[Barusu Lamperouge]

Any idea about LG India's authorized service centers to downgrade LG G8X from Android 10 to 9 on request? It is related to native DSD playback. Then I will keep one in Android 9, the other on Android 10.

Also any news of Asus ROG 5 supporting native DSD playback?

RoG 5 is an impractical phone if you're not a gamer. Also, if you're buying a phone as a daily driver then you should choose a device that will give you better software support, after-sales service and most importantly ease of use. Music is important but should be a lesser priority.

Many brands like Asus, Xiaomi, Realme, Redmi etc. are known to stall Android security updates and software updates. UX and UI is also sub-par on these phones unless you prefer their bulky skins on top of Android. At the moment, only Samsung and Google provide decent overall support. And if you don't care about all of this but only want a phone which has top of the line specs then go for MI/Redmi phones as they have a splendid custom ROM community which compensates the update lag to a significant extent.

If you want a phone to be used exclusively as a DAP then your G8X is not bad at all. Since the device now has near nonexistent support, I'd suggest just unlock the bootloader and manually side load the update. Or if an software flash tool by LG is available then just download the update and flash it via the tool.

P S. - Generally it is advised that downgrading Android versions has serious repercussions like permanently bricking your device or leading to some hardware issues. If you don't have any experience with Android software flashing then suggest you take help from someone experienced on XDA/TG forum of your device. The risk posted above are applicable to unlocking bootloader as well. Be careful before fiddling with your device software

 

[RishiGuru]

Zenfone 8 is coming to India.That is the only option left for audiophiles aside from ROG 5 which is an oversized phone with sub par structural integrity thus requiring a bulky case to compensate.So far it looks like a competitive phone overall which can hold its own against Samsung S21..We will know for sure within a week..The unveiling is on May 12..

Remains to be seen Asus Zenfone 8 comes with a headphone jack or not. Zenfone 7 never had it.

I think it will use Qualcomm Aqstic audio chip rather than ESS found of ROG 5.

 

[vver]

Remains to be seen Asus Zenfone 8 comes with a headphone jack or not. Zenfone 7 never had it.

I think it will use Qualcomm Aqstic audio chip rather than ESS found of ROG 5.

It has been confirmed it will have a 3.5 mm headphone jack (lots of YouTube videos with hands on review of the ZF 8 confirm this)and an ESS DAC now costs around $10 to implement in a phone partly due to LGs exit is expected and apparently this is cheaper than the license fee charged by Qualcomm to use the Aquistic codec on a SD 888 chip.I can think of no other reason why Asus put this in a gaming phone as the Aquistic codec is more than adequate for most users(The HTC 10 used one and Asus has absorbed a lot of ex HTC employees).Audiophiles present a smaller slice of the smartphone market than people who want a fluorescent green color option for their next phone.

Though the definetive specifics will be out by the end of the month once it is purchased by some members on this and other forums and the SQ reviewed in detail.

 

[RishiGuru]

RoG 5 is an impractical phone if you're not a gamer.

I am not a gamer, hence ROG 5 seems quite impractical to me. I rather go for a more subdued gaming phone like iQOO 7 Legend (just iQOO 7 in China) while having near identical performance and then save some cash.

Music is important but should be a lesser priority.

Depends on end users mindset. For me music is LIFE, I live in it, I breathe in it.

To me analogue audio quality through the phone's audio jack (must have) comes on the top of my priority list. Others may vary.

Many brands like Asus, Xiaomi, Realme, Redmi etc. are known to stall Android security updates and software updates. UX and UI is also sub-par on these phones unless you prefer their bulky skins on top of Android.

Depends on the region. In India, smartphones generally sells at lowest prices in the world due to fiercely competitive smartphone market.

All Chinese smartphone brands does not have sub-par UI. I have used Chinese brands like Huawei, Vivo, Oppo, iQOO, Xiaomi, Meizu, Lenevo, TCL... and some more. Huawei's EMUI is a very mature UI and the best I have seen from any Chinese manufacturer. I quite like it, its fast, fluid & feature rich. Next comes Oppo's ColorOS ... then Vivo and so on. All my Vivo, Oppo & Huawei had two Android version updates and 3 years of security patch updates provided on a bi-monthly basis. I am very satisfied. iQOO is one step higher, it provides monthly FOTA updates like clockwork... maybe the gaming centric nature of my iQOO 3, gamers love latest updates.

