Bogdan Audio Silver Spirit Ref IC compared Acoustic Zen Silver Ref II
Jul 5, 2003 at 7:55 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 71

AC1

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I picked up the Silver Spirit due to the good word that has been floating around about it on AA. Different people have said that it revealed more than the Acoustic Zen Silver Ref IIs, which of course made me curious. The cable is fairly low priced since it is on “special” right now (till end of July) and it just so happens that the guy who makes them, Ben, lives nearby. A very nice person who has been trying to make more affordable cables that competes with high priced cords, because according to him, why should only rich people be able to get good sound, can’t argue with that.

So how will it stack up to the Silver Ref IIs? The design is very minimalist with no shielding, using two tubes of silver wire for each cord held in place by a separator, and the Eichmann silver plugs. Well, I have to say that the Silver Ref II is hard to listen to after comparing it to the Silver Spirit….

The Silver Spirit is on a whole a more focused (ya another one, seems like I’m drawn into that now), better defined cable, than the SRIIs but with some very clear strengths that really propel its performance past the SRII.

One of the biggest advantages of the Silver Spirit over the SRII is the midrange to mid-bass. The SRIIs were never known to have a great midrange to begin with, but I never really found them lacking compared to other cables. After listening to the Silver Spirit, to me, it is the SRIIs greatest weakness. A very good cd that made this very plainly obvious is Ana Carams, Blue Bossa, on Chesky. Comparing just her voice, the SRII portrays it more recessed than the Silver Spirit. It is less dynamic, with less force, and impact; also in comparison it kind of has a hazy, murky quality to it. With the SRII, you get the feeling that her voice is somewhat weak compared to other instruments, like she has no energy to project it. The Silver Spirit filled her voice out by quite a bit. Not in a bloomy, rich, and thick kind of way, but it just seemed more whole, present. It allowed her voice to have solid dynamics and projection, not sounding so soft compared to everything else. This effect also manifested itself in the bass (instrument) that accompanies many of her songs. With the lack of dynamics, and being generally less focused, the bass (instrument) could become so indistinct, non-impactful, and lost during more complicated passages that it virtually vanishes as an instrument let alone being able to tell what is being played, becoming just a loose kind of bumble, sad.

Highs for SRII, are also a bit duller compared to Silver Spirit… Cymbal brushes come though better with the Bogdan, giving a sense that it is a cymbal. With the SRIIs, those brushes do not sound like metal but almost just rasping. Even though the Silver Spirit is more defined in this region, I did not find it to have an over energized top end, it does not stick out, to me. But it can reveal brightness, so in that sense it is even less forgiving than the SRII.

The SRII does have a tendency to shove all instruments forward, and another consequence of that is that it portrays all the instruments with very similar size. The Silver Spirit seemed to be able to portray the depth and size of the instruments to a more varying degree. The SRII can make a soundstage projected to be in a form of a rectangular box, where the depth is harder to perceive and the instruments are playing on the same plain.

Overall there is a general sense of dullness with the SRIIs. There almost seems to be a haze over everything, a sense of dullness, a more diffused sound. Some people say it’s the “veil” being lifted when they compare. The Silver Spirits also sound quicker than the SRII. Attacks of an orchestra come through with more urgency and agility while with SRII, it can sound just a bit more dull, held back.

The culmination of these effects is that the SRII does not sound as focused or solid as the Bogdan. Where the sound of an instrument is very present, defined and distinct in space with the Silver Spirit, the SRII can be vague, loose. The more complex the passage the more blurred everything becomes. This actually makes it a bit distracting to listen to the SRIIs in comparison. I have to concentrate more to tell what is going on and even if I do try to follow specific things, sometimes I can’t because they are just not defined enough and blurred out by other instruments, very frustrating.

