[SP Wild]

Some variation at max, judging by the housing.

 

[SP Wild]

The se530 is a closed version of the HD650 - nothing else in my collection have such a similar resonant frequency.  I can tell that the se530 is fully closed because there is no soundstage so to speak of.  Why then does my D7000 have a "soundstage" but poor "imaging" when it is also closed. 
 
The answer is because the D7000 isn't entirely closed.  There is leakage.  An engineered leakage so the treble can seep through - from this what it sounds like is a smooth boost in soundstaging from the upper limits of midrange til the furthest reaches of treble extension.  With a booming resonance at the upper bass / lower mid region.
 
There is good value in the shure IEMS.  EQ ing the D7000 to sound more like the Shure's resulted in a clear victory for the Shures.  They are technically more proficient phone than the D7000 - albeit with an inferior FR balance.

 

[SP Wild]

I've never noticed "airy" bass until now with the Shure 530.  However its design fails me when I boost the volume to enthusiastic levels, distortion kicks in.  Hence I prefer the Denons overall.  Would it be wise to conclude that closed cans are inherently at a disadvantage with THD measurements?

 

[SoupRKnowva]

i knew someone was going to bring up the quality of the recording. This is not an issue with the quality of the recording, this recording sounds pretty damn good on my jh-13's in particular, and on all the other high end phones i tried at canjam, it was one of my demo tracks. this was a fault of the headphones. i was just curious if anyone knew what it was. i was going to say it must lack transient response, but those square waves look pretty good, so im confused.

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

i knew someone was going to bring up the quality of the recording. This is not an issue with the quality of the recording, this recording sounds pretty damn good on my jh-13's in particular, and on all the other high end phones i tried at canjam, it was one of my demo tracks. this was a fault of the headphones. i was just curious if anyone knew what it was. i was going to say it must lack transient response, but those square waves look pretty good, so im confused.

SoupR, without knowing what you actually heard, it would be difficult for me to tell you what you experienced.  Maybe the next time you make it to PDX we can hook up and you can let me listen to the piece of music to which you're referring.
Cheerz,
kevin

 

[SoupRKnowva]

 
Quote:

SoupR, without knowing what you actually heard, it would be difficult for me to tell you what you experienced.  Maybe the next time you make it to PDX we can hook up and you can let me listen to the piece of music to which you're referring.
Cheerz,
kevin

oh thanks kevin, im not sure ill be able to demonstrate it though since i dont actually have the 535's, wouldnt buy them after that haha it was just an extreme distortion to the sound, it realyl surprised me actually.
 
Edit: hoping to be back out there for christmas for a couple weeks
 

 

[MrGreen]

Back after a break. Great thread guys. The qualia results were startling, disgusting for the price.  Are there any plans for tyll to measure the LCD2? It'd be great to see the results reproduced

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

Back after a break. Great thread guys. The qualia results were startling.  Are there any plans for tyll to measure the LCD2? It'd be great to see the results reproduced

He measured it with three different samples and posted the results in this thread.  

 

[MrGreen]

Yep, got it. Cheers mate

 

[SP Wild]

1.  Open headphones inherently feature crossfeed. 
 
2.  The se530 "opened" up significantly with software crossfeed.  "Air" is injected, whilst lower midrange heaviness is reduced with a subsequent boost in separation and upper mid - sounded more like an open can.  The JR Media crossfeed is way superior to the foobar implementation.
 
3.  Sound leaks from one channel of the cups to penetrate the other cup, through the driver, and reinforces or negates phasing in the other channel before finally hitting our ears.
 
4.  The "resonant frequency" is tuned via damping materials to let certain frequencies leak (exhaust) and also as a passive frequency crossover in letting certain frequencies from the other channel to be injected into the sound waves (induction filter).  This is absolutely the same principles in tuning the induction and exhaust for a pleasing engine note.
 
5.  The resonant frequency of an open can, is where  the soundstage maxes out in its frequency response.
 
6.  The extra pressure waves resulting from the channel crosstalk helps the drivers movement at the feed-in frequency - hence at the resonant frequency, driver requirements are lessened and the magnets have extra headroom to operate increasing the agility of the driver at the resonant frequency.  This is the same principle as "drafting" when cars race.  Two cars moving close together consume less energy (especially the rear car) due to pressure waves generated by the first car assisting the entire mobile system.  The gain in efficiency is exactly the same principle as an EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) system in modern vehicles - whereby the exhaust gas is selectively injected into the induction stream in small quantities to aid engine efficiency.  A speaker is an air pump and so is an engine.
 
This is my latest hypothesis - then again, my imagination may be getting the better of me!

 
(point five and six are ravings of a madman)

 

[xnor]

Quote:

1.  Open headphones inherently feature crossfeed. 
 
2.  The se530 "opened" up significantly with software crossfeed.  "Air" is injected, whilst lower midrange heaviness is reduced with a subsequent boost in separation and upper mid - sounded more like an open can.  The JR Media crossfeed is way superior to the foobar implementation.
 