But this again this is my choice, others may vary.

At the moment, only Samsung and Google provide decent overall support.

I do not buy Samsung and Google phones due to their ludicrous pricing. We here have so many other options, buying a Samsung does not make sense to me. If you are technically sound you will understand how much profit Samsung is garnering by selling their phones.

Nothing against Samsung, business wise they are doing great. If I was their marketing head, I would follow the same path as they are following now by buying up all reviewers in the world while all praising their phones. In the end business is business, everything is fare until its does not break the law.

And if you don't care about all of this but only want a phone which has top of the line specs then go for MI/Redmi phones as they have a splendid custom ROM community which compensates the update lag to a significant extent.

I am inline with your views. I do have just one phone from Xiaomi, the Poco M2 Pro. Its OK.

If you want a phone to be used exclusively as a DAP then your G8X is not bad at all.

The DAP days are long gone for me. LG's QuadDACs are good enough for my needs. Enough performance & power to drive decent earphones & headphones. Also I have some Vivo's which are right up there with LG in terms of audio fidelity. I alternatively use them as I see fit. Even my gaming oriented iQOO 3 with dedicated inbuilt AKM AK4377A audio chip through headphone jack sounds awesome. But then iQOO is a sub-brand and Vivo, and Vivo ... well they are the pioneers of bringing audio fidelity in smartphones.

Since the device now has near nonexistent support, I'd suggest just unlock the bootloader and manually side load the update. Or if an software flash tool by LG is available then just download the update and flash it via the tool.

My job requires a lot of travelling, hence the most precious metric for me is TIME. I have never been into custom ROMs and when I have time, I will love to flash some old phones of mine.

P S. - Generally it is advised that downgrading Android versions has serious repercussions like permanently bricking your device or leading to some hardware issues. If you don't have any experience with Android software flashing then suggest you take help from someone experienced on XDA/TG forum of your device. The risk posted above are applicable to unlocking bootloader as well.

Thank you for the info. No plans of flashing custom ROMs as of now. I love to keep my phones as manufacturer intended. But then again, its my view and others may vary.

Be careful before fiddling with your device software

Thank you my friend, I will sure visit XDA if I ever consider custom ROMs in the future.

 

[Barusu Lamperouge]

I am not a gamer, hence ROG 5 seems quite impractical to me. I rather go for a more subdued gaming phone like iQOO 7 Legend (just iQOO 7 in China) while having near identical performance and then save some cash.

iQOO is good but beware of the latest Snapdragon 888 chipset it has massive heating problems.

Depends on end users mindset. For me music is LIFE, I live in it, I breathe in it.

Even I love music and probably why all of us here on the forum, but over the years of using devices at various price points, I've learnt one thing, you can get fantastic audio on any smartphone if you have some technical know how. There are many software solutions which push the existing hardware of an Android phone to a limit. Because most smartphone companies barring a few, just slap that Hi-Res logo and some random DAC just as a gimmick. Half of the times they don't even tune them properly. And that's the reason why I said don't focus on audio features as most modern smartphones just don't care for audio performance

To me analogue audio quality through the phone's audio jack (must have) comes on the top of my priority list. Others may vary.

While all of us want to, it's a losing battle. All major smartphone companies are slowly moving away from the audio jack. And it's the bitter truth. Everyone wants to peddle their crappy dongles and TWS earphones

Depends on the region. In India, smartphones generally sells at lowest prices in the world due to fiercely competitive smartphone market.

All Chinese smartphone brands does not have sub-par UI. I have used Chinese brands like Huawei, Vivo, Oppo, iQOO, Xiaomi, Meizu, Lenevo, TCL... and some more. Huawei's EMUI is a very mature UI and the best I have seen from any Chinese manufacturer. I quite like it, its fast, fluid & feature rich. Next comes Oppo's ColorOS ... then Vivo and so on. All my Vivo, Oppo & Huawei had two Android version updates and 3 years of security patch updates provided on a bi-monthly basis. I am very satisfied. iQOO is one step higher, it provides monthly FOTA updates like clockwork... maybe the gaming centric nature of my iQOO 3, gamers love latest updates.

