Best sub-$250 over-the-ear headphones with neutral sound signature?
Jul 16, 2020 at 10:23 PM Post #61 of 129


This is still somewhat preliminary (because I need to re-check and verify all my math and plotting), but this is the difference between the AKG K371 and green curve on the above graph, which represents the average of 19 neutral-ish headphone measurements...

AKG K371 DIFFERENCE.jpg


A flat horizontal line would indicate a perfect match to the avg. of 19 HPs on the previous graph.

Instead of plotting the left and right channels separately, I'm now averaging the two channels together to create a single overall difference curve for the headphones, based on Rtings raw FR measurements...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#1671/4011
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#1671/4012

The reason is that I'm not sure how to interpret the discrepancies in amplitude between the two channels on some of Rtings raw FR plots. And don't want to give a false impression one way or another re the L/R balance on my plots. A better gauge for that is probably Rtings compensated FR graph(s)...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#1671/3992

As mentioned earlier in the thread, this headphone did seem a bit brighter on the left channel to me. And there do appear to be some slight differences in amplitude between the two channels on the above Rtings compensated FR plot which could possibly account for some of that. As I've stated before though, I have more hearing loss in my right ear, esp. in the higher frequencies, so all HPs sound a bit brighter or louder to me on the left side than on the right. So if there is an imbalance in the K371's left and right drivers, it may be quite subtle.

Because of my hearing loss though, I will tend to notice even a slight amount of emphasis on the left side, because it will shift the imaging even further to the left than normal. A slight emphasis on the right channel may also have the opposite effect, and make a pair of HPs sound a little better balanced to my ears than one with perfectly matched drivers.

The difference curve shown above in purple is fairly close to how I perceived the K371 in terms of its tonal balance though, when listening to them recently at Guitar Center. They seemed a bit punchy in some spots near the ends of the frequency spectrum (esp. in the treble). And a bit lacking in some warmth and boominess in the mid to upper bass. But otherwise pretty neutral.

This may be splitting hairs, but the main driver resonance in the K371's bass seemed a bit too low in frequency, leaving a little bit of a warm-ness gap between the sub-bass and midrange. And there was a bit too much brightness (and some uneveness) in some spots in the treble, which added a bit too much coloration to the sound in those areas for my taste. Based on the above plot, the brightness was mostly in the 8-10 kHz range, give or take.

There appears to be a little air missing in the upper-most frequencies as well, which might be less noticeable if there was a less pronounced peak at around 8-10k. The transition between the middle of the frequency range and the peak at around 3 kHz could also perhaps be a tad smoother. How much of these things you could actually hear is debatable though. Fwiw, the brightness in the treble, and the slight lack of warmth in the bass were probably the two features that were most apparent to me when I was listening these.
 
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Jul 16, 2020 at 11:13 PM Post #62 of 129
I'll second the 58x. These are the mini Focal Clear lol.
I forgot my best rec:laughing:
Heh...but yeah the HD58X with a bit of curtain in the inner cups vs Sennie’s stock foam actually produces something fairly close to a 600/650 with great subbass qualities.
Here’s the video:
 
Jul 17, 2020 at 1:27 AM Post #63 of 129
^In stock form it’s more like a ZMF Aeolus with a tad poorer bass extension but cleaner mids and treble. I do however vastly prefer the looks of the ZMF:wink:
 
Jul 17, 2020 at 3:00 AM Post #65 of 129
BEYER DT 990 DIFFERENCE.jpg


More graphs... This is the difference between the open-back Beyerdynamic DT-990 Pro and the average of 19 neutral-ish HPs. Haven't had the chance to listen to these recently.

As with the K371, the left and right channels were averaged together into one curve. Original raw response curves...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#329/4011
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#329/4012

Rtings compensated frequency response for comparison...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#329/3992
 
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Jul 18, 2020 at 1:49 PM Post #66 of 129
AT M50X DIFFERENCE.jpg


Difference between the AudioTechnica M50x and the average of 19 neutralish headphone measurements. This also jibes pretty well with my perceptions. The FR response of this headphone is pretty well-balanced overall. But contains some uneveness in spots which give it what I'd describe as a somewhat unnatural sounding timbre. It is also a little heavy-handed in some spots, notably in the upper bass, and in the treble at around 10-11 kHz. But otherwise pretty neutral.

