[patatchod]

Hello to all,

I have in test the Burson Soloist, as well as a Swedish amp, Lejonklou Giella PI.
I compared them to my Shiit Magnius and my SP200.
The headphone used is the Final Audio D8000Pro and the DAC a NAD M51.
I'm looking for a more qualitative amp than the Magnius or the SP200, with a less dry sound.

To make it simple and quick, if I had to give a grade on the sound delivered by these amps, it would be like this:

1- Lejonklou Giella PI: 90/100
2- Burson Soloist 3X: 85/100
3- Magnius and SP200: 84,5/100

In fact, I have a hard time telling the difference between each amp (the Magnius and the SP200 are indistinguishable to my ears).
The Jonklou has the best score because its treble is a bit more refined than the others.
The Burson has half a point more than the Magnius and SP200 because if you look hard enough and listen very, very carefully, it has a little more body than the Magnius and SP200.

If I had to give marks on the ratio Performance / Price, it would give this :

1- Magnius: 90/100
2- SP200: 85/100 (it is not a preamp)
3- Burson: 50/100 (about the same performance as the Magnius but 5 x more expensive than it)
4- Lejonklou Giella PI : 20/100 (only one RCA input, no gain control or anything else except the volume)

So, I'm a bit disappointed because reading you, I expected a lot from this Burson...
For me, the conclusion is clear: Manufacturers now know how to make really high quality amps at very low cost and the differences in sound rendering have considerably narrowed. The search for performance is shifting more and more towards the final device: the headphones. I made a big investment when I bought the D8000pro and I don't regret it as it doesn't require 5000 or 10000 € monsters to power it.

Perhabs, if I made the comparison with a Susvara or a HE6SE the result would have been different ? Yes perhabs, but the D8000Pro sounds so good, even with my little Fiio M11Pro.

 

[betula]

Hello to all,

I have in test the Burson Soloist, as well as a Swedish amp, Lejonklou Giella PI.
I compared them to my Shiit Magnius and my SP200.
The headphone used is the Final Audio D8000Pro and the DAC a NAD M51.
I'm looking for a more qualitative amp than the Magnius or the SP200, with a less dry sound.

To make it simple and quick, if I had to give a grade on the sound delivered by these amps, it would be like this:

1- Lejonklou Giella PI: 90/100
2- Burson Soloist 3X: 85/100
3- Magnius and SP200: 84,5/100

In fact, I have a hard time telling the difference between each amp (the Magnius and the SP200 are indistinguishable to my ears).
The Jonklou has the best score because its treble is a bit more refined than the others.
The Burson has half a point more than the Magnius and SP200 because if you look hard enough and listen very, very carefully, it has a little more body than the Magnius and SP200.

If I had to give marks on the ratio Performance / Price, it would give this :

1- Magnius: 90/100
2- SP200: 85/100 (it is not a preamp)
3- Burson: 50/100 (about the same performance as the Magnius but 5 x more expensive than it)
4- Lejonklou Giella PI : 20/100 (only one RCA input, no gain control or anything else except the volume)

So, I'm a bit disappointed because reading you, I expected a lot from this Burson...
For me, the conclusion is clear: Manufacturers now know how to make really high quality amps at very low cost and the differences in sound rendering have considerably narrowed. The search for performance is shifting more and more towards the final device: the headphones. I made a big investment when I bought the D8000pro and I don't regret it as it doesn't require 5000 or 10000 € monsters to power it.

Perhabs, if I made the comparison with a Susvara or a HE6SE the result would have been different ? Yes perhabs, but the D8000Pro sounds so good, even with my little Fiio M11Pro.

Just a few thoughts:
Did you give enough burn-in time (100hrs) and warm up time (1hour) to the Soloist?
If you did, perhaps you could listen to the Soloist exclusively for a couple of days and then go back to the Magnius. Sometimes differences don't pop up immediately but once your brain fully adjusted to the new sound you suddenly find you can't go back anymore.