But this again this is my choice, others may vary.

The thing is only thing competitive in Indian market is pricing. And, most of the flagships of Vivo, Oppo and Redmi haven't got their Android 11 updates, Android 12 will launch in a couple of months. And their security patches are almost 5-6 months late. Huawei was good but sadly they're screwed much in India thanks to their beef with multiple agencies.

I do not buy Samsung and Google phones due to their ludicrous pricing. We here have so many other options, buying a Samsung does not make sense to me. If you are technically sound you will understand how much profit Samsung is garnering by selling their phones.

I agree. Users should never buy Samsung's Exynos powered phones. They're plain crap. But Samsung with Snapdragon is a different story altogether. In terms of pure functionality and security, both Samsung and Google are pioneers that can compete with the likes of Apple. I've been using S20 FE5G and it's understandable why these are appreciated. If you notice, most of the smartphones with good hardware at cheaper price points are riddled with ads and bloatware that can't be easily disabled. As far as profits are concerned, Realme and Redmi have larger margins than Samsung as they cut multiple corners on build quality.

Nothing against Samsung, business wise they are doing great. If I was their marketing head, I would follow the same path as they are following now by buying up all reviewers in the world while all praising their phones. In the end business is business, everything is fare until its does not break the law.

Samsung has to bin that crap Exynos processor. There's a reason why they only use that processor in Asia because users are sensitive to price here instead of actual usability of the the device. And one major thing where Samsung has improved massively in recent times is software support. All security patches are deployed within 2-3 days of Pixel phones and Android updates within a couple of months. Not many manufacturers can boast about this. And, timely security patches are very important considering all important data is usually available on smartphones. I use to be a Samsung sceptic but they've turned over a leaf this year by launching Snapdragon variants in India. And most positive Samsung reviews are for Qualcomm variants as opposed to Exynos variants.

The DAP days are long gone for me. LG's QuadDACs are good enough for my needs. Enough performance & power to drive decent earphones & headphones. Also I have some Vivo's which are right up there with LG in terms of audio fidelity. I alternatively use them as I see fit. Even my gaming oriented iQOO 3 with dedicated inbuilt AKM AK4377A audio chip through headphone jack sounds awesome. But then iQOO is a sub-brand and Vivo, and Vivo ... well they are the pioneers of bringing audio fidelity in smartphones.

Sadly, now even Vivo has moved away from that. They too are solely focusing on the pixel wars. The times are changing and we too need to adapt with it, sadly.

My job requires a lot of travelling, hence the most precious metric for me is TIME. I have never been into custom ROMs and when I have time, I will love to flash some old phones of mine.

Yes, I've used custom ROMs for over 10 years but sadly now things are being made difficult by Google thanks to new device attestation mechanism. The level of control and freedom on custom ROMs is unparalleled. Add to that, using a proper OS like Lineage gives industry standard security with superior flexibility. Although, now it's difficult on modern devices and I went for a minimalist Android skin device.

I respect your views even if they're different than mine. But I feel it is important to have a healthy discourse so that others who read this in future can possibly make an informed choice. And the beauty of Android is that it actually enables different strokes for different folks.

 

[Gee Simpson]

Samsung has to bin that crap Exynos processor. There's a reason why they only use that processor in Asia

Still used here in the UK also AFAIK.

 

[Barusu Lamperouge]

Still used here in the UK also AFAIK.

EU and UK mostly get both Snapdragon and Exynos variants. Nowadays even Korea and China in Asia get Snapdragon variants, it's like Exynos is only for those markets where they're sure of bulk sales like India, LatAm and ASEAN.

 

[RishiGuru]

iQOO is good but beware of the latest Snapdragon 888 chipset it has massive heating problems.

After reading your quote, I was worried. However after going through some gaming reviews of iQOO 7 Legend on YouTube, I found the reviewers are praising the device for good thermal management. One guy played 1.5 hours of PUBG and the max recorded temp was around 40 degrees centigrade. Am I missing something?