This headphone may also drop some notes in a few spots, at around 315 Hz, 6 kHz, and 14-14.5 kHz...

M50X NOTE DROPS.jpg


Raw Rtings FR plots used to calculate the above graphs...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#295/4011
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#295/4012

Rtings compensated FR plot...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#295/3992

The Rtings compensated graph makes this headphone look considerably darker in the treble than the difference plots above. It does have some darkness in some spots in the treble imo. But probably not as much as the Rtings curve suggests. The Rtings plot also shows the same bright spot though at around 10-11 kHz, and the emphasis in the upper bass.

I did notice both the uneven emphasis in the bass, and some shininess or edginess at times in the treble. The bright spot in the treble on the M50x is over a narrower bandwidth though than the one on the AKG K371 (shown below), so it doesn't add quite as much coloration to the sound as the K371.



If you have the volume cranked up on the M50x though (which is not somethin I'd really recommend), then that +6 dB or so peak at 10-11 kHz may occasionally knock you in the ears.
 
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Jul 19, 2020 at 10:45 PM Post #67 of 129
BEYER DT770 DIFFEREENCE.jpg


Difference between the 250 ohm Beyerdynamic DT-770 and average of 19 neutral-ish headphone measurements. Yes, these are on the bright side in the treble! That comes through as soon as you put them on your noggin. They also appear to have a fairly pronounced notch at around 3.5 kHz, which would add some additional coloration to vocals.

What's less apparent when listening to these is just how exceedingly well-behaved they are in the bass and midrange! Except for the dip at 200 Hz, these HPs are tracking within +/-1 dB of the target curve from 25 Hz to 2.0 kHz!... Wholly neutral responses, Batman! :) That "flatness" in the bass and mids can be a bit hidden though by the prominence in the treble.

Rtings compensated graph for comparison...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#440/3992
 
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Jul 20, 2020 at 3:23 PM Post #68 of 129
AT M40X DIFFERENCE.jpg


More plots (or plot). This is the difference between the AudioTechnica M40x and the average of 19 neutral-ish headphone measurements. This is the average (corrected) response of the right and left channels, like the other difference curves posted above.

Ratings compensated plot for comparison...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#296/3992
 
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Jul 20, 2020 at 3:25 PM Post #69 of 129
I recently bought the k371 as well as the 7510. My impressions are that the k371 has pretty nice and clear highs, at least compared to the 7510, which is a very dark sounding headphone. The soundstage seems better on the k371 too, I think I hear things a bit more cluttered or 2 dimensional on the 7510. The mid range seems a bit lacking on the k371, as if it lacks "body" compared to the 7510. It's hard to say, when A/B'ing phones against each other your brain tricks you into thinking one has what the other lacks.

I used to have the DT770 (600 ohm) but it broke. The bass on these was more noticeable than on these two. I would like to compare them to the ones I got recently, but im not sure how to go about it since Beyerdynamic no longer produces the 600 ohm version of the DT770, so im concerned that I sent it there and they just throw in some regular 250 ohm drivers and not the original 600 ohm that I bought... how could I test that?

I also want to get the HD600 but im not really into open backs. I had the HD650 and had to return it. It was annoyingly smooth and im too used to sound isolation. Soundstage was very wide tho.
 
Jul 21, 2020 at 3:38 PM Post #70 of 129
I recently bought the k371 as well as the 7510. My impressions are that the k371 has pretty nice and clear highs, at least compared to the 7510, which is a very dark sounding headphone. The soundstage seems better on the k371 too, I think I hear things a bit more cluttered or 2 dimensional on the 7510. The mid range seems a bit lacking on the k371, as if it lacks "body" compared to the 7510. It's hard to say, when A/B'ing phones against each other your brain tricks you into thinking one has what the other lacks.

True dat. I've heard some fairly positive things about the Sony 7510, foniak. Haven't been able to find any graphs for them though. And they are not as easy to find as the 7506 and 7520, both of which I believe Guitar Center carries... though they never seem to have em on display so can you can give em a listen before buying. :frowning2:

I used to have the DT770 (600 ohm) but it broke. The bass on these was more noticeable than on these two. I would like to compare them to the ones I got recently, but im not sure how to go about it since Beyerdynamic no longer produces the 600 ohm version of the DT770, so im concerned that I sent it there and they just throw in some regular 250 ohm drivers and not the original 600 ohm that I bought... how could I test that?