As you can tell, I really do like these cables. Before, I got the Bogdans, I had always thought the midrange in my system was lacking in dynamics. And is one reason, I tried other power cables, since I thought that was the origin of the problem. But really, it ended up being the SRII had something to contribute to it as well. This is another cable that is a great value, especially for the price it is right now. As always though, it might not what you are looking for, since the cable can reveal a lot and will come down to preference, system, etc. I did not think that in comparison it would show such shortcomings, to me, of the SRIIs.
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 12:44 PM Post #2 of 71
Quote:

Originally posted by AC1
As you can tell, I really do like these cables. Before, I got the Bogdans, I had always thought the midrange in my system was lacking in dynamics. And is one reason, I tried other power cables, since I thought that was the origin of the problem. But really, it ended up being the SRII had something to contribute to it as well. This is another cable that is a great value, especially for the price it is right now. As always though, it might not what you are looking for, since the cable can reveal a lot and will come down to preference, system, etc. I did not think that in comparison it would show such shortcomings, to me, of the SRIIs.


Great report AC, you are doing all here a great service keeping us informed of exciting new cables and AC cords! You are very wise to note that others may not have same results, cables are all personal taste and system matching.

I will be getting my BSSR very soon soon and do my own comparison with AZ SR I. This seems too good to be true, and I will be very surprised if I get same results in my system. First the AZ SR is very expensive, but easy to buy used as I did, but still not cheap even used. I am currently very happy with this cable, it is very natural sounding silver cable that produces a massive 3D soundstage in my full stereo system.......this is most noticeable area where it surpasses lesser cables. It seems to give all the advantages of silver without any of the drawbacks.

I have tried many silver ICs in the past and they can often have too much treble energy and sound thin/bleached vs more natural full bodied copper IC. However well designed silver ICs just seems to extract more detail and have a clarity/speed and transparancy that copper cannnot acheive.

The AZ SR sounds very balanced/natural to me, gives me enhanced detail of silver, and huge 3D soundstage.....no other IC I have tried can match it's soundstage size (so far) I have heard other silver ICs that seem more detailed but are not natural sounding with thin overall sound and overemphasized treble.

However the only way I discovered the AZ SR was reading others experience then trying myself, I thought I was happy with old ICs till I tried AZ. I will jump for joy if BSSR can unseat the AZ SR as my reference IC, the price is certainly more to my liking
cool.gif
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 3:01 PM Post #3 of 71
AC
Must compliment you on your list of excellent tweaks:
-AM Stealth
-Aurios
-Silver wall outlet
-etc

With these latest IC and AC cord changes I'd say your pursuit of "absolute sound" has reached a new higher level
cool.gif
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 4:05 PM Post #4 of 71
Quote:

Originally posted by DarkAngel

I have tried many silver ICs in the past and they can often have too much treble energy and sound thin/bleached vs more natural full bodied copper IC. However well designed silver ICs just seems to extract more detail and have a clarity/speed and transparancy that copper cannnot acheive.

The AZ SR sounds very balanced/natural to me, gives me enhanced detail of silver, and huge 3D soundstage.....no other IC I have tried can match it's soundstage size (so far) I have heard other silver ICs that seem more detailed but are not natural sounding with thin overall sound and overemphasized treble.


Yes, silver cables can be tricky sometimes... I have used the Audioquest Diamond Hyperlitz (before the x2), and that, though for the time period was pretty good, had a high end bloom that was very unnatural, almost as if there was too much information there compared to the rest of the spectrum. Should be interesting to see what you think of them and how it reacts in your system.

And that is another thing about greater focus, is that it you can start to get thin sounding if you are not careful. Actually, the I2digital cable is working pretty good in this combination. The X60 is a fuller sounding cable than the MC2 without turning the sound soft or blurry (that seems often the case with fuller sound) but still very solid. I had always noticed a thin top end edge in the system, but was suspecting it was just "digital". Using the X60 showed my how the MC2 was affecting the sound, and was contributing to this effect.
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 4:33 PM Post #5 of 71
Quote:

Originally posted by DarkAngel
AC
Must compliment you on your list of excellent tweaks:
-AM Stealth
-Aurios
-Silver wall outlet
-etc

With these latest IC and AC cord changes I'd say your pursuit of "absolute sound" has reached a new higher level
cool.gif


Thanks DA, people will be suprised at how much isolation devices helps even in a headphone system. K works also makes a isolation device which has had a greater effect than the Stillpoints or the Aurios w/tcb ball, that I use under the transport. The only restriction is that the component has to be big enough to sit on top of it, and since most of my other components are small I am still relying on bearing devices.

