) had this issue though to a lesser degree. It was noticeable when doing quick, direct A/B comparisons but sort of melted away after my ears adapted to the sound signature. It's possible that no one is wrong in their impression, just what their ears are used to.

But I would definitely have to give the Solaris a go to really find out.

 

[FangJoker]

Yeah well about the echo of positive impressions... as I said before you have to take into account the fact that people who buy first usually know what they're looking for in terms of signature and usually it's because they trust the house sound so there is a bias but not the bias you might think. Confirmation bias will come into play for some but really if something sounds bad or even average at this price point I am returning it or if it's too late reselling it. It's not like it's an un-reshellable CIEM

What I can say is I am still in awe at the Solaris sound and that's a month after and well over 200 hours with it... I still A/B with my other gear and regardless of price point it's a top contender in my opinion, I feel like great value for money and more importantly the enjoyment factor is sky rocket high



We don't have that information but the few case of people that had fit issues sold it here on headfi rather than returned it. Fit issues are a real Solaris issue, it's not that widespread but still if you can you should try before you buy.



Measurements may be similar but the Solaris sound very different from the Solaris this would make me things there is a measurement issue (maybe because one is open back?), I encourage doing some A/B'ing this will be striking right the first minute...



I find it quite funny to think that a brand such as Campfire would quiver in fear of people knowing what their product really sound like... especially after the Andromeda became a all time classic that even to people who doubt the Solaris so called "hype" without having tried it

And I didn't find spectacular changes with burn-in, it sounded great right out of the box and aside from bass getting a bit tighter I didn't notice major changes. It's not the Vega, you could grind that axe

Potential fit issues is another reason why I will likely pass on these (my left ear has real problems with most universals for fit) and the sony (extra heavy and sticks way far out). I've had issues with almost every sony as far as fit is concerned and their past IEMs almost always required a cable change or it sounded congested, but it looks like sony is including a better cable with the IER lineup.

I like the way hybrids sound, but I tend to have more dealbreaker issues with them over all BA IEMs for some reason. Most of the time it's bloomy bass that muddies up low mids like a HD650 and a bad tube amp, too much spl with inadequate venting, too much of a V shape sig that makes vocals sound too recessed, decay is too long, lacks impact, or the DD is just too slow and cannot handle fast bass.

 

[davidmolliere]

I don't think the measurements are off, they seem to line up pretty closely with another measurements on another (unnamed) site (I saw you post your Solaris impressions there too!). I do feel that a 3-4khz dip paired with a 2-3khz emphasis can sometimes sound a bit muted in the upper registers of vocals, my previous daily driver (HS1551) had this issue though to a lesser degree. It was noticeable when doing quick, direct A/B comparisons but sort of melted away after my ears adapted to the sound signature. It's possible that no one is wrong in their impression, just what their ears are used to. But I would definitely have to give the Solaris a go to really find out.

Not aware of any impressions I posted anywhere else except the french tellementnomade forums, I did keep an eye on the thread of the "forum that can't be named" as there were pretty interesting (and mostly positive, interestingly) impressions there as well.

Regarding measurements they may very well be accurate but drawing the conclusion that the Solaris are similar to the LCD i4 is clearly not accurate and a quick listen will easily settle that.

But good point about vocals, my brain maybe has gotten used to the signature after a month of 5/6 hours a day listening to them. Or maybe my all IEM range is suffering from the "issue" of recessed vocals so my reference point is biased. I don't own something like a VE5 to check out.

I will have an interesting meetup saturday near Paris with 20 or so with knowledgable people who have very different sources, very different tastes try out the Solaris. Going to be real interesting!

 

[Kitechaser]

I don't have the Solaris (but I AM thinking about getting it in the future).

About the whole crinacle thing, it looks to me that:

1) the guy was completely up front about what he did, how he did it, and the state the Solaris he heard was in (new, oob) - heck the disclaimer was as long as the impressions, looked to me
2) the guy did say he plans to go back to the Solaris again after unit has been sufficiently burned in
3) I seem to recall other people believing their Solaris did get better, after burn in (though I don't think they diametrically changed their opinions)
4) so this is actually interesting, could be a good way to assess the possible effect burn-in may (or may not) have on the Solaris

@Kitechaser maybe I'm wrong, but I seem to recall you hating the DM6 on open box (you wanted to return them?) and after a few days of burn in, you liked them quite a bit ? Could be that a similar thing may happen with crinacle and the Solaris.

Plus, I'd think that crinacle is entitled to his opinion and to expressing it (and he did not even do it here - probably waiting for a better grip on the unit, lol); it's another data point, and it's actually interesting (to me, at least) to see if and how it may change in the future.