For me for example also took a few days to really appreciate the Soloist's sound. I had very high expectations and the amp didn't blow my socks off immediately. After a few days, especially in 'headphone power amp mode' I really started to appreciate the dynamic and energetic yet analogue sound.
Listening to bass notes and kick-drums are often a good indicator. Recreating a lifelike and tangible kickdrum hit is often a sign of a good amp. Cheaper amps can sound flat and unrefined in this regard.
Initially I almost sold off my 3XP, now nobody could take it out of my hands.

At the end of the day follow your ears. If you can't hear enough difference versus your Magnius, happy days for your budget and spend the money on something else.

 

[qsk78]

At the end of the day follow your ears. If you can't hear enough difference versus your Magnius, happy days for your budget and spend the money on something else.

This is the point. I remember I was so happy with O2 in the past.

 

[tamleo]

Hello to all,

I have in test the Burson Soloist, as well as a Swedish amp, Lejonklou Giella PI.
I compared them to my Shiit Magnius and my SP200.
The headphone used is the Final Audio D8000Pro and the DAC a NAD M51.
I'm looking for a more qualitative amp than the Magnius or the SP200, with a less dry sound.

To make it simple and quick, if I had to give a grade on the sound delivered by these amps, it would be like this:

1- Lejonklou Giella PI: 90/100
2- Burson Soloist 3X: 85/100
3- Magnius and SP200: 84,5/100

In fact, I have a hard time telling the difference between each amp (the Magnius and the SP200 are indistinguishable to my ears).
The Jonklou has the best score because its treble is a bit more refined than the others.
The Burson has half a point more than the Magnius and SP200 because if you look hard enough and listen very, very carefully, it has a little more body than the Magnius and SP200.

If I had to give marks on the ratio Performance / Price, it would give this :

1- Magnius: 90/100
2- SP200: 85/100 (it is not a preamp)
3- Burson: 50/100 (about the same performance as the Magnius but 5 x more expensive than it)
4- Lejonklou Giella PI : 20/100 (only one RCA input, no gain control or anything else except the volume)

So, I'm a bit disappointed because reading you, I expected a lot from this Burson...
For me, the conclusion is clear: Manufacturers now know how to make really high quality amps at very low cost and the differences in sound rendering have considerably narrowed. The search for performance is shifting more and more towards the final device: the headphones. I made a big investment when I bought the D8000pro and I don't regret it as it doesn't require 5000 or 10000 € monsters to power it.

Perhabs, if I made the comparison with a Susvara or a HE6SE the result would have been different ? Yes perhabs, but the D8000Pro sounds so good, even with my little Fiio M11Pro.

May I ask how much time that you spent on listening to your aforementioned amps? Tks

 

[qsk78]

This is fine. I remember I was so disappointed in SPL Phonitor XE since it could not properly drive my headphones at high gain.
I believe It can be perfect for high impedance dynamic headphones like an 800S but could not do much with low sensitivity planars.

 

[patatchod]

Just a few thoughts:
Did you give enough burn-in time (100hrs) and warm up time (1hour) to the Soloist?
If you did, perhaps you could listen to the Soloist exclusively for a couple of days and then go back to the Magnius. Sometimes differences don't pop up immediately but once your brain fully adjusted to the new sound you suddenly find you can't go back anymore.

For me for example also took a few days to really appreciate the Soloist's sound. I had very high expectations and the amp didn't blow my socks off immediately. After a few days, especially in 'headphone power amp mode' I really started to appreciate the dynamic and energetic yet analogue sound.
Listening to bass notes and kick-drums are often a good indicator. Recreating a lifelike and tangible kickdrum hit is often a sign of a good amp. Cheaper amps can sound flat and unrefined in this regard.
Initially I almost sold off my 3XP, now nobody could take it out of my hands.

At the end of the day follow your ears. If you can't hear enough difference versus your Magnius, happy days for your budget and spend the money on something else.

I don't believe in the burn-in effect, being unable to hear the difference between the soloist and the Magnius.
For me it's just like the sound of the cables...
As for the warm-up time, I think it's more of a brain warm-up... To me, if one device is better (or different) than another, it should be heard immediately, not after some burn-in or warm-up.
But you are right: maybe I didn't spend enough time on each amp..... I will listen to each of them several days, without switching, and make an idea after that...