Even I love music and probably why all of us here on the forum, but over the years of using devices at various price points, I've learnt one thing, you can get fantastic audio on any smartphone if you have some technical know how.

This is largely true for flagship devices. Snapgragon 8XX lineup comes with top-tier dedicated audio chips from their Aqstic lineup. Hardware wise if implemented in high performance/power mode can provide stellar audio quality. My Meizu 16th with SD845 & Aqstic WCD9341 just blew my mind when I first used it with a quality earphone. The WCD9341 has the same analytical sounding nature of ESS QuadDAC. What is missing though is driving power of QuadDAC when it comes to large over the ear headphones.

Because most smartphone companies barring a few, just slap that Hi-Res logo and some random DAC just as a gimmick. Half of the times they don't even tune them properly. And that's the reason why I said don't focus on audio features as most modern smartphones just don't care for audio performance.

Same feelings here, I completely agree. Great audio quality in smartphones comes from two aspects:

1) How the DAC is implemented on the hardware level. Do the DAC have dedicated power lines drawn straight from the power management ICs and implemented in max power mode. Is so then we will see the full potential. Next is the audio topology and components quality like capacitors, resistors used with the DAC. Are they audio grade? Lastly proper electromagnetic shielding used to mask the analogue paths emanated on the final stage output the DAC.

I once saw some detailed pictures of my Meizu 16th teardown and complete component analysis in a Chinese publication. I was pleasantly surprised that Meizu went to great lengths in the hardware level to keep the audio quality intact. Separate electromagnetic shielding for WCD9341 to minimize any digital interference, dedicated power lines, high grade components. They took max performance from WCD9341 and delivered to the audio jack port. But that was expected of Meizu, knowing their portable music player background. People their know audio.

2) Second is the software aspect. Like a player of UAPP's caliber and what is does when it detects the inbuilt DAC. UAPP will immediately recognize the WCD9341 on my Meizu 16th and provide default settings accordingly.

And, most of the flagships of Vivo, Oppo and Redmi haven't got their Android 11 updates, Android 12 will launch in a couple of months. And their security patches are almost 5-6 months late.

I digress. My iQOO 3 (Vivo's sub brand) received Android 11 on 15th Jan, 2021. The same phone is on Apr, 2021 security patch s of now. My 2018, Vivo NEX S is running Mar, 2021 security patch. My $150 Oppo F7 is running on Mar, 2021 security patch.

Huawei was good but sadly they're screwed much in India thanks to their beef with multiple agencies.

Never knew that. What was the issue?

I have a Honor 9X Pro (Global version) with Kirin 810 with an Android devoid of GMS, due to US ban on Huawei. That's a seriously powerful device, near SD845 level. Great hardware with polished EMUI over Android 9, zero ads just for $170. It has the best built quality within $250 bracket according to me. I love that phone just because it is different. I am using Microsoft cloud ecosystem over their and surprisingly for a Google nut like me, it is as good if not better than Google cloud.

Samsung has to bin that crap Exynos processor. There's a reason why they only use that processor in Asia because users are sensitive to price here instead of actual usability of the the device.

So true. Samsung does not want to budge profit margin here, so we get crappy Exynos processors. And their marketing power just keeps all normal users brain washed. This is the reason why I never buy $1000 crappy Exynos based Samsung flagships. Pure waste of money.

I've been using S20 FE5G and it's understandable why these are appreciated. If you notice, most of the smartphones with good hardware at cheaper price points are riddled with ads and bloatware that can't be easily disabled.

I have a different perspective. When you buy a Samsung flagship grade phone like your S20 FE 5G, you are paying two times that of an equivalent Chinese flagship product with same specs. So it's like you have subscribed to a premium subscription, you paid more upfront, your getting better services in terms of prolonged & quick software support. Zero Ads.

In the end Samsung is not giving anything from its pocket. It is upto the end users to choose the type of subscription he/ she wants to go for. Form me I rather have two phones for a price of one Samsung/ Google and be happy to receive latest Android updates and security patches two months late. Others may differ.

We may rant about the ads in the Chinese UIs, but look at the amount of hardware they are providing for the money. So again its end users choice. And I also find the Samsung budget phones from M & F series are no good and and very poor software update policy.