I'd also think that the people who already have and enjoy the Solaris are very much entitled to continue enjoying it - and I don't really "get" why one dissenting data point would mar that, but that may be just me (or well, people are actually more interested in the satisfaction of having crinacle ranking their new toy high, rather than using it to listen to music? - which could be understandable, but has nothing to do with music)

I hated the DM6 out of the box, with a passion. I was going to return them, but then last minute thought, what the hell, I'll leave them attached to my computer and let them run for a few days.
Came back to them 4 days later and it was night and day. The iem completely changed.
I don't trust out of the box impressions anymore, and your ears have to settle in with the sound to top it off.
Everyone who buys an iem will spend a considerable amount of time with them, and that is basically what you are relying on a reviewer to do for you instead, be your proxy.
These hot takes and fast reviews are counter productive, I don't think they are reliable.
Having said that, I am not blaming Crinacle, instead its the circus that has formed around him and other reviewers on Head-fi. People are taking these reviewers, who have limited time with gear, a bit too seriously.
My only gripe with him is that he should be more careful and thorough with his impressions.(because of the circus)
People that hang onto his every word, were celebrating trashing an iem they have never heard, and on the other side, acting like the world had just come to an end.
He is 1 dude, with 2 ears, just like everyone else on this Forum.
Last I heard, he was sitting somewhere, not floating in the air.

 

[ustinj]

Not aware of any impressions I posted anywhere else except the french tellementnomade forums, I did keep an eye on the thread of the "forum that can't be named" as there were pretty interesting (and mostly positive, interestingly) impressions there as well.

Regarding measurements they may very well be accurate but drawing the conclusion that the Solaris are similar to the LCD i4 is clearly not accurate and a quick listen will easily settle that.

But good point about vocals, my brain maybe has gotten used to the signature after a month of 5/6 hours a day listening to them. Or maybe my all IEM range is suffering from the "issue" of recessed vocals so my reference point is biased. I don't own something like a VE5 to check out.

I will have an interesting meetup saturday near Paris with 20 or so with knowledgable people who have very different sources, very different tastes try out the Solaris. Going to be real interesting!

Oops, double checked just now and those impressions were not yours. I must be living in a parallel universe or something.

 

[ddmt]

I hated the DM6 out of the box, with a passion. I was going to return them, but then last minute thought, what the hell, I'll leave them attached to my computer and let them run for a few days.
Came back to them 4 days later and it was night and day. The iem completely changed.
I don't trust out of the box impressions anymore, and your ears have to settle in with the sound to top it off.
Everyone who buys an iem will spend a considerable time with them, and that is basically what you are relying on a reviewer to do for you instead, be your proxy.
These hot takes and fast reviews are counter productive, I don't think they are reliable.
Having said that, I am not blaming Crinacle, instead its the circus that has formed around him and other reviewers on Head-fi. People are taking these reviewers, who have limited time with gear, a bit too seriously.
My only gripe with him is that he should be more careful and through with his impressions.(because of the circus)
People that hang into his every word, were celebrating trashing and iem they have never heard, and on the other side, acting like the world had just come to an end.
He is 1 dude, with 2 ears, just like everyone else on this Forum.
Last I heard, he was sitting somewhere, not floating in the air.

I don't know what crinacle has written before to make you super pissed. I think he said DM6 is good.
Did you ever read his disclaimer? And that's just his first impression, will come back again hopefully after your magic 150-200 hours.
Wait 4 days it's only 96 hours.

 

[geagle]

@ddmt I dragged the DM6 comment in the thread, as I knew @Kitechaser 's history with it. I mentioned it, 'cos kitechaser had a 180° moment with it, and I raised the possibility that crinacle might have a similar one about the Solaris.

 

[hiflofi]

Can we just admit that not everyone hears the same way? The solution so simple. Idk why a less than overwhelmingly positive* opinion about one IEM had to result in this storm lmao.

 

[davidmolliere]

Can we just admit that not everyone hears the same way? The solution so simple. Idk why a less than overwhelmingly positive* opinion about a one IEM had to result in this storm lmao.

We totally agree on this and the only problem is when people decree that the truth is in the FR graph when we all know it's much more complicated than that (not saying crincale said that, but followers certainly do)... a great read about this is http://snext-final.com/en/acoustics/

 

[hiflofi]

We totally agree on this and the only problem is when people decree that the truth is in the FR graph when we all know it's much more complicated than that (not saying crincale said that, but followers certainly do)... a great read about this is http://snext-final.com/en/acoustics/

There are other measurements of the Solaris out there. They look similar.
While measurements aren't the final word, they can inform us in yet another way, just like our subjective listening impressions can. I'm appreciative of all contributions to a future purchase. That's all I can say.
You've got your opinion, I've got mine, he's got his. Not much else to it.
I'll be demoing the Solaris soon enough so I'm glad for that.

 

[duaned]

Campfire Audio fans remind me of those folk that love apple. They think the products are the best to arrive since sliced bread, but fortunately there are better, low cost options available today.
I haven’t yet heard the Solaris, but by going from previous owner examples from this brand I certainly do not believe all the hype either.
Most of the range have fitment issues, and don’t bring balance to the table ( apart from andro) are built well but mark just by looking at them.
Hey, even their Reference 8 cable is advertised as having “ low microphonics” or words to that effect. But it is one of the worlds worst cables as far as microphonics is concerned.

I’ve been burnt money wise from Campfire offerings, never again. I’ll let you lot furnish campfire’s nest egg and possibly some of your egos.

 

[money4me247]

I got a full refund when I returned mine. They will not charge restock fee if you keep the item in new condition. That is reasonable assuming you handle w/ decent care e.g. don't tear the box, drop the IEM, etc.

@koven , just curious why did you end up returning yours. feel free to PM me if you don't want to post on thread. thanks