Yes, this pursuit has really taught me a lot and my system has had leaps ahead where it use to be.
Right now, I really like the smoother far less digital sounding high end it produces.
Also the sense of vagueness with instruments has dissappeared. It always felt like the sound of them were "floating" like they really weren't present but was just had sound. Now, there is a solid connection to where something is, maybe the effect is that now it is in a sense more 3d. This vagueness is what has always bothered me about listening to headphones, much more so than a speaker system. Really, this is the reason I have been pursuing all these things. Now I am not distracted by this and am finding that it is easier not to pay attention to the system but just listen to the music, which of course, is really what it's all about it.
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 5:47 PM Post #6 of 71
Wow, yet another great coomparison of items there AC1. Great job. Man, now you got me thinking about doing some cable swaps to see what I can find in my system.
smily_headphones1.gif


Keep up the good work and comparisons. REally enjoyable stuff you're putting out.
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 5:58 PM Post #8 of 71
Quote:

Originally posted by pigmode
SIE,
Good idea. I think anyone at the stage of system fine-tuning realy needs to try a good silver IC. My brief experiences with the Omega 2 tells me that silver is the way to go.


Pigmode,

I have heard Vert say that also, so I guess it may be time to see about getting a pair of these Bogdans since they sound pretty good and are silver.


[size=small]AC1,

How do these compare to your VD Nites??[/size]
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 6:16 PM Post #9 of 71
Quote:

Originally posted by ServinginEcuador

AC1,

How do these compare to your VD Nites??[/size]


SIE, thanks.
But unfortunately I do not have VD ICs just the power cord.
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 6:29 PM Post #10 of 71
Quote:

Originally posted by AC1
SIE, thanks.
But unfortunately I do not have VD ICs just the power cord.


Bummer. Oh well, these sound like some pretty serious cables, so who knows. Maybe DarkAngel can report in with some findings before the sale ends.

These are the same cables a lot of us poopoo'd a little while back due to their design and look with that wood in there. To me it sounds like they are quite a bargain at his asking price. Especially considering what you get in return.
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 6:43 PM Post #11 of 71
Great review AC1. I've wondered about them since I saw them on Audiogon a month or so ago.

Pratically, they looked very inflexible from the pictures I saw. How much room do you need behind the rack to install these cables? I'm auditioning the Harmonic Technology Pro-Silway III and I've had to move my equipment 6 inches from the wall to install them and that is barely adequate. The Silver Spirirts look like they need even more space!
 
Jul 5, 2003 at 6:47 PM Post #12 of 71
They actually need very little room, the tube is very flexible but just can not be bent at a sharp angle. The only thing that you would have to deal with is room for the spacers, but if you can angle it right, they would not take that much room either. To me, just short of the Audience AU24, they are the most flexible of any IC I have used.
 
Jul 9, 2003 at 4:37 PM Post #14 of 71
Bumpies
AC have a question for you.........
Did you have to use hair dryer to warm bullet plug to expand so it would fit you RCA connections? And is this also needed when removing BSSR or does is remove easily once it forms to RCA?

MY BSSR arrived and looks like I need to get hair dryer out because too tight to go on my RCAs.........
frown.gif
 
Jul 9, 2003 at 4:56 PM Post #15 of 71
Hi DA,

They were tight on going to the DIO which has Cardas RCAs. I did not end up using a blow dryer but am sure that would help. After they were on for a week and a half, they were much easier to remove and not as hard to put back on. Which was good, since it made switching the BSSR and the SRIIs much easier for the comparison.
 

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