All manufacturers take special care for their flagship lineup, be it South Korean or Chinese. So the frequency of latest software update and the amount of bloatware for your Samsung S20 FE 5G & Samsung M21 can never be the same as they are different subscription policies.

 

[Gee Simpson]

EU and UK mostly get both Snapdragon and Exynos variants. Nowadays even Korea and China in Asia get Snapdragon variants, it's like Exynos is only for those markets where they're sure of bulk sales like India, LatAm and ASEAN.

Where are Exynos variants available to buy in the UK? I'm most likely going to pick the upcoming Sony Xperia 1 III for my next flagship phone anyway. I'm currently still using my Samsung S7 Edge atm.

 

[wolfxomg]

-snip-

Thank you for the info. No plans of flashing custom ROMs as of now. I love to keep my phones as manufacturer intended. But then again, its my view and others may vary.



Thank you my friend, I will sure visit XDA if I ever consider custom ROMs in the future.

For Sonic performance I would advice only running Stock OS, unless the developers figured out a way to use the Internal Audio HW in the phone, the only few phones that I know which were able to utilize were - SGS i9000 the first Samsung Galaxy S, I still have it, it has a Wolfson WM8994 DAC AMP and the Supercurio xda dev unlocked its potential with his Voodoo Sound Control (HW EQ, AMP control, Bypass all audio through DAC, Analog Volume control etc). It's a solid phone, mine uses an SD card of 200GB with ease, It's running a very old Custom ROM, I wanted it to flash to KitKat since it's faster, unfortunately I have some memories with the OS and Phone so I didn't fiddle.

Then there's SGS II with Yamaha "Yamahell" DAC which was garbage due to it's AMP vs Wolfson, still it got some dev help, Supercurio again. With SGSIII Gokanmoral implemented some Audio functionality into the Kernels like SGS and SGS II, it also has a Wolfson.

Rest is history, I didn't see any phone later on from Samsung using a solid DAC/AMP Hardware. SGS 5 had solid HW but it cannot touch these old ones, I forgot to mention Samsung Galaxy Nexus, it also has the Audio enhancement by Ezekeel developer with High Performance Audio (not superior to SGS) on the OMAP 4400 SoC processor. then we had LG, I had my only experience with LG with their V30, was even able to understand to fundamentals on how their Automatic DAC Headphone AMP works and has no audible advantage when people use those Adapters since it only increases the Headphone output voltage resulting in high distortion and may break the Transducers for those IEMs only IEM which can handle from my knowledge would be the Final Audio E5000. LG did an excellent job on the Auto Impedance detection in the phone itself. Simply superb solution, not breaking IEMs or blowing Ears with that fantastic distortion free superb ESS implementation not only on Audio Playback but even Recording in app and Video recording too !!

And that phone with Custom ROM cannot use all the HW DAC features of the ESS 9218P chip. Like Impulse response filters, DSP like DTS X and EQ plus others. So avoid using Custom ROMs on the Audio dedicated phones, I don't think anyone can unlock ESS Software functionality exposed to end user on these phones.

TL;DR - Stock + UAPP is endgame.

That said, LG phone or whatever DAP type phone you have, use Android 9 as long as you can. Android 10 brings bs Scoped Storage trash which ruins the whole fundamental aspect of Android filesystem control by end users+devs and performance regressions. I'm running stock Android 8 ROM but Bootloader Unlocked with TWRP on my V30S since Day 1 and was happy and still happy for 2.5years. If your G8X has a Bootloader unlock (I think it should have since It will be EU/Asia version LG screwed up the damn Bootloader unlocks when their mobile business CEOs changed) enjoy the Superuser access. It's going to die soon, Android 11 and 12 have even more bs problems with UX and they have horrible API regressions, I lost count at this point. Everything has to be downgraded and catered to the lowest possible denominator because money is the only damn thing that matters, Google is lost in their vision and execution all they care is now politics and controlling users, just like Apple. Sorry for the OT, I'm just disappointed by these stupid trends. I forgot to mention without any OS updates you won't lose any functionality since Android is designed to work with Backcompat and have solid API support Google is forced to do that, which is why most of the apps on PlayStore work with 4.4 too until recently it's 5.0 Lollipop. Fearmongering of the Security updates is a lost cause, look at latest Qcomm exploit, it will happen and can be hacked. But the key part is you must know what you are running, have been running Rooted/Custom kernel/ROMs since Android 2.2 Froyo.