 

[patatchod]

May I ask how much time that you spent on listening to your aforementioned amps? Tks

Probably not enough time...

 

[betula]

I don't believe in the burn-in effect, being unable to hear the difference between the soloist and the Magnius.
For me it's just like the sound of the cables...
As for the warm-up time, I think it's more of a brain warm-up... To me, if one device is better (or different) than another, it should be heard immediately, not after some burn-in or warm-up.
But you are right: maybe I didn't spend enough time on each amp..... I will listen to each of them several days, without switching, and make an idea after that...

Well, it is always recommended to follow the manufacturer's advice. Burson recommends 100hrs burn-in and 30-60 mins warm up time.
It is easier to argue with burn-in, but warm up time with Class-A amps is definitely a real thing.

 

[patatchod]

This is fine. I remember I was so disappointed in SPL Phonitor XE since it could not properly drive my headphones at high gain.
I believe It can be perfect for high impedance dynamic headphones like an 800S but could no do much with low sensitivity planars.

My concern is that each of the mentioned amps drives very well the D8000pro.
Perhabs it is due to the excelent "drivability" (don't know if it's the correct word...) of the d8000pro ?

 

[patatchod]

,but warm up time with Class-A amps is definitely a real thing.

The only time I noticed an improvement after the warm-up time was with my tube amp, an Audiomat Solfège Reference, never heard with my other SS class A amps.
But I have to admit that I never really focused on this point either.

 

[betula]

My concern is that each of the mentioned amps drives very well the D8000pro.
Perhabs it is due to the excelent "drivability" (don't know if it's the correct word...) of the d8000pro ?

My RME-ADI2 drives my Empyrean well. Especially for the money.
But the Soloist lifts it to another level. Clarity, separation, definition, energy all improve a lot.
Perhaps not immediately a night and day difference but after some time it is impossible not to hear it.
For sure, at this level you are paying heavy £$€ hundreds or a grand for 10-30% improvement, but unfortunately that is how audio world works.

Driving a headphone well is not just reaching a certain volume level. There is much more to it, like bass presence and definition, instrument separation, imaging, refinement, 3D space...

 

[patatchod]

Driving a headphone well is not just reaching a certain volume level. There is much more to it, like bass presence and definition, instrument separation, imaging, refinement, 3D space...

Driving a headphone well is not just reaching a certain volume level. There is much more to it, like bass presence and definition, instrument separation, imaging, refinement, 3D space...

These caracteristics are totally fullfilled by the D8000pro IMO ! This is, maybe, why these cans are not very "amp sensitive" ?

 

[betula]

Driving a headphone well is not just reaching a certain volume level. There is much more to it, like bass presence and definition, instrument separation, imaging, refinement, 3D space...

These caracteristics are totally fullfilled by the D8000pro IMO ! This is, maybe, why these cans are not very "amp sensitive" ?

Unfortunately I haven't had a chance to try the D8000pro but I did own and try many other headphones including a few flagships (LCD4, Susvara, HE1000V2, Verité, Arya, LCD-X). They all improved with better amps, although the improvement did cost quite a lot in relation to the performance percentages I gained.
The equation is true: biggest improvement comes from different headphones, then amps, then DACs. Then cables in my opinion and I also want to highlight file source. None of the HQ streaming platforms sounded better than my old-fashioned bitperfect FLAC for example.

 

[patatchod]

The D8000pro are the first cans which "show" me the difference between flac and good mp3 !

 

[betula]

The D8000pro are the first cans which "show" me the difference between flac and good mp3 !

FLAC and 320kbps mp3 is still a tricky one. A lot depends on the quality of the recording. A well recorded album in 320kbps mp3 can sound better than a bad recording in FLAC. That said, there is a difference between the same recording in 320kbps mp3 and FLAC but usually less obvious than the difference between recording quality.
It is lower quality mp3 where things start to get really obviously bad.
And bitperfect mode in ASIO/WASAPI further improves clarity of FLAC files.