3.  Sound leaks from one channel of the cups to penetrate the other cup, through the driver, and reinforces or negates phasing in the other channel before finally hitting our ears.
 
4.  The "resonant frequency" is tuned via damping materials to let certain frequencies leak (exhaust) and also as a passive frequency crossover in letting certain frequencies from the other channel to be injected into the sound waves (induction filter).  This is absolutely the same principles in tuning the induction and exhaust for a pleasing engine note.
 
5.  The resonant frequency of an open can, is where  the soundstage maxes out in its frequency response.
 
6.  The extra pressure waves resulting from the channel crosstalk helps the drivers movement at the feed-in frequency - hence at the resonant frequency, driver requirements are lessened and the magnets have extra headroom to operate increasing the agility of the driver at the resonant frequency.  This is the same principle as "drafting" when cars race.  Two cars moving close together consume less energy (especially the rear car) due to pressure waves generated by the first car assisting the entire mobile system.  The gain in efficiency is exactly the same principle as an EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) system in modern vehicles - whereby the exhaust gas is selectively injected into the induction stream in small quantities to aid engine efficiency.  A speaker is an air pump and so is an engine.
 
This is my latest hypothesis - then again, my imagination may be getting the better of me!

 

 
1. Closed headphones too, but at an audible level or level that is high enough to really change the sound?
 
2. The crossfeed implementation (at least the one of bs2b) has a treble boost that is documented on the homepage with FR graphs. t_t
"JR crossfeed is superior", and you think everyone will accept that implicitly? /wallbash
 
3. Any measurements on that one? Imo, the effects can only be very, very small.
 
4. What?
 
5. WHAT? The resonant frequency is at the peak of the impedance curve.
 
6. No way.
 
.. tbh, I cannot make much sense out of this, sorry

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SP Wild /img/forum/go_quote.gif

1.  Open headphones inherently feature crossfeed. 
 
2.  The se530 "opened" up significantly with software crossfeed.  "Air" is injected, whilst lower midrange heaviness is reduced with a subsequent boost in separation and upper mid - sounded more like an open can.  The JR Media crossfeed is way superior to the foobar implementation.
 
3.  Sound leaks from one channel of the cups to penetrate the other cup, through the driver, and reinforces or negates phasing in the other channel before finally hitting our ears.
 
4.  The "resonant frequency" is tuned via damping materials to let certain frequencies leak (exhaust) and also as a passive frequency crossover in letting certain frequencies from the other channel to be injected into the sound waves (induction filter).  This is absolutely the same principles in tuning the induction and exhaust for a pleasing engine note.
 
5.  The resonant frequency of an open can, is where  the soundstage maxes out in its frequency response.
 
6.  The extra pressure waves resulting from the channel crosstalk helps the drivers movement at the feed-in frequency - hence at the resonant frequency, driver requirements are lessened and the magnets have extra headroom to operate increasing the agility of the driver at the resonant frequency.  This is the same principle as "drafting" when cars race.  Two cars moving close together consume less energy (especially the rear car) due to pressure waves generated by the first car assisting the entire mobile system.  The gain in efficiency is exactly the same principle as an EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) system in modern vehicles - whereby the exhaust gas is selectively injected into the induction stream in small quantities to aid engine efficiency.  A speaker is an air pump and so is an engine.
This is my latest hypothesis - then again, my imagination may be getting the better of me!

Yes, imaginations do run rampant at times, but it's fun on occasion, no?  

 

 

[SP Wild]

xnor, I am not as quick to dismiss your electronic understanding as you are to dismiss my mechanical aptitude. 
 
I spent a large portion of my life with vehicles at my work bay gutted to pieces as I try to imagine where the interior noise anomaly is coming from and to what extent and which vibration is inducing the noise.  Then I have to imagine where the vibration is exactly coming from and then again where the source inducing the vibration is coming from.  There is no help and after you make your educated guess, you pick up your tools and rip into this half million dollar car (hence it must be noise free).  When the controller has it in for you, this is the sort of job that will ruin your week at work.

 

[SP Wild]

 
Quote:

Yes, imaginations do run rampant at times, but it's fun on occasion, no?  

 

I love music - It lets me imagine things and it's really fun.

 
When I was a kid I had a cheap boombox - where I'd play my tape, flip to side b, and repeat till the cows came home.  I learned music in hi-school.  When I became a teenager cars became everything - I needed to know how they work.  As I get older, music is taking a hold of me again.  And this time I have an inherent desire to find out how it all works.
 
The funny thing is, I get a feeling experienced members already know all that I am finding out now.

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SP Wild /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I love music - It lets me imagine things and it's really fun.

 
When I was a kid I had a cheap boombox - where I'd play my tape, flip to side b, and repeat till the cows came home.  I learned music in hi-school.  When I became a teenager cars became everything - I needed to know how they work.  As I get older, music is taking a hold of me again.  And this time I have an inherent desire to find out how it all works.
 
The funny thing is, I get a feeling experienced members already know all that I am finding out now.

Some do, some don't, and no one person has all the answers.  That's why it's so valuable to hang around here.  Learning from one another enhances our appreciation of music, audio, art and science in general.