I don't care about these trends now, moved onto a Desktop setup and use my iPod with Wolfson 87588G which is superior to many devices, only one which can beat that is my LG's ESS which has surprisingly excellent Sub Bass reproduction and crystal clear mind range performance from my experience. That Qcomm Aqstic on Note 8 SD835 which I heard was utter garbage. Hollow sounding generic waste, I doubt Qcomm has any focus on them, they are selling those AptX and AptXHD and their Qcomm TWS solutions on Wireless, so that generic one will stay even on SD888, that's my guess. A shame that Sony is now making all those damn videos on everything including Sound but couldn't put their own in house superior S-Master HX DAC AMP in the Xperia 1 Mark III, all that audio talk is waste, since it's using Aqstic and a bunch of software DSPs like 360Reality Audio DSEE upscaler and others which are absolutely nothing compared to even my 14year old iPod running Rockbox with Parametric EQ.

 

[Barusu Lamperouge]

After reading your quote, I was worried. However after going through some gaming reviews of iQOO 7 Legend on YouTube, I found the reviewers are praising the device for good thermal management. One guy played 1.5 hours of PUBG and the max recorded temp was around 40 degrees centigrade. Am I missing something?

Suggest you read more about 888's issues here - https://amp.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/l0zqrz/notebookcheck_a_xiaomi_mi_11_vs_iqoo_7/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.androidauthority.com/qualcomm-snapdragon-888-1179156/amp/

I digress. My iQOO 3 (Vivo's sub brand) received Android 11 on 15th Jan, 2021. The same phone is on Apr, 2021 security patch s of now. My 2018, Vivo NEX S is running Mar, 2021 security patch. My $150 Oppo F7 is running on Mar, 2021 security patch.

OnePlus, Oppo, Vivo, Realme, Iqoo are part of the same company, BBK. And all of them have different update cycles and promises, like OnePlus used to provide quick and prolonged support to their devices but now they've started slacking and their UI is Samsung's One UI 2.0 Oppo is notorious for not even giving security updates forget Android updates. Ditto for Vivo. Iqoo being a new company to take on Mi's Poco is promising frequent software support which Poco/Redmi/MI doesn't and that's why you got the updates in the first place. This is what OnePlus did before launching too many devices a year and just slacking off on updates. Oppo F7 btw is on Feb security patch and not March. The reason for getting timely security updates is that there are security vulnerabilities exposed on Android and in order to protect users data and privacy these OEMs give security updates and OS updates on the whole.

Never knew that. What was the issue?

I have a Honor 9X Pro (Global version) with Kirin 810 with an Android devoid of GMS, due to US ban on Huawei. That's a seriously powerful device, near SD845 level. Great hardware with polished EMUI over Android 9, zero ads for just for $170. It has the best built quality within $250 bracket according to me. I love that phone just because it is different. I am using Microsoft cloud ecosystem over their at surprisingly for a Google nut like me, it is as good if not better than Google cloud.

Losing GMS was major dampener for most folks without GMS Android is nothing. Although I'd differ on this personally as I'd like to use MicroG as Google alternative. But that's not what majority of consumers prefer. And the overall Indo-China clash led to negative PR for them. Xiaomi and BBK companies harped on Made in India PR and retained their faithful consumers. OneDrive is good but users prefer Google as GCS is so seamless on your Android phones that you don't even notice it is there.

So true. Samsung does not want to budge profit margin here, so we get crappy Exynos processors. And their marketing power just keeps all normal users brain washed. This is the reason why I never buy $1000 crappy Exynos based Samsung flagships. Pure waste of money.

Totally agree with you here. Can't even pay a dime to them for that crappy processor. Although, Exynos 2100 is marginally better than Snapdragon 888 in real life usage. The irony.