Not really an expert on such things. But the only way I can think of is by the volume.

Based on the few phone calls I've had with Beyer, they seem pretty good with their support. I would contact them beforehand, and ask if they still have some replacement 600 ohm drivers for the HPs. If they say yes, then I'd be inclined to take their word on it. I would just make sure that it's clear to them that is what you want, if you send them in for repair.
 
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Jul 21, 2020 at 5:17 PM Post #71 of 129
True dat. I've heard some fairly positive things about the Sony 7510, foniak. Haven't been able to find any graphs for them though. And they are not as easy to find as the 7506 and 7520, both of which I believe Guitar Center carries... though they never seem to have em on display so can you can give em a listen before buying. :frowning2:



Not really an expert on such things. But the only way I can think of is by the volume.

Based on the few phone calls I've had with Beyer, they seem pretty good with their support. I would contact them beforehand, and ask if they still have some replacement 600 ohm drivers for the HPs. If they say yes, then I'd be inclined to take their word on it. I would just make sure that it's clear to them that is what you want, if you send them in for repair.
I cant find the 7520 anywhere in Europe but 7510 easy to find in thoman

I cant really stand the heavy curved cable on the 7510, I wish they did it with a straight shorter cord.
 
Jul 21, 2020 at 6:30 PM Post #72 of 129
I cant find the 7520 anywhere in Europe but 7510 easy to find in thoman

I cant really stand the heavy curved cable on the 7510, I wish they did it with a straight shorter cord.

I am not necessarily suggesting the 7520 btw. Based on Rtings plots, the 7506 appears to a have a more neutral response, though it is a bit U or V-shaped with some emphasis in both the bass and treble. And a bit too rolled off in the HF...

SONY MDR-7506 RAW LEFT & RIGHT:
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#386/4011
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#386/4012

The 7520 appears more uneven and V-shaped, and generally less refined in terms of tonal balance than the 7506...

SONY MDR-7520 RAW LEFT & RIGHT:
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#679/4011
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#679/4012

I will be making a compensated plot of the MDR-7506 because it is still one of the HPs on my short-list. But probably not for the 7520.

I wish I could check out some plots on the 7510 to see how those compare to some of the other HPs here. But they seem to be harder to find in the US.
 
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Jul 27, 2020 at 1:46 PM Post #73 of 129
SENN 280 PRO DIFFERENCE.jpg


Difference between the Sennheiser HD 280 Pro and 19 neutral-ish headphone measurements. Trying out a slightly different format to hopefully make it a little easier to interpret the results. An exact match between the headphone and target would be represented by a straight horizontal line on the difference plot. And as usual, the difference curve above is based on the average of the 280 Pro's left and right channel's raw FR...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#299/4011
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#299/4012

The overall response of the 280 Pro is pretty neutral. It is colored though, fairly significantly, by the uneveness in its response in certain spots. Vocals, in particular, sound rather muffled and recessed due to the depression in the upper midrange around 3 and 4 kHz. And high frequency detail is also significantly reduced above about 12 or 13 kHz.

Since these are closed HPs, some equalization could probably be used fairly effectively to make some improvements in the above response.
 
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Jul 27, 2020 at 5:41 PM Post #74 of 129
It would be a toss up for me between the 7506 and the AT M50x. I had the MDR- V6, and have the M30x and even those are both very good neutral headphones. I think there is a difference between neutral and natural sounding though, and in that regard I think the AT Mx0x line has an advantage, with a more organic presentation.
 
Jul 31, 2020 at 11:58 AM Post #75 of 129
SONY 7506 DIFFERENCE.jpg


Difference between the Sony MDR-7506 and the average of 19 neutral-ish HP measurements. Haven't listened to these recently, so can't really comment in depth on the sound. But they appear to be on the smiley side. So likely better for lower volume listening. HF detail is noticeably reduced above about 11 or 12 kHz. Also, some noticeable spikes and dips in a few spots, but they are fairly narrow in bandwidth.

I would try to even out the response in the treble to improve the accuracy in that area a bit more. Not sure if I'd try to completely flatten out the smile though, since that seems to be this HP's natural signature. Though that might also be doable with an EQ, since these are closed.

Raw FR for the left and right channels...

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#386/4011
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-4/graph#386/4012
 
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