I have a different perspective. When you buy a Samsung flagship grade phone like your S20 FE 5G, you are paying two times that of an equivalent Chinese flagship product with same specs. So it's like you have subscribed to a premium subscription, you paid more upfront, your getting better services in terms of prolonged & quick software support.

In the end Samsung giving anything from its pocket. It is upto the end users to choose the type of subscription he/ she wants to go for. Form me I rather have two phones for a price of one Samsung/ Google and be happy to receive latest Android updates and security patches two months late. Others may differ.

Well, for once Samsung has given superb value for money with S20 FE 5G. Snapdragon 865 is most stable and powerful processor in the Snapdragon lineup as of now and it will continue to stay so till at least September when Snapdragon launches 888+ to fix all the clunks of 888. SD870 is nothing but a rebrand of 865 with just one core being boosted.

If you are looking for a flagship experience for a device at 40-50k price point, then S20 FE 5G is nigh impossible to beat as it is a superior device in terms of performance and usability. They for once have undercut everyone including OnePlus, Vivo, Oppo, Mi and their own mid-range lineup. As users aren't that keen on buying Snapdragon 888/870. And with their cashbacks and buybacks, you get a truly flagship device at approx 30-35k. Why would one then go for a Chinese device? Also, most won't go for multiple devices.

We may rant about the ads in the Chinese UIs, but look at the amount of hardware they are providing for the money. So again its end users choice. And I also find the Samsung budget phones from M & F series are no good and and very poor software update policy.

The thing is Chinese OEMs are throttling that top of the line hardware with their software. It's like despite paying for the hardware you are still gasping for performance. I have used Micromax (their phones are Chinese rebrands), Redmi, Realme, OP and Vivo devices of which the only one which gives clean performance is OP. You can feel the power of the hardware packed under the hood. Also, the reason why most of these OEMs have the most active independent software development as these devices start suffering within a year or so, if you are a power user.

All manufacturers have take special care for their flagship lineup, so the frequency on latest update for your Samsung S20 FE 5G & Samsung M21 can never be the same as they are different subscription policies.

Yes. But at times, one has to be cognizant about the market as it is changing very rapidly.

 

[Barusu Lamperouge]

Where are Exynos variants available to buy in the UK? I'm most likely going to pick the upcoming Sony Xperia 1 III for my next flagship phone anyway. I'm currently still using my Samsung S7 Edge atm.

IMO Xperia 1 III is a better device than an Exynos processor powered Samsung. Although Samsung's official website should have one for sure. You should check with them.

 

[RishiGuru]

For Sonic performance I would advice only running Stock OS, unless the developers figured out a way to use the Internal Audio HW in the phone, the only few phones that I know which were able to utilize were - SGS i9000 the first Samsung Galaxy S, I still have it, it has a Wolfson WM8994 DAC AMP and the Supercurio xda dev unlocked its potential with his Voodoo Sound Control (HW EQ, AMP control, Bypass all audio through DAC, Analog Volume control etc). It's a solid phone, mine uses an SD card of 200GB with ease, It's running a very old Custom ROM, I wanted it to flash to KitKat since it's faster, unfortunately I have some memories with the OS and Phone so I didn't fiddle.

Then there's SGS II with Yamaha "Yamahell" DAC which was garbage due to it's AMP vs Wolfson, still it got some dev help, Supercurio again. With SGSIII Gokanmoral implemented some Audio functionality into the Kernels like SGS and SGS II, it also has a Wolfson.

Rest is history, I didn't see any phone later on from Samsung using a solid DAC/AMP Hardware. SGS 5 had solid HW but it cannot touch these old ones, I forgot to mention Samsung Galaxy Nexus, it also has the Audio enhancement by Ezekeel developer with High Performance Audio (not superior to SGS) on the OMAP 4400 SoC processor. then we had LG, I had my only experience with LG with their V30, was even able to understand to fundamentals on how their Automatic DAC Headphone AMP works and has no audible advantage when people use those Adapters since it only increases the Headphone output voltage resulting in high distortion and may break the Transducers for those IEMs only IEM which can handle from my knowledge would be the Final Audio E5000. LG did an excellent job on the Auto Impedance detection in the phone itself. Simply superb solution, not breaking IEMs or blowing Ears with that fantastic distortion free superb ESS implementation not only on Audio Playback but even Recording in app and Video recording too !!

And that phone with Custom ROM cannot use all the HW DAC features of the ESS 9218P chip. Like Impulse response filters, DSP like DTS X and EQ plus others. So avoid using Custom ROMs on the Audio dedicated phones, I don't think anyone can unlock ESS Software functionality exposed to end user on these phones.

TL;DR - Stock + UAPP is endgame.

That said, LG phone or whatever DAP type phone you have, use Android 9 as long as you can. Android 10 brings bs Scoped Storage trash which ruins the whole fundamental aspect of Android filesystem control by end users+devs and performance regressions. I'm running stock Android 8 ROM but Bootloader Unlocked with TWRP on my V30S since Day 1 and was happy and still happy for 2.5years. If your G8X has a Bootloader unlock (I think it should have since It will be EU/Asia version LG screwed up the damn Bootloader unlocks when their mobile business CEOs changed) enjoy the Superuser access. It's going to die soon, Android 11 and 12 have even more bs problems with UX and they have horrible API regressions, I lost count at this point. Everything has to be downgraded and catered to the lowest possible denominator because money is the only damn thing that matters, Google is lost in their vision and execution all they care is now politics and controlling users, just like Apple. Sorry for the OT, I'm just disappointed by these stupid trends. I forgot to mention without any OS updates you won't lose any functionality since Android is designed to work with Backcompat and have solid API support Google is forced to do that, which is why most of the apps on PlayStore work with 4.4 too until recently it's 5.0 Lollipop. Fearmongering of the Security updates is a lost cause, look at latest Qcomm exploit, it will happen and can be hacked. But the key part is you must know what you are running, have been running Rooted/Custom kernel/ROMs since Android 2.2 Froyo.

I don't care about these trends now, moved onto a Desktop setup and use my iPod with Wolfson 87588G which is superior to many devices, only one which can beat that is my LG's ESS which has surprisingly excellent Sub Bass reproduction and crystal clear mind range performance from my experience. That Qcomm Aqstic on Note 8 SD835 which I heard was utter garbage. Hollow sounding generic waste, I doubt Qcomm has any focus on them, they are selling those AptX and AptXHD and their Qcomm TWS solutions on Wireless, so that generic one will stay even on SD888, that's my guess. A shame that Sony is now making all those damn videos on everything including Sound but couldn't put their own in house superior S-Master HX DAC AMP in the Xperia 1 Mark III, all that audio talk is waste, since it's using Aqstic and a bunch of software DSPs like 360Reality Audio DSEE upscaler and others which are absolutely nothing compared to even my 14year old iPod running Rockbox with Parametric EQ.

Very informative post. Thank you.

 

[Gee Simpson]

IMO Xperia 1 III is a better device than an Exynos processor powered Samsung. Although Samsung's official website should have one for sure. You should check with them.

I'm hoping the Xperia 1 III has good audio, it's between that and the S21 Ultra for my next phone. I would probably purchase a FiiO BTR5 to use with the Samsung, I'm hoping the Sony is good enough without the need for a DAC/Amp.

 

[Barusu Lamperouge]

I'm hoping the Xperia 1 III has good audio, it's between that and the S21 Ultra for my next phone. I would probably purchase a FiiO BTR5 to use with the Samsung, I'm hoping the Sony is good enough without the need for a DAC/Amp.

Tbh, BTR5+any smartphone will be unbeatable. For that matter, any modern smartphone with a DAC or a DAC dongle will blow away a standalone smartphone even if it's a Sony. BTR5 is TOTL level of performance when it comes to portable audio with super convenience.

Their promo video on YT suggest that Sony won't have any dedicated DAC will simply use the Snapdragon's existing DAC with a 3.5mm jack. They're using 360° audio and DSEE Ultimate to power their audio experience, honestly that's not much different than what Samsung does with Dolby Atmos. But Sony has 3.5mm jack which Samsung doesn't have. And in terms of overall package+experience, both Samsung and Sony are top draw. You won't be disappointed if you choose either of them and yes, BTR5 will complement either of them.